Im still not understanding the whole "we are too slow" slogan..

[volfan411]

I guess every team in the NFL, College Football, and high school football have a coaching problem, I guess the whole coaching staff in Denver needs to be fired after what happened in the playoffs against Baltimore last year.

I blame the coaches for not have the team playing with more energy and intensity, but I do not blame them for Coleman letting another guy run by him. Sutton is the freshman and he doesn't make as many mistake as Coleman so I guess that's coaching.

The bottom line is 9 games is not enough time to evaluate this coaching staff. Last year this team gave up 55 to Missouri at home so there is some improvement.

I wish people would understand we do not have the same offensive play makers as we had last year, our offense is not going to be as good as last years offense. We could have made a game out of it if our young receivers and QB had not struggled and what a surprise Neal struggled too.

What was really disappointing was the Line play, I thought this was the only area we had an edge over Missouri. It was unacceptable and pathetic.

Thank you I could not agree more. Coleman made the same mistakes last season as he is this season but what do you do put Swafford or Toney in who have both had mistakes as well. I find it really unfair to the staff to start placing blame on them at this point.

The team not being ready is on the coach but UT has not won a game against a quality SEC opponent on the road since 2006 so maybe our road woes is the culture now.

 

[oldsmokey67]

I guess what I am trying to figure out is why we are too slow when most of these players were 4 or 5* recruits when we landed them. Where do you find these so called "blazsters" at? It just seems like every other team out there is fast and we are not. Would they all be faster on different teams? Is it the coaching? Development? Should they have not been recruited by an SEC team like Tennessee?

read what saintlouisvol wrote early in this thread.speed kills.we need speed.speed speed speed.CBJ has speed coming in next year.look at the db recruit mosely.he is a 2* and he runs as fast or faster than most of our current dbs.i think he runs a 4.3 40.and he should be ranked higher.

 

[Nashvol2]

When you play tentatively and take bad pursuit angles, it makes you look a lot slower than you really are.

Add in the fact that the team is hurting for speed and it compounds the issue. CBJ said in the last presser that speed was a premium in recruiting. He sees the need.

This. The only thing that I would add is the lack of quality depth. There are some pretty big dropoffs from 1's to 2's and 3's.

 

[LibertyVolance]

I guess what I am trying to figure out is why we are too slow when most of these players were 4 or 5* recruits when we landed them. Where do you find these so called "blazsters" at? It just seems like every other team out there is fast and we are not. Would they all be faster on different teams? Is it the coaching? Development? Should they have not been recruited by an SEC team like Tennessee?

Most were 3s.

 

[sjt18]

I said they played bad, it was pathetic and unacceptable the way they played but don't play the talent BS.

I'm not. You are. I never said this was a championship roster. But the coaches bear a good portion of the blame when the team so drastically underperforms as it did last Saturday. You are going to fairly absurd measures to avoid blaming the coaches AT ALL.

I thought we did some good thing against their secondary, with a starting Freshman QB making his first start on the road with young receivers. You are talking about 2 different things comparing their Defense to ours but what you should be comparing is the match ups of their Offense vs Our Defense.

Just comparing "talent levels".

I could have accepted pretty much everything that occurred last Saturday except the way they flat out ran over UT's D with simple sweep plays... and the way their INFERIOR athletes on their DL absolutely OWNED five guys with NFL measureables on UT's OL.

Jones has agreed with me by the way. He hasn't publicly exposed his coaches but I HOPE he has read them the riot act privately.

would you not say their WR's are better then our DB's?

Absent over 300 yds rushing.... I wouldn't think holding them to less than 200 yds passing was bad at all. Toney busted the same coverage on the same pattern... again. But we all know UT needs a better option. The problem is that guys like M Williams, R Jones, M Foreman, et al have not stepped up and given UT an option. Swafford and Toney beat out scholarship players.

would you not say their overall speed on offense was a whole lot better then our defense?

I'd be willing to discuss that as a factor if they weren't out of position so often and didn't overrun plays so often.... that is coaching and discipline.

I thought we had an advantage on the Line of scrimmage and no way we should have got manhandled but their skill people were heads and shoulders better then our LB's and DB's and without some pressure by our front four we did not stand a chance.

But that's not how the game was lost on D.

If you had asked me before the game if I would take Mauk at 12/25 for 163... I might have guaranteed a win or at least a close game. UT did not get outrun regardless of who you think is "faster". UT's D got RUN OVER. Jones obviously thinks coaching was a factor or else he would not be changing his approach this week.

Missouri's secondary starts 3 seniors and a junior enough said.

ummm, no, not "enough said". They are dead last in the SEC in pass D.

Again, I don't have a problem with Dobbs making mistakes and even mistakes that contributed big to the loss. I have a huge problem with an OL that could not get push against guys they should have mauled.

since 2010 they have signed 3 2 stars we have signed 8 2 stars so your argument of all those 2 stars and walkons don't add up.

