Congrats to the LVs for turning around their season

[madtownvol]

With fear and trepidation, I returned to this board. Like death and taxes, the usual posters are posting in accord with their usual MO. And I suppose that tendency will also hold true for myself as well.

Let's start with a little history; NO ONE on this board (myself included) envisioned the LVs making a deep tournament run after the LSU and Alabama debacles. There was legitimate reason to question if the LVs might even make the tourney. The wheels had seemingly come off the wagon; people were speculating that the LVs were rife with internal conflict and that everyone (or just about) was going to transfer.

Then LVs played very well in the SEC tournament and I think lost more to fatigue than MSU. Next, they beat a tenacious UW-Greenbay; then much higher ranked opponents in ASU and OSU (looking quite dominant against the latter).

Then comes Syracuse.

First off, Syracuse is in a major tournament groove who had upset Dawn Staley' mighty Gamecocks. The point is that we were not playing a cupcake but a team very capable of beating a post-oriented team (with the LVs being a less proficient version of USC).

Second, the injuries did make a difference. I am not sure that Reynolds would have turned the outcome (in fact I doubt it) but I do think she would have helped prevent the total meltdown and reduced the overall number of turnovers. Per poor overwhelmed Te'a, the cliche is that when you March you are not longer a freshman but she looked every bit of an inexperience point guard. And no real shame to her; Syracuse played some of the best pressure defense that the LVs have faced all season.

I can't fault Carter too much; trying to beat a ferocious press with a broken finger is not an easy task. And similarly for Graves, fighting in the post with a broken finger is again, a gutsy but ultimately doomed endeavor. She had one helluva of LV career and it is sad she did not make a final four, but it sure was not due to a lack of effort or grit on her part.

But, here is the reality. It is hard to beat a team that has gone into a Golden State Warriors mode. Syracuse was hitting threes from way deep and with LVs in their faces (including a few over Mercedes).

When Syracuse envisions their game plan, hitting close to 50 on 3's is pretty much ideal and that would be a game they would expect to win. Once they got the LVs completely spread out in quarters 3 and 4, then they killed us with penetration.

They were just the better team on the night. I am not sure there was any specific coaching changes that Holly could have made in this game with this set of injuries. When she put in Moore and Jackson, I could see the rationale, get longer, more athletic players to harass the outside shooters; but Syracuse kept hitting the dagger shots. What can you do?

If the LVs had better perimeter shooting, they might have been able to stay in the game but that deficiency has been a season long problem (not one that you can suddenly change for the elite 8 game).

A big bright spot is the way that Diamond played over the entire tournament; if she picks up where she left off, next season, then that is a reason for excitement.

So, people can whine about the "decline", call Holly "Dooley" (a completely irrelevant comparison); pursue the most ridiculous, delusional strategy for being named head coach and all kinds of other rhetorical moves. Enjoy whatever makes you feel better!

I just hope that the LVs can find a decent junior college post to back-up Mercedes next season and most of all that the rest of the team works their butts off to improve on their respective weaknesses.

This could be a very good team next year. Looking forward to it and again congrats LVs for an unexpected and very enjoyable tournament run.

 

[cwbytruckers]

If the team had truly turned it around they wouldnt have reverted back to the same team that lost to LSU and Alabama and their coach wouldnt have looked like a deer in the head lights all second half yesterday. But i sure do need to get me some orange colored glasses.

 

[cwbytruckers]

For this team to get better the coach needs to get better. And after four years she hasnt improved or changed her bad habits. So it isnt going to happen next year either.

 

[madtownvol]

If the team had truly turned it around they wouldnt have reverted back to the same team that lost to LSU and Alabama and their coach wouldnt have looked like a deer in the head lights all second half yesterday. But i sure do need to get me some orange colored glasses.

Yes, any thread that does not bash Holly incessantly ( and perhaps using multiple threads to make the same point), just in case anyone missed it, is definitely wearing orange colored glasses.

For the record, I did not say that Holly was the second coming of John Wooden. I said for a team that appeared to implode, they pulled it together to go deeper than Notre Dame or USC for example, which no one saw coming.

