Iraq exit strategy

#1

dan4vols

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#1
Listening to republican radio talk show on the way to work last night the recurring theme was giving an exit date just helps the enemy plan strategy. This I can see on some level having ....some merit. But how long is long enough? And when you do decide it is, how do you exit Iraq as the feared accomplished nation you want to appears as? Are there clear goals that have been set down and how far away are we from realizing them?
 
#2
#2
The concept of an "exit strategy" is entirely ridiculous. You should not enter into war thinking of a way out. You should enter thinking of the most efficient way to accomplish your objectives. If you fail, you fail. You do not half-heartedly enter with some escape plan should things go wrong.
 
#3
#3
This is political move only by the Democrats. As RealUT pointed out the military should be and is strategizing the best methods to accomplish objectives and the politicians are stategizing the best method to get to their objective which is winning the next election.
 
#4
#4
I thought that Powell's doctrine pertained to an exit strategy as defined after achieving a set of objectives....not an escape plan. I think that we went into Iraq without really knowing what we wanted to do besides overthrow Saddam..I think because we thought it would be over after that.
 
#5
#5
I found this a very interesting read. I believe it is pertinent to this discussion.
Most people don't know that the decision to remove Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq was made during the Clinton presidency, not the Bush administration. Saddam's removal from power became the official policy of the United States government long before 9/11 and long before George Bush took the oath of office.

I believe that the Democrat Party resolved early to defeat Bush's efforts to bring peace, economic liberty, and a freely elected representative government to the people of Iraq. They could pick up the pieces later, when they came to power. But success must not be achieved on Bush's watch.

Think back to some of the reactions of Middle East leaders to Bush's removal of Saddam from power.

Libyan dictator Muammar al-Qaddafi suddenly became a pussycat, announcing an end to his nuclear programs and playing nice with the West. The House of Saud announced broader voting privileges in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. Throughout the Middle East, strongmen and leaders watched events in Iraq with a weary eye.

It didn't take long for the Arab world to recognize that things weren't going all that well for George W. Bush. America was not unified; indeed, there were deep divisionsabout his policies. Democrats were calling for an exit strategy before the smoke cleared from the first attacks.

Within months, the Arab world knew that the American people weren't likely to stick this one out. Day after day they saw attacks on Bush, his secretary of defense, and virtually all aspects of the war.

Day after day the stories on the network newscasts detailed bombings and deaths, even as day after day American troops were lauded by the Iraqi people for building schools and hospitals.

The Islamic fascists watched, and learned.

They knew that if they could just maintain a steady stream of suicide bombings resulting in the deaths of American soldiers, the American people would grow quickly tired and throw in the towel.

It became standard operating practice after Abu Ghraib for any Islamic terrorist being held by coalition forces to scream torture. They knew that the media would pick up the story and run with it, even without any corroborating evidence.

If the Democrat Party hadn't been so hell bent on destroying the Bush presidency--if the Democrats had shown a unified front with their commander in chief and our troops--who's to say that complete victory in Iraq would not have been ours by now?

Neal Boortz
 
#6
#6
I thought that Powell's doctrine pertained to an exit strategy as defined after achieving a set of objectives....not an escape plan. I think that we went into Iraq without really knowing what we wanted to do besides overthrow Saddam..I think because we thought it would be over after that.
...and Powell knows what exactly about how to command and conduct a war?

NOTHING.
 
#7
#7
Terrorist view of US policy to cut and run began in the helicopter downing in Somolia (Black Hawk Down). The Clinton administration would not allow the military to go in and their troops out and couldn't deal with graphic images of their soldiers being dragged around in the streets. Osama then started the strategy of bombings becuase he realized the Clinton administration didn't have the guts to follow through and make hard decisions that would not be popular.
 
#8
#8
I would say that Bush, Sr. (along with Colin Powell) empowered rogue leaders in the Middle East by taking very little punitive action against Saddam for his aggression against Kuwait. Exactly how much worse off was Hussein prior to occupying Kuwait than he was after Desert Storm?
 
#9
#9
I would say that Bush, Sr. (along with Colin Powell) empowered rogue leaders in the Middle East by taking very little punitive action against Saddam for his aggression against Kuwait. Exactly how much worse off was Hussein prior to occupying Kuwait than he was after Desert Storm?

True. But for once they followed UN resolution which was to get him out of Kuwait. Which in itself was a lesson to rogue leaders that there are consequences.
 
#10
#10
True. But for once they followed UN resolution which was to get him out of Kuwait. Which in itself was a lesson to rogue leaders that there are consequences.
Consequences...I guess. Kind of like if you catch someone stealing, you simply make them return what they stole and leave saying "job well done"...
 
#11
#11
Consequences...I guess. Kind of like if you catch someone stealing, you simply make them return what they stole and leave saying "job well done"...

Plus destroying a good number of their army, tanks and other military assests. Not a light off as letting Bobby go after stealing a candy bar. Don't get me wrong, I agree with you but don't think rogue leaders now think they can take over countries anytime they want.
 
#12
#12
Well, enough of his army was destroyed to keep him from taking over another country. However, he had plenty of strongmen left to continue his reign of terror in Iraq. I agree with pointing fingers at Clinton's admin for botching Somalia, but I feel the actions in Kuwait were darn near similar (Powell most likely persuaded GHWB not to take the fight into Baghdad because the US could lose 10 soldiers per day, Clinton pulled out of Mogadishu because the US lost 9 soldiers per day over 2 days.)
 
