Is Obama Black?

#1
volinbham

volinbham

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#1
Not sure how many of you saw Debra Dickerson's appearance on the Colbert Report where she tried to explain why Obama is not "Black" but rather African-African American or African American of immigrant stock (which sounds very dehumanizing).

Here's a perspective on her comments which includes some of the transcript from her interview with Colbert.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/logan-nakyanzi-pollard/blacks-fine-thanks-wri_b_41050.html

While I found this strange, I was offended by this comment from Dickerson:

what this is a critique of white self-congratulation, of saying we're embracing a black person when we're not really
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Colbert correctly responded with:

Listen, if you hadn't told me, he wasn't black I would have thought that I was supporting a black person. And then, I would have been supporting all black people.
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Does she really think the thousands of white supporters of Obama are doing so because they buy into her view that he's not really "black"? Like SC, most probably never thought of it -- why assume their (Obama supporters) are anything but genuine?
 
#2
#2
Isn't it funny how most of the African-Americans in this country are not African-Americans??? See here's the thing, when you come here from another country and you become a citizen here you can claim that. Like if a Canadian came here and became a citizen, then they would be known as a Canadian-American. Same thing with marriage and people keeping their maiden names. The only reason that the African-American term still exists is because of people like Al Sharpton. If everyone was an American and race didn't play a part in that, then he's out of a job. So if you meet a black person and they are born here in the US then they are American and they would be black as far as their skin color nothing more. Its about time to throw that "slave" term out the window IMO and realize that American's are American's. All of us make up this country. The only group of people I have a problem with is the "illegal" immigrants, because they are NOT American's.
 
#3
#3
That is one of the wierdest things that I have ever read. Does she think that just because he didn't descend from West African slaves that he doesn't bear that same burden. My guess is that descendants of slaves don't so much feel the burden as it is passed on from generation to generation as they do in their everyday life. Obama bears the same burden that descendants of slaves bear every day - because when people (who are inclined to make such judgements) look at him, they see a man who is of dark skin and appears to descend from people of Africa - and they call that black....and they will hold the same prejudice against him as they do against black Americans who happened to descend from slaves....IMO.
 
#4
#4
I was reading the Pollard article and came upon this:

So seriously, in fact, that with the Obama announcement this weekend, Australian Prime Minister John Howard launched this premature ejaculation: "If I were running al-Qaeda in Iraq, I would put a circle around March 2008 and be praying as many times as possible for a victory, not only for Obama but also for the Democrats."
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Does she not realize the implications of that quote are not GOOD for Obama, they're BAD. :crazy:
 
#5
#5
rwemyss said:
I was reading the Pollard article and came upon this:





Does she not realize the implications of that quote are not GOOD for Obama, they're BAD. :crazy:
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I think later in the article she sort of acknowledges that by indicating Howard is wrong.
 
#6
#6
TennTradition said:
That is one of the wierdest things that I have ever read. Does she think that just because he didn't descend from West African slaves that he doesn't bear that same burden. My guess is that descendants of slaves don't so much feel the burden as it is passed on from generation to generation as they do in their everyday life. Obama bears the same burden that descendants of slaves bear every day - because when people (who are inclined to make such judgements) look at him, they see a man who is of dark skin and appears to descend from people of Africa - and they call that black....and they will hold the same prejudice against him as they do against black Americans who happened to descend from slaves....IMO.
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Here's the thing, yes there is racisim but by every race, there are racist ppl that are white, black, and any other race there is. its ok for any race to have racial remarks or any type of prejuidice against white ppl. now if white ppl did that to any other race it gets blown up and all over the media. i'm not a racist person, i have friends of every race, and my girl is half korean, half white. i just think its getting old that white ppl supposedly are keepin everyone else down. i don't see it. and i'm tired of how no one can say the N word, but they don't have a problem callin themselves that, nor do they have a problem callin white ppl "honkies, etc." not that that has ever bothered me, cause i think its a pathetic nick name.
 
#7
#7
Vol Mania 21 said:
Here's the thing, yes there is racisim but by every race, there are racist ppl that are white, black, and any other race there is. its ok for any race to have racial remarks or any type of prejuidice against white ppl. now if white ppl did that to any other race it gets blown up and all over the media. i'm not a racist person, i have friends of every race, and my girl is half korean, half white. i just think its getting old that white ppl supposedly are keepin everyone else down. i don't see it. and i'm tired of how no one can say the N word, but they don't have a problem callin themselves that, nor do they have a problem callin white ppl "honkies, etc." not that that has ever bothered me, cause i think its a pathetic nick name.
Click to expand...