It does when they're on the field.

I do not completely excuse the coaches but 9 games is not enough time to evaluate this staff, I think you have to give them a couple of years.

Yes. You are. That may not be your intent but you protest any time anyone has said that the coaching wasn't good... and it wasn't.

IMO, they deserve 3 full years before you make a final evaluation but that does not mean you cannot look at various things along the way and praise or criticize them.

They did not prepare the team well for this game. Some of those guys seem to be performing poorly on a regular enough basis that you have to wonder why back ups aren't getting a shot. AND I promise I don't go to that "panic button" lightly. I think you have to stick with guys even when they struggle early and then for periods of time. But how long do you stick with a guy when coaching isn't taking? The OL has been around for 3 or 4 years now. You said "enough said" because MU's secondary was upperclassmen. Is it "enough said" that UT's OL is made up of talented upperclassmen? Frankly, I'm ready to see some guys that are hungry and a little on the nasty side over talented but soft guys.

Like I said before I think after the last 3 weeks they had a letdown against Missouri

I don't disagree with that. But to be fair... who would you blame for that had there been no coaching change?

It was definitely a draining stretch but Dooley was rightly condemened when he lost his second team under somewhat similar circumstances.

 

[BearCat204]

I guess every team in the NFL, College Football, and high school football have a coaching problem, I guess the whole coaching staff in Denver needs to be fired after what happened in the playoffs against Baltimore last year.

I blame the coaches for not have the team playing with more energy and intensity, but I do not blame them for Coleman letting another guy run by him. Sutton is the freshman and he doesn't make as many mistake as Coleman so I guess that's coaching.

The bottom line is 9 games is not enough time to evaluate this coaching staff. Last year this team gave up 55 to Missouri at home so there is some improvement.

I wish people would understand we do not have the same offensive play makers as we had last year, our offense is not going to be as good as last years offense. We could have made a game out of it if our young receivers and QB had not struggled and what a surprise Neal struggled too.

What was really disappointing was the Line play, I thought this was the only area we had an edge over Missouri. It was unacceptable and pathetic.

Never said anything about firing anyone, I contribute most of the bad habits of angles and poor positional play to a couple of years under the previous staff.

 

[Volfan2012]

I think we have enough speed at cornerback. They do not always make the right read and that is why they get beat for touchdowns. I think all our safeties are slow for that position. I think our De's are slow can't stop the corner attack or run down the QB. Linebacker speed is ok sometimes they fail to react correctly to the play and that is why the back is past them.

 

[BanditVol]

Ok people, so it seems to be a consensus that our D and some of our Offense are too slow and that's a huge reason why we get pummeled against good, solid opponents. So, tell me..why is Mizzou soooooo fast. They recruit 3, 4 and 5 star talent just like we have the past 5 years. Hell, I don't even know if they have had a top 10 recruiting class in years! Why are they sooooo fast and we soooooo slow?

Byron Moore....4 star Juco top DB that chose us over Miami, FL. Would he have been fast if he went to Miami? Why is he so slow? Justin Coleman....5 star stud recruit when came in. Why is he getting blazed so badly on every freakin play?! Brian Randolph...another 4 star recruit. Slow! Why are these guys slow while every other team's players are sooooo fast? I don't get it lol

All three of those guys are banged up? Well, I know for a fact Randolph and Moore are, not so sure about Coleman, it may actually be McNeil.

But yes, three of our DBs are struggling with nagging injuries, which is why the walk on Jaron Toney started at safety Saturday.

They are plenty fast...we just lack depth!

 

[RollerVol]

If my memory serves me correctly, Coleman was a 5* recruit out of VA....4* at minimum. Why does he play like a 2*?

The guys seem to play scared. Not turning it loose and playing with reckless abandon. They really haven't learned how to win as a team yet. Maybe that's what years of bad coaching and play-calling (offense and defense) will do for you. I'll stop here. You add in any other suggestions you deem necessary.
GO VOLS!

 

[sjt18]

UT DOES have roster holes. That was true from the very start... and still is. But a coach's job is to work around those things and get the best out of what he has.

I think Jones did a very good job of that vs UGA and USCe. I think the major mistake at UF was strategic and not tactical. His team didn't play to its potential vs Oregon, Bama, or MU. That's not saying they would have won otherwise... only that there's no way those games should have been those kinds of beat downs if the team had played anywhere close to its talent level.

 

[roster]

All three of those guys are banged up? Well, I know for a fact Randolph and Moore are, not so sure about Coleman, it may actually be McNeil.

But yes, three of our DBs are struggling with nagging injuries, which is why the walk on Jaron Toney started at safety Saturday.

They are plenty fast...we just lack depth!

