Is Clinton-Obama helping or hurting McCain?

#1
lawgator1

lawgator1

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#1
The question posed here is a narrow one: Is the continuing battle for the Democratic nomination helping McCain or hurting him? Conversely, will the winner of the Dem nomination be stronger or weaker as a result?

This thread is not about who should win. And tis not about whether a Dem or McCain would be a better president. Its just a focused look at the effects of the Dem nomination process dragging out like it has.

I admit I am torn on this, personally. On the one hand, the argument that some make that the Dems are tearing each other down and splitting the party and that one side or the other is going to be pissed, makes some sense to me. Not to mention that the winner will have spent a fortune already and be begging for more for the general.

On the other hand, to some degree the old adage is true in that there is no such thing as bad publicity. The recent debate got a big share. This is basically free media time for them and of course the pundits sit there and talk about how charismatic Obama is and how reilient Clinton has been, and so they end up getting soem fairy positive spin on most nights. And as I say its free and McCain is an afterthought in these discussions.

I don't know. Its a close call as to whether this helps or hurts the Dems. What do you guys think?
 
#2
#2
as long as hillary and obama continue to negatively campaign against the other it helps mccain. if hillary (in particular) stopped this I think the extra exposure might be worth it.
 
#3
#3
If it goes to the supers it will hurt the dems badly, especially if they choose contrary to the peoples popular vote. This helps McCain, he has been able to sit back and bring money in for the campaign to come. I would say that the tightly contested dem contest at this time takes the focus off McCain and allows him to put together sound strategy for the election. Just my opinion.
 
#4
#4
droski said:
as long as hillary and obama continue to negatively campaign against the other it helps mccain. if hillary (in particular) stopped this I think the extra exposure might be worth it.
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You mean that if she concedes soon then Obama has withstood her attack and won anyway and can be gracious and say he's getting back on message?

I tend to agree. I think this process will be harder on Clinton if she gets the nomination than on Obama. The one thing it has done is forced her even further into the middle. That's an advantage or disadvantage, depending on your perspective.
 
#5
#5
I watched the last Dem debate and can't see how that could help. I was actually glad the mods called them out on some issues instead of letting both just put out ideas that sound good but don't make a whole lot of sense.
 
#7
#7
the one thing being over looked in all this, is that right now the dems are the only ones being paid any attention to at the moment. it's giving all voters more to look at than what we've seen in the past.

point being, for the voters on the fence about what they are going to do come November, this exposure is a good thing for the Dems. it gives them a chance to sway those voters their way.

the problem though, will be what happens to the hard core democrats whose candidate loses the nomination? how much bad blood will there be, and will the negative campaigning going on between the two just turn off those would be fence riders.

i think they need to be very careful.

all that said, Hillary will have a much harder time than Barak in a general election, imo.
 
#8
#8
dragging this out and putting the Superdelegates to a vote is death to the Dems' hopes.

Can you imagine the deserters after having their popular opinion altogether disregarded? forget who's making news today, the Dems have a problem.

Hillary cannot get enough delegates to win, period. The only way she wins is to overturn the popular vote, which, as I stated above, is a disaster waiting to happen. The mudslinging has really only served to hurt Obama because it has forced him to provide more than lipservice and has brought to light many of the questions about his background and acquantances that he would have preferred answer with the full weight of the Dems behind him.

While the Dems have been in the spotlight and that might be good, Hillary's stubborn drive to the convention is likely to eviscerate the Dems for '08.
 
#9
#9
BigPapaVol said:
dragging this out and putting the Superdelegates to a vote is death to the Dems' hopes.

Can you imagine the deserters after having their popular opinion altogether disregarded? forget who's making news today, the Dems have a problem.

Hillary cannot get enough delegates to win, period. The only way she wins is to overturn the popular vote, which, as I stated above, is a disaster waiting to happen. The mudslinging has really only served to hurt Obama because it has forced him to provide more than lipservice and has brought to light many of the questions about his background and acquantances that he would have preferred answer with the full weight of the Dems behind him.