I am sometimes annoyed by what you bring up about the N word ... but more because it can be confusing, esp. to a white person who hangs out with a lot of black people (and therefore, if a group doesn't want the word used by some people, then they shouldn't use it...just seems to make sense). I guess you can think of it like the word b**ch...I can say ... what's up b**ch to any one of my guy friends ... or even if they aren't that close of a friend...but I find that if I try that on one of my gal friends...that it doesn't go down so well. I think that it is because of the fact the word can be used in another way ... and even though you're saying it one way to a girl...she may still not feel comfortable with you calling her that...because of the other connotation.

My basic point, though, was just that if one is to experience rascism...they are pretty much equally likely to experience it whether they are black (descended from slaves) or black (parents are from Africa).
 
#8
#8
Or why is someone who is 50/50 White and Black automatically Black? Halle Berry for instance....
 
#11
#11
Black in this country has always been deemed a label of someone descended of slaves and thus a US lineage.

One of my best friends from college is a caucasian from South Africa. He goes around telling people he is African-American just to stir up debate.
 
#12
#12
CSpindizzy said:
Black in this country has always been deemed a label of someone descended of slaves and thus a US lineage.

One of my best friends from college is a caucasian from South Africa. He goes around telling people he is African-American just to stir up debate.
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I think the blog author is disputing that such a definition exists.

Are Egyptian immigrants African-American???
 
#14
#14
Vol Mania 21 said:
Here's the thing, yes there is racisim but by every race, there are racist ppl that are white, black, and any other race there is. its ok for any race to have racial remarks or any type of prejuidice against white ppl. now if white ppl did that to any other race it gets blown up and all over the media. i'm not a racist person, i have friends of every race, and my girl is half korean, half white. i just think its getting old that white ppl supposedly are keepin everyone else down. i don't see it. and i'm tired of how no one can say the N word, but they don't have a problem callin themselves that, nor do they have a problem callin white ppl "honkies, etc." not that that has ever bothered me, cause i think its a pathetic nick name.
Click to expand...

Wow, I've never heard this argument before. You mean black people call themselves the N WORD?! AND WE AREN'T SUPPOSED TO?!
 
#16
#16
CSpindizzy said:
Or why is someone who is 50/50 White and Black automatically Black? Halle Berry for instance....
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I agree with your point, if that is your view?

But I also agree with Obama's view on this. If you are 50/50 black and white. People in America for the most part are going to see you as black. I don't agree with seeing it this way, but I agree that it is done.
 
#17
#17
Vol Mania 21 said:
Here's the thing, yes there is racisim but by every race, there are racist ppl that are white, black, and any other race there is. its ok for any race to have racial remarks or any type of prejuidice against white ppl. now if white ppl did that to any other race it gets blown up and all over the media. i'm not a racist person, i have friends of every race, and my girl is half korean, half white. i just think its getting old that white ppl supposedly are keepin everyone else down. i don't see it. and i'm tired of how no one can say the N word, but they don't have a problem callin themselves that, nor do they have a problem callin white ppl "honkies, etc." not that that has ever bothered me, cause i think its a pathetic nick name.
Click to expand...

I don't know what to say after reading that... I'm not going to get into to half of what you said up there. But first of all, we don't call ourselves ni***rs, we say nigga, I have never known anyone to call anyone white.. A "honkie".. Alot of the anger in the black communities stems from the lack of funds and support that many don't get in the inner cities for schools and other things.. Here in Nashville, there is a real problem with that issue in many of the public schools surrounding the projects. I'll agree that racism exists everywhere, but calling someone a ni***er, stems incredible anger by me and several others for obvious reasons. It's different than calling someone a "honkie". I have never called anyone a cracker, and I dont intend to. Also, most of the names intended for white people come from comedians or racists who still have hate regarding their ancestors. We don't go out looking to call be people crackers and "honkies".
 
#18
#18
And why is African-American a common label, but you never hear someone referred to as an Irish-American or Swedish-American...only white? Why is there black history month, but not white history month? Throughout history most every race has been enslaved, however you really only hear about black slaves...why is that?
 
