Recruiting vs Rankings

#1
W

WA_Vol

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#1
Here is the current poll rankings. In parenthesis is the rank of each teams recruiting class 4 years ago in 2002.

2005 Rankings
1 USC (11)
2 Texas (1)
3 Penn State (21)
4 Ohio State (5)
5 Notre Dame (24)
6 Oregon (49)
7 Auburn (6)
8 Georgia (3)
9 Miami (FL) (8)
10 LSU (15)
11 West Virginia (37)
12 Virginia Tech (45)
13 Alabama (30)
14 TCU (80)
15 Louisville (59)
16 Florida (20)
17 UCLA (9)
18 Texas Tech (48)
19 Boston College (17)
20 Michigan (16)
21 Wisconsin (50)
22 Florida State (4)
23 Clemson (22)
24 Georgia Tech (63)
25 Iowa (51)

Every team in the top 10 had a top 25 recruiting class except for Oregon. But for the most part it doesnt seem to make a big difference.
Several teams didnt have recruiting classes in the top 50 and are still ranked in the top 25 four years later. If your in a weak conference you can still sneak into the top 10 where if you were in the SEC you probably wouldnt even have a winning record i.e. TCU, Wisconsin, Georgia Tech, Iowa.
 
#2
#2
Good work Okie. I posted this in another thread, but IMO the top five recruiting has left UT with a bunch of lazy coaches. They will not survive on recruiting merits or past success anymore. I will be happy with a top 15 class after what they were able to do in recruiting last year.
 
#3
#3
There are so many variables when it comes to recruiting..systems, player development, etc...but if you are going to survive in the SEC you better bring in some bigtime recruits to contend for a title.
 
#4
#4
development is the main concern for me. we have had amazing players out of recruiting and they have been duds. i just hope the Cutcliffe thing works for us.
 
#5
#5
(Lexvol @ Dec 31 said:
Good work Okie. I posted this in another thread, but IMO the top five recruiting has left UT with a bunch of lazy coaches. They will not survive on recruiting merits or past success anymore. I will be happy with a top 15 class after what they were able to do in recruiting last year.
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Sometimes I think the UT recruiting philosophy goes like this.

1) Read Rivals and Scout. Recruit all the 5 and 4 stars = crap against the wall.
2) Recruit key in state players who will embarass UT by going to Bammer or out of state.
3) Recruit in states where our competition is to take from them, give to us double whammy
4) Screw player assessment and development. To hard, we're not Tuberville.
 
#7
#7
I don't know, sounds like a little bit of rationalizing to me from fans of a program that has not recruited very well at all so far this year.

Just being honest.
 
#8
#8
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
I don't know, sounds like a little bit of rationalizing to me from fans of a program that has not recruited very well at all so far this year.

Just being honest.
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I was in that camp for a while. However this year changed my thinking some. Four years ago we had the no. 1 recruiting class in the nation, and end up going 5-6 four years later. So for Fulmer anyways, it doesnt seem to make a difference.
 
#9
#9
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
I don't know, sounds like a little bit of rationalizing to me from fans of a program that has not recruited very well at all so far this year.

Just being honest.
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Is there such a thing as an honest attorney?? :cool:
 
#10
#10
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
I don't know, sounds like a little bit of rationalizing to me from fans of a program that has not recruited very well at all so far this year.

Just being honest.
Click to expand...

I'm sure you were typing that with a grin on your face. :disappointed:

 
#11
#11
(oklavol @ Jan 2 said:
I was in that camp for a while. However this year changed my thinking some. Four years ago we had the no. 1 recruiting class in the nation, and end up going 5-6 four years later. So for Fulmer anyways, it doesnt seem to make a difference.
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Unless it is a function of what 85 % of the folks on this board seem to think, which is that CPF & Co. screwed the pooch with some damn fine talent by just not developing it well.

What was your rank recruiting wise both 3 and 4 years prior to the national championship year? I'd be real curious to see that.
 
#15
#15
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
Unless it is a function of what 85 % of the folks on this board seem to think, which is that CPF & Co. screwed the pooch with some damn fine talent by just not developing it well.
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depends on which camp your in. one camp says fulmer needed to get rid of the assistants, even though fulmer makes more then all of them combined multiplied by 4. another camp says recruiting is overrated, another camp says fulmer is the problem.
 