I am afraid that objectively, Syracuse is playing a far superior game to Bama or LSU and so the LVs did not revert back to that level of play. In fact, the effort they gave last night would have crushed either.

Sometimes teams just get outplayed. When the opponent is raining threes from 10 ft beyond the arc with a 6-6 player in the shooters face, maybe its just not your night. As I said, the LVs needed to be able to do more damage from the 3-pt. line to pull Syracuse out of their suffocating zone. But, the LVs have not been a good outside shooting team (and that can go on the coach) and that deficiency proved fatal last night.

 

[cwbytruckers]

Holly got out coached. Period because she doesnt make in game adjustments. Or doesnt know how. When our guards were playing out of control. She didnt call a timeout to settle them down. She never got in their face. When the 5'8 guard for Syracuse was driving the lane with success. No adjustment. But you keep thinking this team got better. They didnt. They barely beat Green Bay. They were a well coached team. Arizona State was a good team but we made shots and had more athletes. Ohio State beat themselves by no playing zone against us. And Syracuse showed everyone in the country how to beat us next year. I fear another 14 losses next year.

 

[Nute Gunray]

With fear and trepidation, I returned to this board. Like death and taxes, the usual posters are posting in accord with their usual MO. And I suppose that tendency will also hold true for myself as well.

Let's start with a little history; NO ONE on this board (myself included) envisioned the LVs making a deep tournament run after the LSU and Alabama debacles. There was legitimate reason to question if the LVs might even make the tourney. The wheels had seemingly come off the wagon; people were speculating that the LVs were rife with internal conflict and that everyone (or just about) was going to transfer.

Then LVs played very well in the SEC tournament and I think lost more to fatique than MSU. Next, they beat a tenacious UW-Greenbay; then much higher ranked opponents in ASU and OSU (looking quite dominant against the latter).

Then comes Syracuse.

First off, Syracuse is in a major tournament groove who had upset Dawn Staley' mighty Gamecocks. The point is that we were not playing a cupcake but a team very capable of beating a post-oriented team (with the LVs being a less proficient version of USC).

Second, the injuries did make a difference. I am not sure that Reynolds would have turned the outcome (in fact I doubt it) but I do think she would have helped prevent the total meltdown and reduced the overall number of turnovers. Per poor overwhelmed Te'a, the cliche is that when you March you are not longer a freshman but she looked every bit of an inexperience point guard. And no real shame to her; Syracuse played some of the best pressure defense that the LVs have faced all season.

I can't fault Carter too much; trying to beat a ferocious press with a broken finger is not an easy task. And similarly for Graves, fighting in the post with a broken finger is again, a gutsy but ultimately doomed endeavor. She had one helluva of LV career and it is sad she did not make a final four, but it sure was not due to a lack of effort or grit on her part.

But, here is the reality. It is hard to beat a team that has gone into a Golden State Warriors mode. Syracuse was hitting threes from way deep and with LVs in their faces (including a few over Mercedes).

When Syracuse looks at their game plan, hitting close to 50 on 3's is pretty much ideal and that would be a game they would expect to win. Once they got the Lvs completely spread out in quarters 3 and 4, then they killed us with penetration.

They were just the better team on the night. I am not sure there was any specific coaching changes that Holly could have made in this game with this set of injuries. When she put in Moore and Jackson, I could see the rationale, get longer, more athletic players to harass the outside shooters; but Syracuse kept hitting the dagger shots. What can you do?

If the LVs had better perimeter shooting, they might have been able to stay in the game but that deficiency has been a season long problem (not one that you can suddenly change for the elite 8 game).

A big bright spot is the way that Diamond played over the entire tournament; if she picks up where she left off, next season, then that is a reason for excitement.

So, people can whine about the "decline", call Holly "Dooley" (a completely irrelevant comparison); pursue the most ridiculous, delusional strategy for being named head coach and all kinds of other rhetorical moves. Enjoy whatever makes you feel better!

I just hope that the LVs can find a decent junior college post to back-up Mercedes next season and most of all that the rest of the team works their butts off to improve on their respective weaknesses.

This could be a very good team next year. Looking forward to it and again congrats LVs for an unexpected and very enjoyable tournament run.