While the Dems have been in the spotlight and that might be good, Hillary's stubborn drive to the convention is likely to eviscerate the Dems for '08.
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Well put.
 
#10
#10
BigPapaVol said:
dragging this out and putting the Superdelegates to a vote is death to the Dems' hopes.

Can you imagine the deserters after having their popular opinion altogether disregarded? forget who's making news today, the Dems have a problem.

Hillary cannot get enough delegates to win, period. The only way she wins is to overturn the popular vote, which, as I stated above, is a disaster waiting to happen. The mudslinging has really only served to hurt Obama because it has forced him to provide more than lipservice and has brought to light many of the questions about his background and acquantances that he would have preferred answer with the full weight of the Dems behind him.

While the Dems have been in the spotlight and that might be good, Hillary's stubborn drive to the convention is likely to eviscerate the Dems for '08.
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yeah can you imagine the person who calls herself the candidate most in touch with the common man winning the democratic nomincation because she circumvented the vote of the common man? :lolabove:
 
#11
#11
BigPapaVol said:
While the Dems have been in the spotlight and that might be good, Hillary's stubborn drive to the convention is likely to eviscerate the Dems for '08.
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agreed. generally, i still don't get the feeling people trust her. the debate the other night when they went back thru the whole Bosnia sniper episode was classic.
 
#12
#12
One thing that is happening is states are being contested that normally wouldn't be. As a result, both Dems are building networks in states like PA that they wouldn't have needed to. They are also both bringing out a lot of new democratic voters.

On the downside, if it gets more bitter we may see supporters of one side being apathetic towards the other side in the general election.

In other words, I have no idea.
 
#13
#13
droski said:
yeah can you imagine the person who calls herself the candidate most in touch with the common man winning the democratic nomincation because she circumvented the vote of the common man? :lolabove:
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There is a certain irony there.
 
#14
#14
volinbham said:
One thing that is happening is states are being contested that normally wouldn't be. As a result, both Dems are building networks in states like PA that they wouldn't have needed to. They are also both bringing out a lot of new democratic voters.

On the downside, if it gets more bitter we may see supporters of one side being apathetic towards the other side in the general election.

In other words, I have no idea.
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yep.
 
#15
#15
Two excellent observations here (by you guys).

The faction of the party whose candidate loses out is going to be plenty pissed. I think this is more true if its Obama shut out in the cold and if its the result of some back room deal under suspicious circumstances, the African-American community will be plenty upset and, ore to the point, just not terribly motivated in November.

On the plus side for the Dems, there has been a ton of interest generated in states that normally didn't matter in the nominating process and registration is through the roof. The lingering effect of this is, at a minimum, a decent apparatus for get-out-the-vote and fundraising efforts.
 
#16
#16
well, i have to confess, i'm one of those fence riders.....and i am one of those paying very close attention to both dem candidates.
but in my heart of hearts, i know i can't vote for hillary....she scares the crap out of me. and i just don't trust her. her dealings on the Wal_Mart board, and some of the other, um, 'untrustworthy' items out of her back ground do not give me the warm and fuzzies. Obama is a bit of enigma to me, and i've wanted to find out more about him.

there's things i like, things i don't like.....but either way, the dems have an opportunity to sell me this go around.

so far, i've not been overlly impressed, other than to say, i appreciate Obama's candor regarding the typical political maneurvering......ie, the lapel pin, etc...that, though, is not enough alone to get me to cast a vote for him in November.

i can be sold, that does not i will be. all things being equal, if it's hilllary and mccain, mccain is the one. mccain and barak, i may have a decision to make....
 
#17
#17
jakez4ut said:
i can be sold, that does not i will be. all things being equal, if it's hilllary and mccain, mccain is the one. mccain and barak, i may have a decision to make....
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how come? there's not a bit of substantive difference between Clinton and Obama in terms of policy. Both are big government liberal/socialists who think that all problems can be solved by raising taxes.

There are plenty of things to not like about McCain, but I prefer his stance on tax cuts and judicial nominations.
 
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