#13
#13
The UN mandate was to get Sadam out of Kuwait but not not out of power. I understand your argument on soldier deaths but don't agree. These two events are so different.

Somolia was just a cut and run based on Clinton's orders. Kuwait/Iraq was cut and run (back to Saudi and Kuwaiti soil) based on UN resolutions.

Now, did others view this as cut and run on both accounts, maybe. But to say the Powell and GHWB cut and ran from Iraq before "finishing" the job due to fear of public backlash and soldier deaths is wrong. It was again due to UN resolutions for which we once followed.
 
#14
#14
If an exit did occur, how would this go down? I am not for it. But how would you see the enemy reacting to it? Wouldn't they just up the killing to maximum force? Kind of like kicking someone in the ass on the way out the door? If so, wonder how the anti-war crowd and cowards in DC would spin it?
 
#15
#15
The UN mandate was to get Sadam out of Kuwait but not not out of power. I understand your argument on soldier deaths but don't agree. These two events are so different.

Somolia was just a cut and run based on Clinton's orders. Kuwait/Iraq was cut and run (back to Saudi and Kuwaiti soil) based on UN resolutions.

Now, did others view this as cut and run on both accounts, maybe. But to say the Powell and GHWB cut and ran from Iraq before "finishing" the job due to fear of public backlash and soldier deaths is wrong. It was again due to UN resolutions for which we once followed.
I understand that the UN mandate was only to force the Iraqi military out of Kuwait. Got it.

However, Schwarzkopf was pushing for the overthrow of Saddam. The rest of the world was willing (maybe not to overtly take part but not a single NATO country would have made a critical statement about our actions.) Powell, who was anti-military action prior to Desert Storm, effectively ended our military commanders' bids to press the attack home.
 
#16
#16
I understand that the UN mandate was only to force the Iraqi military out of Kuwait. Got it.

However, Schwarzkopf was pushing for the overthrow of Saddam. The rest of the world was willing (maybe not to overtly take part but not a single NATO country would have made a critical statement about our actions.) Powell, who was anti-military action prior to Desert Storm, effectively ended our military commanders' bids to press the attack home.

Agree
 
#17
#17
I would say that Bush, Sr. (along with Colin Powell) empowered rogue leaders in the Middle East by taking very little punitive action against Saddam for his aggression against Kuwait. Exactly how much worse off was Hussein prior to occupying Kuwait than he was after Desert Storm?
Relative to Iran, his true archnemesis, significantly.
 
#18
#18
The concept of an "exit strategy" is entirely ridiculous. You should not enter into war thinking of a way out. You should enter thinking of the most efficient way to accomplish your objectives. If you fail, you fail. You do not half-heartedly enter with some escape plan should things go wrong.
A set of objectives that do not either include the way out or end in a way out are incomplete and ill conceived.
 
#19
#19
A set of objectives that do not either include the way out or end in a way out are incomplete and ill conceived.
Well, I guess every last order I have ever prepared, executed, given, and been given, have been incomplete and ill conceived. I will let my Senior Rater know that he, as well as I, is incompetent and not fit for for command.
 
#20
#20
...and Powell knows what exactly about how to command and conduct a war?

NOTHING.
I don't like Powell's style nor how he came to power, but this statement is just stupid. You rail on the movie 300 as some war expert, but are less qualified to discuss that than Powell is to execute war.
 
#21
#21
I don't like Powell's style nor how he came to power, but this statement is just stupid. You rail on the movie 300 as some war expert, but are less qualified to discuss that than Powell is to execute war.
Can you tell me exactly how many combat commands Powell has had? Or, maybe you can tell me how many commands he has had, period? Being the CJCS during Operations Just Cause and Desert Storm in no means impllies that he was executing those wars. He was the nothing more than the Chief of Staff of the military (also known as XO to the CINC.)
 
#22
#22
Well, I guess every last order I have ever prepared, executed, given, and been given, have been incomplete and ill conceived. I will let my Senior Rater know that he, as well as I, is incompetent and not fit for for command.
Word parsing is definitely your strongest suit - stick to it and avoid analysis. I couldn't care less about some ritualistic opord garbage that you're putting together. I'm talking about a strategy for prosecuting a war. Ask your senior rater if he thinks exit should be omitted in that context.
 
#23
#23
Word parsing is definitely your strongest suit - stick to it and avoid analysis. I couldn't care less about some ritualistic opord garbage that you're putting together. I'm talking about a strategy for prosecuting a war. Ask your senior rater if he thinks exit should be omitted in that context.
I am guessing you are one of those guys who signed a pre-nup prior to getting married...that is your exit strategy, right?
 
#24
#24
Can you tell me exactly how many combat commands Powell has had? Or, maybe you can tell me how many commands he has had, period? Being the CJCS during Operations Just Cause and Desert Storm in no means impllies that he was executing those wars. He was the nothing more than the Chief of Staff of the military (also known as XO to the CINC.)
That's funny. Implying that he wasn't there because he was the XO should be beneath you, but apparently it's not. One need not command to understand it and help write doctrine regarding command. I would say he was executing in Desert Storm as much as anyone else and certainly moreso than you. By your standard, you are unqualified to discuss anything other than frickin' platoon leader duties in an infantry unit. That's an awfully limited scope.
 
#25
#25
I am guessing you are one of those guys who signed a pre-nup prior to getting married...that is your exit strategy, right?
What does that have to do with your retarded notion of entering into a war without an exit strategy in mind?
 

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