Jaron Toney is not a safety. He is a nickle back. And, by the way dumbazz, there are a lot of great high school players that get overlooked by the the retardos at rivals and do not get the stars and are recruited. When that happens, you walk on. Don't mean you ain't a damn bit lesser of a player than anyone else on the team.

 

[sjt18]

UT needs to be at least 2 deep at CB with guys who can play at the skill level of Sutton and Coleman. If reports are to be believed then those two are playing in front of at least 3 guys with more God given "speed" and/or quickness.

The safeties aren't blazers but McNeil and Randolph both close well.

 

[roster]

So what do think we do. These same players took the same bad angles last year. Do you think Martinez is saying when you get in the game take a bad angle. I am sure they are trying to correct it but it is obvious that the players are not responding and there in no one behind them to put in.

Yes, it is very possible to hire to bad DB coaches in a row. Sure is.

 

[Other_Guy]

Um, because speed does not make a player a good player and get a higher grade?

 

[BanditVol]

I do not blame them for Coleman letting another guy run by him. Sutton is the freshman and he doesn't make as many mistake as Coleman so I guess that's coaching.

.

I don't know if you mean the one where the guy had no one within 20 yards...that supposedly was a bust in communication.

Another thing about Mizzou...their WRs are the heart and strenght of that offense, no matter who the QB is. The RB is maybe above average and the line is along the same lines.

As I sat in the stadium Saturday night, they flashed the attributes of all the starters up on the screen. Here is the height of their top three WRs, which all start as apparently they start 3. 6 5, 6 5, 6 4. I saw those heights and said "oh ****". That and the Mizzou fan behind me said they all had NFL prospects. The hyphenated name guy that I am too lazy to look up was the no. 1 prospect in the country coming out of HS in fact.

I am not making excuses for our defense...they can and have done much better, but it does help explain the Mizzou success. Easily the best bunch of WRs we have faced (factoring in Georgia's injuries). Bammer WRs a close second, the main difference is that they have only two NFL WRs and a better QB (though I still think AJ is above average at best, I give him the nod over Mizzou's backup lol).

 

[Giveem6]

Our secondary isn't fast by any means but playing slower and not reacting makes the problem that much worse.

 

[roster]

I said they played bad, it was pathetic and unacceptable the way they played but don't play the talent BS.

I thought we did some good thing against their secondary, with a starting Freshman QB making his first start on the road with young receivers. You are talking about 2 different things comparing their Defense to ours but what you should be comparing is the match ups of their Offense vs Our Defense.

would you not say their WR's are better then our DB's? would you not say their overall speed on offense was a whole lot better then our defense? I thought we had an advantage on the Line of scrimmage and no way we should have got manhandled but their skill people were heads and shoulders better then our LB's and DB's and without some pressure by our front four we did not stand a chance.

Missouri's secondary starts 3 seniors and a junior enough said.

I would sure hope Missouri is coached up they have been running the same system under Pinkel since 2001.

since 2010 they have signed 3 2 stars we have signed 8 2 stars so your argument of all those 2 stars and walkons don't add up.

I do not completely excuse the coaches but 9 games is not enough time to evaluate this staff, I think you have to give them a couple of years.

Like I said before I think after the last 3 weeks they had a letdown against Missouri

I like it when people like you post just to admire he babes pictures you have.

 

[Giveem6]

I don't know if you mean the one where the guy had no one within 20 yards...that supposedly was a bust in communication.

Another thing about Mizzou...their WRs are the heart and strenght of that offense, no matter who the QB is. The RB is maybe above average and the line is along the same lines.

As I sat in the stadium Saturday night, they flashed the attributes of all the starters up on the screen. Here is the height of their top three WRs, which all start as apparently they start 3. 6 5, 6 5, 6 4. I saw those heights and said "oh ****". That and the Mizzou fan behind me said they all had NFL prospects. The hyphenated name guy that I am too lazy to look up was the no. 1 prospect in the country coming out of HS in fact.

I am not making excuses for our defense...they can and have done much better, but it does help explain the Mizzou success. Easily the best bunch of WRs we have faced (factoring in Georgia's injuries). Bammer WRs a close second, the main difference is that they have only two NFL WRs and a better QB (though I still think AJ is above average at best, I give him the nod over Mizzou's backup lol).

Aj takes awful angles. That touchdown in the ten yard line to beckam should have been stopped and yet Ajs angle was so bad he was blown right by.

But that has happened his whole career and anybody that sees him as NFL ready is lying to themselves

 

[BanditVol]

Jaron Toney is not a safety. He is a nickle back. And, by the way dumbazz, there are a lot of great high school players that get overlooked by the the retardos at rivals and do not get the stars and are recruited. When that happens, you walk on. Don't mean you ain't a damn bit lesser of a player than anyone else on the team.

