Peyton Manning

[Leonard Shelby]

Your right hat. PM sucks. He did nothing at or for UT and now he is a drain on Indy. But the real person to blame here is CPF. Before Manning came to UT he was a winner but after 4 years with Fulmer he is now the biggest loser of all time.
do you feel better now?

He was a winner before UT??? I have never read anything that points to any high school state championships for Peyton...

 

[Leonard Shelby]

I totally agree with that as the nature of the QB position. What I'm talking about is the extra emphasis on PM as someone who can't win in the playoffs. Because that is presumed to be fact, every loss is blamed on him - see the quotes from the NYP article I posted that openly admit virtually no-one on the team played well and say that PM is not entirely to blame after just saying he was.

As I said before - he had two of the highest (if not the highest) rated QB performances in history yet the legacy is that he is sub-par (when he had a statistically better game than most of the other QBs in the playoffs).

And one of those might as well have taken place in the Pac-10...There was over 900 yards of total offense in the Colts-Chiefs playoff game a couple years ago. Trent Green put up as good of numbers as Peyton Manning did!

 

[Leonard Shelby]

Both are very good QB's (Favre better IMO) not taking anything away from them. The point is that PM has gotten a tremendous amount of neg pub (more than he deserves) compared to other great qb's who did not win a Super Bowl.
So let me ask this. Is winning a Super Bowl the water mark for being a great qb? I mean we know that EVERY qb of the SB winning team was a great qb right? I mean Plunkett was great and more recently the Ravens had a phenominal qb. The media is lazy. They here one make a comment or read a comment and that is the story. It is like that in sports and hard news. I think PM will win a ring before it is all said and done. When he does they will forgive and talk about how long it took but they will stop.

No, but Super Bowl winning QBs that come from passing offenses are usually pretty great. If you build your team around the pass, like the Colts have since Manning arrived, then yes, it is your QBs fault when you can't put up more than 18 points in your own dome. People can point to protection as much as they want, but the fact is, the Steeler's were sending five and six men at Manning on almost every single down. Manning couldn't make the correct reads or find the open receivers.

Heck, on 4th and 16, Manning took a sack!!! At least throw the ball up for grabs in that situation.

The Colts had the ball, 2nd and 2 with under 1:00 left and couldn't pick up the first down (Manning should have been picked on 3rd and 2, and he underthrew Wayne on 2nd and 2.) Those are situations and throws that clutch QBs make.

 

[GAVol]

Heck, on 4th and 16, Manning took a sack!!! At least throw the ball up for grabs in that situation.

As hard as it is to believe, I don't think there was anyway to get that ball off. It was an absolute jailbreak.

 

[VolBeef88]

No, but Super Bowl winning QBs that come from passing offenses are usually pretty great. If you build your team around the pass, like the Colts have since Manning arrived, then yes, it is your QBs fault when you can't put up more than 18 points in your own dome. People can point to protection as much as they want, but the fact is, the Steeler's were sending five and six men at Manning on almost every single down. Manning couldn't make the correct reads or find the open receivers.

Heck, on 4th and 16, Manning took a sack!!! At least throw the ball up for grabs in that situation.

The Colts had the ball, 2nd and 2 with under 1:00 left and couldn't pick up the first down (Manning should have been picked on 3rd and 2, and he underthrew Wayne on 2nd and 2.) Those are situations and throws that clutch QBs make.

Did you watch the game! I don't know how many times he looked to the hot read and NO ONE TURNED. You can bash PM all you want. There is a reason he has caught more heat than just about any other QB I can remember in the NFL and while in college. He is that good. No one bashes the bad or even average qb's. You want clutch in that game? How about the TD toss and the 2 pointer? Your dislike for him won't change just like the fact he IS the best qb won't change.

 

[hatvol96]

Did you watch the game! I don't know how many times he looked to the hot read and NO ONE TURNED. You can bash PM all you want. There is a reason he has caught more heat than just about any other QB I can remember in the NFL and while in college. He is that good. No one bashes the bad or even average qb's. You want clutch in that game? How about the TD toss and the 2 pointer? Your dislike for him won't change just like the fact he IS the best qb won't change.

"No one bashes the bad or even average qbs." Did you read the Ainge/Clausen threads this year?

 

[volinbham]

And one of those might as well have taken place in the Pac-10...There was over 900 yards of total offense in the Colts-Chiefs playoff game a couple years ago. Trent Green put up as good of numbers as Peyton Manning did!

