March 1997, Manning announces he's staying

#1
Boca Vol

Boca Vol

Originally from Exit 81
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#1
I was looking at the Foster love/non-love on here and it got me thinking about when Manning decided to return for his Sr. season and how it relates to Bray.

Manning's Jr. year stats:

Att Comp Yards TD's
380 243 3287 20

Bray's Jr. year stats:

Att Comp Yards TD's
451 268 3612 34

For those old enough to remember when Manning announced he was coming back for his Sr. is was a huge deal for UT. No one seems to care if Bray stays or goes.

For those that simply look at stats, they look to favor Bray. For those that understand football, you would take Manning's command of the game every time.

I just thought it was very interesting to see how much differently fans reacted to Manning vs. Bray when Bray could have held a lot of UT records had he stayed.

Would anyone argue he would have been the best QB in UT's history? I don't think so.
 
#2
#2
It's a simple as comparing the two in one way and one way only.

One is a winner in every sense of the word and one is a loser.

Nothing else matters
 
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#3
#3
2 things, Manning grew up in a pro atmosphere, and the day he announced, I found out my wife was having my baby girl! what a great day!

Bray will be better with coaching
 
#4
#4
BruinVol said:
It's a simple as comparing the two in one way and one way only.

One is a winner in every sense of the word and one is a loser.

Nothing else matters
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Must...resist...urge... :)

The biggest difference between Manning and Bray is between the ears. Bray played the QB position with his arm moreso than his head. Manning was his polar opposite in that regard.
 
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#5
#5
Can we let it go? Like seriously it's just sad now. No other fanbase in America seems to bash their former players more than Vol fans.
 
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#6
#6
BruinVol said:
It's a simple as comparing the two in one way and one way only.

One is a winner in every sense of the word and one is a loser.

Nothing else matters
Click to expand...

A loser? Really? Don't be a grown man jerk, ok? His stats were better. Imagine he had a better coach, or even a decent defense this year. You pricks wouldn't be calling him a loser.
 
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#8
#8
peyton4heisman said:
Papa Bray? That you?
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His response was a little over the top but he does have a point. Bray, CP, Zach Rogers, Justin Hunter, Raijon Neal, Marlin Lane, Tiny Richardson, Dallas Thomas, Zach Fulton, Ja'Wuan James, James Stone, and Mychal Rivera all deserve a lot of credit. These players went out there game after game and gave it their all so that we could even get the 5 wins that we got.

You can hardly blame these guys for the ineptitude at coaching in all aspects. By midway through the season I could predict what kind of play we were going to run before the snap and if I as a fan can do it then I have no doubt that a D Coordinator that studies the film could do it.

As far as defense we all know how that went.
 
#9
#9
knucklehead_vol said:
A loser? Really? Don't be a grown man jerk, ok? His stats were better. Imagine he had a better coach, or even a decent defense this year. You pricks wouldn't be calling him a loser.
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His behavior on and off the field opened himself up for criticism of his character. He simply has shown none of the characteristics a winning leader should exhibit.
 
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#10
#10
BruinVol said:
His behavior on and off the field opened himself up for criticism of his character. He simply has shown none of the characteristics a winning leader should exhibit.
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Be honest. The only reason you care about his behavior is because we weren't winning.
 
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#11
#11
BruinVol said:
His behavior on and off the field opened himself up for criticism of his character. He simply has shown none of the characteristics a winning leader should exhibit.
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I was just bored and curious what Manning's numbers were his Jr. year. I remember he was very, very good but the numbers these qb's are putting up now are crazy!

The behavior part I tend to agree with. Manning was much more team/community focused. He only had the mooning incident...which at the time, I thought why was there a female trainer in there anyway.
 
#12
#12
Look I'll say Bray is a good NOT great starting quarterback. Will TN fans miss him? Yes---but the roster constructed around him was a mess. We will never know what this kid could have done with at least an average defense or a comparable running game. It's a frustrating point to consider. All the knucklehead antics aside Tyler probably is going to be one of these polarizing players. I'll say the kid didn't deserve all the blame and negativity. He also didn't get enough credit for his ability IMO. I wish the best for him in the NFL.
 
#13
#13
GAVol said:
Be honest. The only reason you care about his behavior is because we weren't winning.
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The question is are the the two related??

IMO his behavior is connected to his inability to be a winning leader
 
#14
#14
Who thinks Tyler will be like Foster and surprise people in the NFL?
 
#15
#15
I think the best place for Bray is in SF under Harbaugh or Pittsburgh under Tomlin. He needs to go somewhere with great leadership in place with the coach and veteran players. It would be great for him to sit for 2-3 years and learn how to be a pro. It's a totally different game than college and is more about adapting. I don't hate Bray, but I'm very disappointed that he never became the QB and leader he could have been.
 
#16
#16
The day or so before the Kentucky loss and also the Vandy loss, does anyone know if Bray had some type of altercation or event that would have made his numbers suffer like they did? It's like something must have happened that caused him to be so unprepared or just not into those games.
 
#18
#18
bigorange247 said:
The day or so before the Kentucky loss and also the Vandy loss, does anyone know if Bray had some type of altercation or event that would have made his numbers suffer like they did? It's like something must have happened that caused him to be so unprepared or just not into those games.
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He was sick and unmotivated.
 
#20
#20
GAVol said:
I can give you example after example of leaders who did dumb stuff.
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Sure you can but they also lead their teams to being better than they really were. Great leaders raise their teams to be over achievers.
 
#21
#21
BruinVol said:
Sure you can but they also lead their teams to being better than they really were. Great leaders raise their teams to be over achievers.
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Not saying anything near that Bray is better than Manning, but didn't we have one of, if not THE, highest scoring offenses ever this year?

...definitely warrants mentioning.


Overall, though, it's Manning by miles and miles and miles.

Bray reminds me of a Nuke LaLoosh minus a Crash Davis (at least in Bull Durham terms, anyway). Manning was fortunate enough to have his Crash Davis in David Cutcliffe, Bray...notsomuch.
 
#23
#23
thebjd said:
Bray is no different than Clausen attitude wise.
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Completely disagree.

Clausen and Bray may have that far too often uttered characteristic of "California cool," off the field, but in terms of game day attitude, they are very different.

Clausen earned his nickname "Ice-Man" not just because he looked like the guy on Top Gun; he was one of the best QB's on the road I've ever seen--he's the only QB I know of that is undefeated in Gainesville.

Bray seemed to get rattled far too easily when the proverbial <ahem> poo hit the fan.

That's as objective an observation as I can give. I'm not in the habit of bashing our current or former players, it's just my opinion.

I wish Bray well...but I think he would have been MUCH better suited to stay in college one more year.
 
#24
#24
thebjd said:
Bray is no different than Clausen attitude wise.
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I don't recall CC having multiple run ins with the law, significant rumors of failed drug test, and a work ethic that didn't include film study.

Did he have those same issues?
 
#25
#25
BruinVol said:
I can give you countless examples of real leaders that played very sick/injured and were very motivated. Winners never have trouble being motivated.
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That's because in hindsight nobody ever questions the motivation of the team that just won. Plenty of guys have dogged it, but still gotten by. Not saying Bray was a particularly good leader; just pointing out how fans build a narrative around players based on game outcomes which is sometimes true and sometimes not.
 
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