He STARTED Saturday. I was the game and saw him play the first down. So maybe we began the game with 5 DBs? Maybe you can tell me.

I am not being critical of Jaron...I hate to get on individual players. There are too many classless POS's in every fan base that do this.

But for the record, on bammers' first TD against us Toney took a horrible angle and basically allowed the TD. Danielson pointed this out. I know a lot of people don't like Danielson, but as a former starting QB in the NFL he is SPOT ON in his football knowledge. Maybe he is a smart ass sometimes, but he knows his s__.

So ... yeah, there seems to be a big step down from Randolph and McNeil.

In the meantime...calm down and quit spewing spit on your computer screen. Are you Jaron? If so, don't take it so personally. If you're just a bud of his, please refrain from calling me a "dumbazz" cause it's against the rules, and you know NOTHING about me.

Let me know how this makes you feel...cause I have a few names I can call you.

Nanner nanner boo boo! :lolabove:

 

[HardKnoxVol]

My bad..thought VA like Brent Vinson was. Still, he was a top 10 DB recruit coming out of HS.

Once again, you're wrong. Get this through your head. Coleman was a 3 star on most sites and was not in the top 10. He was ranked in the 20s for defensive back.

 

[Giveem6]

Once again, you're wrong. Get this through your head. Coleman was a 3 star on most sites and was not in the top 10. He was ranked in the 20s for defensive back.

I know the op is delusional but I don't give a damn who was what coming out of highschool. A major problem on our defense is this is the third different defense in three years.

Yes we don't have the speed to win a championship but with that amount of turnover it takes away from playing fast and leads to over thinking assignments.

I'm not trying to make excuses for us but if you don't look at the big picture you can't make a good judgment of our defense.

We are capable of playing fast and taking good assignments ala Georgia and SCe. Things will only get better in time I just hope it's the next three weeks.

 

[volfan411]

UT DOES have roster holes. That was true from the very start... and still is. But a coach's job is to work around those things and get the best out of what he has.

I think Jones did a very good job of that vs UGA and USCe. I think the major mistake at UF was strategic and not tactical. His team didn't play to its potential vs Oregon, Bama, or MU. That's not saying they would have won otherwise... only that there's no way those games should have been those kinds of beat downs if the team had played anywhere close to its talent level.

I agree and do not get our struggles on the road. Did you see the stat I put in a earlier thread that other than Vandy and Kentucky, UT has not beaten a SEC opponent on the road since 2007 and has not beaten a quality SEC opponent since 2006. I think losing on the road is the culture right now and somehow Jones is going to have to get it out of them.

 

[BanditVol]

I know the op is delusional but I don't give a damn who was what coming out of highschool. A major problem on our defense is this is the third different defense in three years.

Yes we don't have the speed to win a championship but with that amount of turnover it takes away from playing fast and leads to over thinking assignments.

I'm not trying to make excuses for us but if you don't look at the big picture you can't make a good judgment of our defense.

We are capable of playing fast and taking good assignments ala Georgia and SCe. Things will only get better in time I just hope it's the next three weeks.

I agree...coaching turnover is a huge factor. As bad as we have been on D the last two games, what just happened against Mizzou and bammer happened against TROY last year.

OVerall the D is better...the last two games remind me of last year, but at least it was two top 10 SEC teams on the road.

Brace yourself though...we got shredded for 339 yards on the ground by Mizzou and Auburn is the no. 6 run offense in the country at 304 yards per game. :sad:

 

[volfan411]

He STARTED Saturday. I was the game and saw him play the first down. So maybe we began the game with 5 DBs? Maybe you can tell me.

I am not being critical of Jaron...I hate to get on individual players. There are too many classless POS's in every fan base that do this.

But for the record, on bammers' first TD against us Toney took a horrible angle and basically allowed the TD. Danielson pointed this out. I know a lot of people don't like Danielson, but as a former starting QB in the NFL he is SPOT ON in his football knowledge. Maybe he is a smart ass sometimes, but he knows his s__.

So ... yeah, there seems to be a big step down from Randolph and McNeil.

In the meantime...calm down and quit spewing spit on your computer screen. Are you Jaron? If so, don't take it so personally. If you're just a bud of his, please refrain from calling me a "dumbazz" cause it's against the rules, and you know NOTHING about me.

Let me know how this makes you feel...cause I have a few names I can call you.

Nanner nanner boo boo! :lolabove:

If I am not mistaken Toney missed the tackle against Georgia that allowed them to get a first down and go on to score. The fact is there are match ups that do not favor his skill set and other coaches have figured that out.

 

[volfan411]

Yes, it is very possible to hire to bad DB coaches in a row. Sure is.

So you think Martinez is teaching them to take poor angles.

I am not defending Martinez but by the time a player reaches this level he should not have to be taught how to take proper tackling angles and if he does he should never have received a scholarship.