Democrats and leading liberal think tanks trying to defend the individual mandate

#1

lawgator1

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#1
The key opposition that Republicans have announced as to Obamacare is the mandate that each individual buy health insaurance. It is the foundation of the legal attacks. It has repeatedly been argued here, in accord with Republican statements when the bill was considered, passed, and enacted, that there is nothing in the Constitution that allows a national requirement that you buy something.

Some Democrats and leading liberal think tanks are defending the notion. Let's see if you can guess who said what about an individual mandate. (Answers below).

Good luck!


1) A bill introduced by a Democrat in 2007 and again in February 2009 would have required each individual in the United States to pay for private health insurance. It was called the "Healthy Americans Act" and its main provision was the requirement to buy health insurance. A number of Democrats co-sponsored it.

2) There have been a lot of votes by Democrats for individual mandates. In the Senate, in particular, one person voted for it in finance committee.

3) Romney's plan is being hoisted up by Democrats as an example of what should be done nationwide, including an individual mandate to buy health insurance.

4) There is a Democrat Senator saying "I believe there is a bipartisan concensus to have individual mandates."

5) A leading liberal think tank has proposed a plan whereby "All heads of households would be required by law to obtain at least a basic health plan specified by Congress..."

6) A leading Democratic presidential candidate down the line has said:

“I agree that all of us have a responsibility to help pay for health care. And I think that there are ways to do it that make most libertarians relatively happy,” ______ told the host. “I’ve said consistently, where there’s some requirement you either have health insurance or you post a bond or in some way you indicate you’re going to be held accountable.”






























The Democrats and liberals behind these actions and statements?


































1) The Healthy Americans Act was cosponsored by Republican Robert Bennet of Utah. There were nine Republican cosponsors, along with Democrats, as well. The Republicans who proposed an individual mandate 2 yeas ago now say it is unconstitutional and have signed off on resolutions saying so.

2) That was Olympia Snow, a Republican. She now says it is unconstitutional.

3) It was Senator Jim Demint, one of the most conservative Republicans in the Senate, who praised Romeny's plan, including the individual mandate. He said it should be adopted on a national basis. He said that on Fox & Friends in February 2007.

4) My mistake. That was Republican Senator Charles Grassley on June 14, 2009. He now says an individual mandate is unconstitutional.


5) Where is my head today?! I'm sorry. That quote is from the "Heritage Consumer Choice Health Plan," put forth by the Ameircan Heritage Foundation in 1992.

6) Newt Gingrich. Yesterday.







Guess that once Obama passed it they all changed their minds about their own proposals.
 
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#2
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Interesting thread. You were able to find some quotes from politicians who later changed their minds. I'm sure I'm not the only one who is really surprised by this.
 
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In response to the OP, who gives a damn? An individual mandate to buy health insurance is wrong, regardless of who supports it.
 
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Seems Newt is a serial "mind changer".

John-Kerry_1.jpg


eva-flip-flops-20838.jpg
 
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In response to the OP, who gives a damn? An individual mandate to buy health insurance is wrong, regardless of who supports it.

Then HMO's all need to be dismantled. The health insurance model won't work if that many people can opt out of health insurance altogether.
 
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How are they going to force poor people to buy something they can't afford already? It's garbage and is only going to spike insurance premiums everywhere. They need too break it down into income groups, provide this coverage for Joe , this coverage for Bob according to what they can afford. Shoving it down people's throats isn't going to work and will be the train wreck everyone is predicting.
 
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How are they going to force poor people to buy something they can't afford already? It's garbage and is only going to spike insurance premiums everywhere. They need too break it down into income groups, provide this coverage for Joe , this coverage for Bob according to what they can afford. Shoving it down people's throats isn't going to work and will be the train wreck everyone is predicting.

if you don't force people to buy it then they will surely wait until they are sick to purchase it. hell i might do it. I would save thousands a year.
 
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I think you may want to review some of these to be sure they are true individual mandates. I briefly read two of the bills you reference (from 1993) and they have significant differences.

Haven't found the Heritage Foundation Report (1989) yet but would be interested to see how they define "individual mandate" and how that compares with ObamaCare.

Since you did the research, why not provide the original language from each that shows what was being discussed so we can compare?
 
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Oh hey, you tricked me. Just cause some dumbass Republican somehow endorsed the mandate, it doesn't mean it's constitutional or practical.
 
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Then HMO's all need to be dismantled. The health insurance model won't work if that many people can opt out of health insurance altogether.

Why? I can imagine an HMO working just fine.

Why does the system have to be identical across the board. I can see a large company or organization or community choosing an HMO where another opts for more standard insurance models.
 
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I think you may want to review some of these to be sure they are true individual mandates. I briefly read two of the bills you reference (from 1993) and they have significant differences.

Haven't found the Heritage Foundation Report (1989) yet but would be interested to see how they define "individual mandate" and how that compares with ObamaCare.