While the total offensive numbers were close, Trent Green didn't put up PM numbers.

PM 22-30 (73%); 304 yards; 3 TD's
TG 18-30 (60%); 212 yards; 1 TD.

Manning's numbers in the loss to Pittsburgh were better than Green's numbers in that game!

PM combined in the Denver and KC game for the following numbers - 44-of-56 for 681 yards, eight touchdowns, no interceptions and a gaudy 156.9 quarterback rating. What a choker!

 

[hatvol96]

While the total offensive numbers were close, Trent Green didn't put up PM numbers.

PM 22-30 (73%); 304 yards; 3 TD's
TG 18-30 (60%); 212 yards; 1 TD.

Manning's numbers in the loss to Pittsburgh were better than Green's numbers in that game!

PM combined in the Denver and KC game for the following numbers - 44-of-56 for 681 yards, eight touchdowns, no interceptions and a gaudy 156.9 quarterback rating. What a choker!

I don't think anyone is going to confuse those defenses with the '85 Bears or the '86 Giants.

 

[Leonard Shelby]

I don't think anyone is going to confuse those defenses with the '85 Bears or the '86 Giants.

Only Colts, wait, I mean Manning fans! How many of these posters were Colts fans back in the days before Peyton? The only reason they cheer for the Colts is because of Peyton (therefore he is the team to them,) yet, when his team loses, then they recognize the other 21 players. Just face it, Golden Boy Manning will not ever win a championship, the sooner you accept that fact the easier it will be.

 

[volinbham]

I don't think anyone is going to confuse those defenses with the '85 Bears or the '86 Giants.

So what? That's not the point. PM entered these games with the label as a guy who can't win the big one. He put up record QB rating numbers. Other QB's have played less than stellar defenses and have not performed as well. These were 2 outstanding performances in BIG games. He didn't choke, let the team down, fail to come through or whatever else. He kicked some serious butt but that gets forgotten and the losses become magnified.

Further, considering that the Steelers defense is much better than the Colts defense was in 2004, PM's performance yesterday was arguably better than Trent Green's in that 2004 game (to get back to the original point).

 

[VolBeef88]

"No one bashes the bad or even average qbs." Did you read the Ainge/Clausen threads this year?

Fans of a team will. But not the rest of the world.

 

[VolBeef88]

Only Colts, wait, I mean Manning fans! How many of these posters were Colts fans back in the days before Peyton? The only reason they cheer for the Colts is because of Peyton (therefore he is the team to them,) yet, when his team loses, then they recognize the other 21 players. Just face it, Golden Boy Manning will not ever win a championship, the sooner you accept that fact the easier it will be.

Go away troll!

 

[JasonCajun]

Go away troll!

I swear this joker is the sonofajohn troll under a new name.

You put any QB in the situation Manning was in yesterday and they would have looked mediocre. The O-Line wasn't protecting, just like they weren't protecting in the SD game. I watched time after time Steelers DL break through even double teams. The Colts need to revamp their O-Line.

And I said it before, it is a mistake every time for a team to rest their starters like the Colts did before the playoff. You lose every bit of rhythm that you built throughout the season.

 

[bleedingorange]

Come on guys everybody knows u win as a team and lose as a team. No way that loss was Peytons fault. U guys seen the pressure he was under, any other QB in the NFL would have done worse than what he done yesterday, besides his numbers werent that bad anyways. Look back in history u gotta have a strong defense to win championships, not great by any means just strong. The Colts defense is not there yet, they are getting better though they just need to keep picking up strong defensive players. The Steelers have been in playoff mode for over a month now, they were better prepared for the game on both sides of the ball. The long layoff and the fact that they had home field adv. so early hurt the colts in ways that they havent really had to play hard in over a month. They just werent ready for the Steeler pressure yesterday and thats the bottom line. :no:

 

[tidwell]

At what point do people start questioning Tony Dungy? I'm sure he's a great guy and he is a winner in the regular season, but this is exactly how things went for him in Tampa Bay. He never could get them over the hump and to the Super Bowl.

 

[bigorange#1]

I agree with you tidwell,I just don't think much of Dungys coaching,when the colts had the ball down on the 1 or 2 yd line in the 2nd qtr they should have went for it,instead Dungy coaching like CPF kicked the ball,Dungy has no conans....I blame the coaching for setting most the starters out for the last couple games to the pathetic O-line & suspect D to the kicker right on down to the wr's & some of the blame has to go to Manning but most of the blame is on DUNGY!