This is a fair and realistic assessment of what happened in the Syracuse loss, madtownvol. Also, you are 100% accurate on what LVs need to do to improve for next season. I believe truly that if they do as you suggest than a 27-2 won-loss record is not out of the question.

 

[cwbytruckers]

This is a fair and realistic assessment of what happened in the Syracuse loss, madtownvol. Also, you are 100% accurate on what LVs need to do to improve for next season. I believe truly that if they do as you suggest than a 27-2 won-loss record is not out of the question.

2 losses with this roster. ROFL

 

[Nute Gunray]

2 losses with this roster. ROFL

Absolutely, cwbytruckers! Next year's record could be 27-2 or 26-3. Do you think Muffet (ND) or Kim (Baylor) or Tara (Stanford) or Dawn (SC) would have 14 losses with this team? Not to mention Geno(UCONN). The LVs could contend for a final four slot with improved coaching from Holly and her staff.

 

[T-TownVol]

Absolutely, cwbytruckers! Next year's record could be 27-2 or 26-3. Do you think Muffet (ND) or Kim (Baylor) or Tara (Stanford) or Dawn (SC) would have 14 losses with this team? Not to mention Geno(UCONN). The LVs could contend for a final four slot with improved coaching from Holly and her staff.

Here....right here is the "rub"

 

[madtownvol]

Holly got out coached. Period because she doesnt make in game adjustments. Or doesnt know how. When our guards were playing out of control. She didnt call a timeout to settle them down. She never got in their face. When the 5'8 guard for Syracuse was driving the lane with success. No adjustment. But you keep thinking this team got better. They didnt. They barely beat Green Bay. They were a well coached team. Arizona State was a good team but we made shots and had more athletes. Ohio State beat themselves by no playing zone against us. And Syracuse showed everyone in the country how to beat us next year. I fear another 14 losses next year.

Let's separate the season from this game. Holly did make adjustments; after the half-time break; she had her guards really push on the three point line and that is why the Syracuse guards starting getting to the rim. Now, all season, the Lvs have been substandard are stopping penetration and keeping quick guards in front of them. That is a defensive deficiency that you can put on the coaching staff (and it is so basic that it is a baffling problem to not at least improve on when you have a team of good athletes).

Whether it was trying to shoot Syracuse out of their zone; pressure to get points in transition, crowd the 3pt shooters, the strategy could not be implemented. The fault with holly and company is not that she did not know what to do but that she did not have her team ready to do what needed to be done under pressure.

 

[alexvol]

Good for you for posting with your usual mo.As for me I am going to root for Lady Vols until I croak ....that fandom has extended from 1977.But my expectations have been vastly downgraded.No longer will I expect to win 20 games per season.No longer will I expect to make the NCAA tourney.....I will consider it to be a good year if they are selected for the tournament.No longer do I expect top recruits to sign with Tennessee.In sum ,the glory years are over and until and unless they have a change of head coaches ....someone who can inspire,someone who can recruit,someone who knows x's and o's on both ends of the court and can impart that to the players and can actually develop them during their time at Tennessee,the program will continue to decline.
Now if you want to place me in category of usual MO in posting that is okay by me because I just do not share the opinion that Holly is the right person to lead this team out of the wilderness that she has led the team into ....she is lost and at sea .
I do not believe that a change of head coaches will take place therefore the downward spiral of the program will increase.But,as I said above I will continue my support of Lady Vols until I croak.

 

[cwbytruckers]

Let's separate the season from this game. Holly did make adjustments; after the half-time break; she had her guards really push on the three point line and that is why the Syracuse guards starting getting to the rim. Now, all season, the Lvs have been substandard are stopping penetration and keeping quick guards in front of them. That is a defensive deficiency that you can put on the coaching staff (and it is so basic that it is a baffling problem to not at least improve on when you have a team of good athletes).

Whether it was trying to shoot Syracuse out of their zone; pressure to get points in transition, crowd the 3pt shooters, the strategy could not be implemented. The fault with holly and company is not that she did not know what to do but that she did not have her team ready to do what needed to be done under pressure.

Didn't realize you were in the huddle

 

[madtownvol]

Didn't realize you were in the huddle

Really? You think someone has to be in the team huddle to recognize an obvious change in the defensive set.