Since you did the research, why not provide the original language from each that shows what was being discussed so we can compare?


FYI, I think that is a 1992 proposal by Heritage.

I didn't do the research on most of these, saw them on television last night. Now Newt's comments on Sunday are all over the place. Fox round table says he has screwed himself royally on his comments. And that was coming from one of the routine folks on the show. The comments from Demint were replayed live.

I'm not sure I would agree with you that the components of the individual mandate are all that significant to this issue. The complaint from the GOP as soon as Obama plan surfaced in its final form, and certainly since it was adopted, wasn't about the particulars of the mandate -- rather, the criticism was in the fact of ANY mandate to buy something.

Look, I know these guys speak out of both sides of their mouths all the time (as if "both" described the total number of possibilities, lol). And that is true of ALL politicians at this level, Republican or Democrat. I mean, Obama has recently had to eat his own words on the debt ceiling issue.

I point it out because there's a lot of Republicans sort of draping themselves in the American flag, reading passages of the Constitution aloud in chambers, and humming the Star Spangled Banner whilst bashing Obama for passing an individual mandate when they, themselves, personally or in tandem with others, proposed an individual mandate, said they'd vote for it, did vote for it, or said everyone should consider voting for it.
 
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"saw it on television last night"

meaning, "I saw it on MSNBC and didn't bother to verify the information myself"
 
#18
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"saw it on television last night"

meaning, "I saw it on MSNBC and didn't bother to verify the information myself"


Ummm ... they showed clips. And the one of Demint was from Fox News. The one of Gingrich was from NBC on this past Sunday.

Not sure what it is you want me to do on that. The record is clear that many Republicans have endorsed an individual mandate, they've done it within the last 3-4 years (at least one within the last 3 days).

It is only after Obama passed it that these very same folks are signing onto resolutions and endorsing lawsuits that claim that an individual mandate is unconstitutional (not this one, not one that's different from theirs -- ANY individual mandate).
 
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It is only after Obama passed it that these very same folks are signing onto resolutions and endorsing lawsuits that claim that an individual mandate is unconstitutional (not this one, not one that's different from theirs -- ANY individual mandate).

maybe doing it during the worst recession since the great depression might be a reason? nah must be pure partisanship.
 
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Why? I can imagine an HMO working just fine.

Why does the system have to be identical across the board. I can see a large company or organization or community choosing an HMO where another opts for more standard insurance models.

Blanket term... My bad. Any health payment other than straight fee for service.
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#21
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Ummm ... they showed clips. And the one of Demint was from Fox News. The one of Gingrich was from NBC on this past Sunday.

Not sure what it is you want me to do on that. The record is clear that many Republicans have endorsed an individual mandate, they've done it within the last 3-4 years (at least one within the last 3 days).

It is only after Obama passed it that these very same folks are signing onto resolutions and endorsing lawsuits that claim that an individual mandate is unconstitutional (not this one, not one that's different from theirs -- ANY individual mandate).

perhaps if the health care bill signed by Obama wasn't over 2000 pages and was passed along strictly partisan lines...

the GOP has every right to complain about a bill that they essentially had no say in
 
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perhaps if the health care bill signed by Obama wasn't over 2000 pages and was passed along strictly partisan lines...

the GOP has every right to complain about a bill that they essentially had no say in



Or did it pass on strictly partisan lines because no GOPer had the political nerve to stand up and be counted as in alignment with Obama on the VERY THING they had themselves sponsored or voted for or touted just a year or so before?
 
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maybe doing it during the worst recession since the great depression might be a reason? nah must be pure partisanship.


Ah, so the state of the economy affects the constitutionality of an individual mandate?

That makes no sense at all.

The claim now, and the one the GOP ran on last year, and the basis of the lawsuits, is that forcing people to buy something is unconstitutional.

Yet, many Republican Senators promoted that very concept and even voted for it. It is only AFTER Obama embraced it in the bill that it became the great unconstitutional boogeyman.
 
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Or did it pass on strictly partisan lines because no GOPer had the political nerve to stand up and be counted as in alignment with Obama on the VERY THING they had themselves sponsored or voted for or touted just a year or so before?

you want to name a republican in favor of universal healthcare not from a majority democratic state? romney would be a democrat in 80% of this country.
 
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Or did it pass on strictly partisan lines because no GOPer had the political nerve to stand up and be counted as in alignment with Obama on the VERY THING they had themselves sponsored or voted for or touted just a year or so before?

no, the legislation that was passed is deeply flawed and despite claims to the contrary, was rushed, poorly written and contains so many egregious expansions of government power that no one in the GOP could, in good conscience, vote for it.

don't forget, several democrats voted against it because they were in politically vulnerable seats. If you're going to make the claim that the GOP lacked political nerve, you must also ascribe that to democrat no votes as well.
 

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