 

[Volman1970]

Manning is always calling audibles from the line and full control of the O. Why didn't he just change to better protection.Yeah all of a sudden things isn't working and NOW it's the blocking???? You can't have it both ways. I hope people seen our favorite network. ESPN where they showed on a few plays when the Colts was going for it all at the end when Edge and Clark were both wide open on the checkoffs

 

[volfan2024]

I think when all was said and done, the Steelers should have won. I am a huge Peyton fan. Lets face it, the whole freaking team was rusty and that includes Peyton. The steelers probably did get some bad calls. I will say hats off to coach Dungy for the hell he's been through and coaching. One thing though, colts did beat steelers and patriots this year.Honestly felt bad for Jerome Bettis and it would have been bad if his last game he went out with a fumble that cost them.Fact: Al Wilson may win a super bowl this year, again bypassing Peyton, no college nc as Al had and so far no superbowl which Al may get.Peyton will get one one year though.Hope so!

 

[duct_tape_wallet]

It seemed like every time Manning was sacked, it was from a man coming at him totally unblocked. I wonder if things would be different had Indy used a fullback instead of an extra TE for blitz pickup. Indy is one of those no-fullback teams, but I wonder if an extra guy in the backfield could have used those extra two or three steps afforded him to pick up the free man.

 

[volinbham]

At what point do people start questioning Tony Dungy? I'm sure he's a great guy and he is a winner in the regular season, but this is exactly how things went for him in Tampa Bay. He never could get them over the hump and to the Super Bowl.

Let's see, he built a pretty solid defense in Indy where there was none. Until the San Diego game, the Colts were undefeated. San Diego played a great game and beat the Colts. Then Dungy's son committed suicide and the Colts started sliding. I'm amazed he could coach at all given what happened. This was the best Colts team since Johnny U days and Dungy got them there. If the situation with his son didn't occur, I'd be with you but clearly that had to impact his coaching over the last month.

 

[Leonard Shelby]

So what? That's not the point. PM entered these games with the label as a guy who can't win the big one. He put up record QB rating numbers. Other QB's have played less than stellar defenses and have not performed as well. These were 2 outstanding performances in BIG games. He didn't choke, let the team down, fail to come through or whatever else. He kicked some serious butt but that gets forgotten and the losses become magnified.

Further, considering that the Steelers defense is much better than the Colts defense was in 2004, PM's performance yesterday was arguably better than Trent Green's in that 2004 game (to get back to the original point).

BIG GAME??? Did the NFL start awarding Trophies for First Round Playoff wins???

 

[Vols4life]

At what point do people start questioning Tony Dungy? I'm sure he's a great guy and he is a winner in the regular season, but this is exactly how things went for him in Tampa Bay. He never could get them over the hump and to the Super Bowl.
[/quote/]

Me being a TB Bucs fan in 99 the Bucs were robbed by the refs on a Bert Emmanual catch that the refs said he didn't and that cost us a trip to the SB....But Dungy is an excellent coach he wa s put in Indy to improve the defense...not the offense...After this years NFL draft he will probably have his defense exactly how he wants it...but the Colts just played there worst game at the wrong time is all that happend...I think they peaked to early in the season and the steelers and broncos are peaking at the right time :twocents:

 

[volinbham]

BIG GAME??? Did the NFL start awarding Trophies for First Round Playoff wins???

:lol: :lol: by your logic, PM has never lost a big game. Some might suggest that every playoff game is a big game since it's win or go home. If only the National Championship game and Superbowl count as big games in football then he has NEVER lost a big game. :crazy:

 

[Leonard Shelby]

:lol: :lol: by your logic, PM has never lost a big game. Some might suggest that every playoff game is a big game since it's win or go home. If only the National Championship game and Superbowl count as big games in football then he has NEVER lost a big game. :crazy:

That's fine with me...conceding that point though, you do admit that he has never earned his way into the big game.

 

[volinbham]

That's fine with me...conceding that point though, you do admit that he has never earned his way into the big game.

If the Superbowl or NC in college is the big game then I would say he's never played in either. I believe it is extremely rare where one player can "earn" their way in. On the other hand I don't believe he's ever "cost" his team the chance to advance which is the implication behind saying he can't win the big one.