Obviously, you were aiming for a snappy face-saving retort in that comment. Like the LVs defending against the three, it did not work out very well. It must be your coaches fault.

 

[LadyVol1908]

With fear and trepidation, I returned to this board. Like death and taxes, the usual posters are posting in accord with their usual MO. And I suppose that tendency will also hold true for myself as well.

Let's start with a little history; NO ONE on this board (myself included) envisioned the LVs making a deep tournament run after the LSU and Alabama debacles. There was legitimate reason to question if the LVs might even make the tourney. The wheels had seemingly come off the wagon; people were speculating that the LVs were rife with internal conflict and that everyone (or just about) was going to transfer.

Then LVs played very well in the SEC tournament and I think lost more to fatigue than MSU. Next, they beat a tenacious UW-Greenbay; then much higher ranked opponents in ASU and OSU (looking quite dominant against the latter).

Then comes Syracuse.

First off, Syracuse is in a major tournament groove who had upset Dawn Staley' mighty Gamecocks. The point is that we were not playing a cupcake but a team very capable of beating a post-oriented team (with the LVs being a less proficient version of USC).

Second, the injuries did make a difference. I am not sure that Reynolds would have turned the outcome (in fact I doubt it) but I do think she would have helped prevent the total meltdown and reduced the overall number of turnovers. Per poor overwhelmed Te'a, the cliche is that when you March you are not longer a freshman but she looked every bit of an inexperience point guard. And no real shame to her; Syracuse played some of the best pressure defense that the LVs have faced all season.

I can't fault Carter too much; trying to beat a ferocious press with a broken finger is not an easy task. And similarly for Graves, fighting in the post with a broken finger is again, a gutsy but ultimately doomed endeavor. She had one helluva of LV career and it is sad she did not make a final four, but it sure was not due to a lack of effort or grit on her part.

But, here is the reality. It is hard to beat a team that has gone into a Golden State Warriors mode. Syracuse was hitting threes from way deep and with LVs in their faces (including a few over Mercedes).

When Syracuse envisions their game plan, hitting close to 50 on 3's is pretty much ideal and that would be a game they would expect to win. Once they got the LVs completely spread out in quarters 3 and 4, then they killed us with penetration.

They were just the better team on the night. I am not sure there was any specific coaching changes that Holly could have made in this game with this set of injuries. When she put in Moore and Jackson, I could see the rationale, get longer, more athletic players to harass the outside shooters; but Syracuse kept hitting the dagger shots. What can you do?

If the LVs had better perimeter shooting, they might have been able to stay in the game but that deficiency has been a season long problem (not one that you can suddenly change for the elite 8 game).

A big bright spot is the way that Diamond played over the entire tournament; if she picks up where she left off, next season, then that is a reason for excitement.

So, people can whine about the "decline", call Holly "Dooley" (a completely irrelevant comparison); pursue the most ridiculous, delusional strategy for being named head coach and all kinds of other rhetorical moves. Enjoy whatever makes you feel better!

I just hope that the LVs can find a decent junior college post to back-up Mercedes next season and most of all that the rest of the team works their butts off to improve on their respective weaknesses.

This could be a very good team next year. Looking forward to it and again congrats LVs for an unexpected and very enjoyable tournament run.

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 x's 2000000000000000000!

You get the picture!!!

 

[cwbytruckers]

Obviously this is the related to Holly fans forum.

 

[madtownvol]

Obviously this is the related to Holly fans forum.

Yep, so let me point you in the direction of the thread you seem to be looking for:

 

[teacherdean]

Yes, any thread that does not bash Holly incessantly ( and perhaps using multiple threads to make the same point), just in case anyone missed it, is definitely wearing orange colored glasses.

For the record, I did not say that Holly was the second coming of John Wooden. I said for a team that appeared to implode, they pulled it together to go deeper than Notre Dame or USC for example, which no one saw coming.

I am afraid that objectively, Syracuse is playing a far superior game to Bama or LSU and so the LVs did not revert back to that level of play. In fact, the effort they gave last night would have crushed either.