#19
#19
StunnA N' Orange said:
I don't know what to say after reading that... I'm not going to get into to half of what you said up there. But first of all, we don't call ourselves ni***rs, we say nigga, I have never known anyone to call anyone white.. A "honkie".. Alot of the anger in the black communities stems from the lack of funds and support that many don't get in the inner cities for schools and other things.. Here in Nashville, there is a real problem with that issue in many of the public schools surrounding the projects. I'll agree that racism exists everywhere, but calling someone a ni***er, stems incredible anger by me and several others for obvious reasons. It's different than calling someone a "honkie". I have never called anyone a cracker, and I dont intend to. Also, most of the names intended for white people come from comedians or racists who still have hate regarding their ancestors. We don't go out looking to call be people crackers and "honkies".
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There are plenty of rascist terms for different white heritages, that were not conceived by comedians. "Mick", "WOP", "Dego", "Kike". Yet, I have never called any of my Irish Catholic friends "Mick, Micka, or Mickey." I have never heard two Italian-Americans turn and through around variations of "WOP" and "Dego", nor any Jewish-Americans making word plays of "Kike". Nor did African Americans go around calling each other "Nigga" or "******" prior to the generation that was conceived in the late 1970s.

I am not saying it is right or wrong. However, your historical context is completely askew.
 
#20
#20
therealUT said:
There are plenty of rascist terms for different white heritages, that were not conceived by comedians. "Mick", "WOP", "Dego", "Kike". Yet, I have never called any of my Irish Catholic friends "Mick, Micka, or Mickey." I have never heard two Italian-Americans turn and through around variations of "WOP" and "Dego", nor any Jewish-Americans making word plays of "Kike". Nor did African Americans go around calling each other "Nigga" or "******" prior to the generation that was conceived in the late 1970s.

I am not saying it is right or wrong. However, your historical context is completely askew.
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Nice! Also, I must have missed it, but how did school funding get into the topic?
 
#21
#21
therealUT said:
There are plenty of rascist terms for different white heritages, that were not conceived by comedians. "Mick", "WOP", "Dego", "Kike". Yet, I have never called any of my Irish Catholic friends "Mick, Micka, or Mickey." I have never heard two Italian-Americans turn and through around variations of "WOP" and "Dego", nor any Jewish-Americans making word plays of "Kike". Nor did African Americans go around calling each other "Nigga" or "******" prior to the generation that was conceived in the late 1970s.

I am not saying it is right or wrong. However, your historical context is completely askew.
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Did I say they were all conceived by comedians??? Notice the second part of my statement.. Many came well prior to that, but with BET and other networks it has spread more.. It doesn't matter when we started calling each other nigga, and you don't know why we call each other that or why we use it in the way we do. And it was actually used earlier than the late 70's, my father used it back early in Vietnam. I was also telling him the difference between the two words. I also don't see why you went on a rant about other ethicnic groups nick names as well.. I simply responded to his comments. It had nothing to do with about half of what you just posted.
 
#22
#22
I noticed your statement. I am still firm that your historical context is askew. Also, the fact that I don't know why African-Americans continue to carry that derogatory term with them, is of no count in this argument. I do not use the word. You do. Therefore, the burden of knowing 'why' rests completely on your shoulders.
 
#23
#23
StunnA N' Orange said:
I don't know what to say after reading that... I'm not going to get into to half of what you said up there. But first of all, we don't call ourselves ni***rs, we say nigga, I have never known anyone to call anyone white.. A "honkie".. Alot of the anger in the black communities stems from the lack of funds and support that many don't get in the inner cities for schools and other things.. Here in Nashville, there is a real problem with that issue in many of the public schools surrounding the projects. I'll agree that racism exists everywhere, but calling someone a ni***er, stems incredible anger by me and several others for obvious reasons. It's different than calling someone a "honkie". I have never called anyone a cracker, and I dont intend to. Also, most of the names intended for white people come from comedians or racists who still have hate regarding their ancestors. We don't go out looking to call be people crackers and "honkies".
Click to expand...

Any thoughts on Dickerson's position? Any information on how widely held her position is among the AA community?

I've heard comments where I work that follow her thinking. In one instance, I've heard it said by other African-Americans that hiring a guy from Nigeria didn't really count as hiring a black person. In another incident, a black member of Carribean descent has been somewhat isolated because he's "not fighting for the cause".

Just two incidents but I don't know how widespread this perspective is.
 
#24
#24
therealUT said:
I noticed your statement. I am still firm that your historical context is askew. Also, the fact that I don't know why African-Americans continue to carry that derogatory term with them, is of no count in this argument. I do not use the word. You do. Therefore, the burden of knowing 'why' rests completely on your shoulders.
Click to expand...

Your context is cpmpletely "askew" with when we actually started using the term. As well as determining it is a burden. I don't think I can take anything you say anymore with any valued credibility with your above statements..
 
#25
#25
I'd like to see how this debate would shape up if Obama were conservative/libertarian in his outlook and running as a GOP candidate. His "blackness" would be questioned by everybody with a stake in keeping the black community solidly in the hands of the democrats.
 
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