Sometimes teams just get outplayed. When the opponent is raining threes from 10 ft beyond the arc with a 6-6 player in the shooters face, maybe its just not your night. As I said, the LVs needed to be able to do more damage from the 3-pt. line to pull Syracuse out of their suffocating zone. But, the LVs have not been a good outside shooting team (and that can go on the coach) and that deficiency proved fatal last night.

I am very proud of this team and their play in the SEC and NCAA's, as a whole, however, when things go wrong Holly just does not have an answer. Unfounately, she lacks the ability to make in game changes. It is not just the Syracuse game but it has been all season long.

 

[tnvols72]

This is a fair and realistic assessment of what happened in the Syracuse loss, madtownvol. Also, you are 100% accurate on what LVs need to do to improve for next season. I believe truly that if they do as you suggest than a 27-2 won-loss record is not out of the question.

With Holly as the coach ? I bet that has been said a lot for the past 3-4 years.

 

[LordBolton]

Seems to me that we were ranked 4th preseason, so it was not unreasonable to expect a FF appearance. Based on the season LV's were lucky to make the tournament, so in the end the round of 8 was a relief, and yet somewhat disappointing since they had the tools to go farther. I think they will improve next year and make the Finals. With some creative thinking, the UConn team bus can be diverted to the wrong stadium suring the first round and they will lose by forfeit to 16th -seeded ETSU, breaking their streak.

 

[BruceInLouisville]

A quick note or two:

One, I don't post here much, so I don't have a usual MO. I have, though, lurked here long enough to recognize certain posters, and have gotten to the point that I can tell who posted the comment just by reading it - especially the always-negative ones.

Two, don't forget that this same Syracuse team knocked Louisville out of the ACC tournament - a tournament where Louisville was expected to challenge for the championship. So, the Cuse is a good team all the time (only lost two games all year), and a great team when they are on like last night.

Three, it seems obvious to me that HCHW and the staff put in excellent game plans for ASU, OSU, and Cuse, and the team followed those plans up to the last half against the Cuse. People griping about the Syracuse game conveniently forget beating a good (and higher-seeded) ASU team on their home floor. They also forget beating a good (and higher-seeded) OSU team, while keeping their star player double-digit points below her average.

And finally - I will point to something I saw in the last three games that I hadn't seen all year: smiles in the huddle. I think this team finally gelled, and finally became friends, at the end of the season. I don't know; none of us do, really. But I saw the smiles, and I saw them rushing to help each other up, both things I didn't see earlier.

Frankly, I am looking forward to next year. I think this team will become better, and I think they will have a solid season.

My $0.02.

 

[governmentmule]

a MO? is that you curly ?

solid post Bruce :good!:

post more often :hi:

 

[teacherdean]

A quick note or two:

One, I don't post here much, so I don't have a usual MO. I have, though, lurked here long enough to recognize certain posters, and have gotten to the point that I can tell who posted the comment just by reading it - especially the always-negative ones.

Two, don't forget that this same Syracuse team knocked Louisville out of the ACC tournament - a tournament where Louisville was expected to challenge for the championship. So, the Cuse is a good team all the time (only lost two games all year), and a great team when they are on like last night.

Three, it seems obvious to me that HCHW and the staff put in excellent game plans for ASU, OSU, and Cuse, and the team followed those plans up to the last half against the Cuse. People griping about the Syracuse game conveniently forget beating a good (and higher-seeded) ASU team on their home floor. They also forget beating a good (and higher-seeded) OSU team, while keeping their star player double-digit points below her average.

And finally - I will point to something I saw in the last three games that I hadn't seen all year: smiles in the huddle. I think this team finally gelled, and finally became friends, at the end of the season. I don't know; none of us do, really. But I saw the smiles, and I saw them rushing to help each other up, both things I didn't see earlier.

Frankly, I am looking forward to next year. I think this team will become better, and I think they will have a solid season.

My $0.02.

Do you see an influx of 2016 recruits coming in to replace Graves and Moore and a bunch of 3 point shooters? Maybe you envision that Dean will coach up Russell and she will become one of the most dominate post players in LV history, or all of a sudden we will become a deadly 3 point shooting team. $0.02 is good but reality is better, of course hope lives eternal.