#16
#16
(oklavol @ Jan 2 said:
depends on which camp your in. one camp says fulmer needed to get rid of the assistants, even though fulmer makes more then all of them combined multiplied by 4. another camp says recruiting is overrated, another camp says fulmer is the problem.
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I'm a Gator fan and so don't know nearly as much about UT football as most on here. If I had to vote, I'd probably vote for camp # 3 (the last one) but a big part of that is that I have never thought much of him as a game-day strategist. In which camp are you?
 
#17
#17
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
I'm a Gator fan and so don't know nearly as much about UT football as most on here. If I had to vote, I'd probably vote for camp # 3 (the last one) but a big part of that is that I have never thought much of him as a game-day strategist. In which camp are you?
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camp 3 definitely. I dont think its fair to blame assistants (randy sanders) who are making around 200k for the problems when you got a HC making 2.2 million. Doesnt seem fair to me.

I dont see how Fulmer gets a pass on things such as the poor play on the offensive lines, an area he is suppose to know a lot about. How many bad qb's did spurrier turn out at Florida? Some areas like special teams maybe this isnt Fulmer's strength and an assistant needs to be replaced but the O-line? You would think Fulmer could fix the problems with the Oline without having to hire someone to do it.

Recruiting isnt as important if your in a weak conference, but in the SEC with as much talent as this league has, its vitally important.
 
#18
#18
(oklavol @ Jan 2 said:
camp 3 definitely. I dont think its fair to blame assistants (randy sanders) who are making around 200k for the problems when you got a HC making 2.2 million. Doesnt seem fair to me.

Recruiting isnt as important if your in a weak conference, but in the SEC with as much talent as this league has, its vitally important.
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I agree. But to me it is a necessary but not sufficient condition for success. In other words, you have got to compete for top talent. But even if you do, its no guarantee of success. In the SEC, week in and week out, got to produce and stay tight and disciplined.

Did you watch Notre Dame and OSU? To me, both of those teams were outstanding in terms of drive and heart and talent. Now, put them in the SEC and maybe they are not as successful as they were this year. But in terms of bowl game performance I think both were excellent football teams. With Meyer, I expect to see UF reach that level of consistent play. And with the talent Florida can get year in and year out, UF really ought to be nationally competitive very shortly.

This was a good year for Florida. Can't wait for next year and really looking forward to 2007 campaign already!
 
#19
#19
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
I agree. But to me it is a necessary but not sufficient condition for success. In other words, you have got to compete for top talent. But even if you do, its no guarantee of success. In the SEC, week in and week out, got to produce and stay tight and disciplined.

Did you watch Notre Dame and OSU? To me, both of those teams were outstanding in terms of drive and heart and talent. Now, put them in the SEC and maybe they are not as successful as they were this year. But in terms of bowl game performance I think both were excellent football teams. With Meyer, I expect to see UF reach that level of consistent play. And with the talent Florida can get year in and year out, UF really ought to be nationally competitive very shortly.

This was a good year for Florida. Can't wait for next year and really looking forward to 2007 campaign already!
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I would be very optimistic if I were a Florida fan. I thought Meyer was a good hire even when he struggled at first. It appears that Florida State and Miami may be in a little downturn, so the Gaters should have good recruiting years.

I'm not optimistic for UT in the short term i.e. Fulmer's remaining time as coach. However, in the long term we will be back as a contender for conference and national titles. Our tradition is too strong. I think we are similar to Ohio State, Oklahoma, or Michigan and just one correct head coach hire away from glory again. AD Hamilton based on his BB hire of bruce Pearl seems to be a judge of coaching talent.
 
#20
#20
(rockydoc @ Jan 2 said:
AD Hamilton based on his BB hire of bruce Pearl seems to be a judge of coaching talent.
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Didn't he hire a firm to do that for him?
 
#21
#21
(rockydoc @ Jan 2 said:
I would be very optimistic if I were a Florida fan. I thought Meyer was a good hire even when he struggled at first. It appears that Florida State and Miami may be in a little downturn, so the Gaters should have good recruiting years.

I'm not optimistic for UT in the short term i.e. Fulmer's remaining time as coach. However, in the long term we will be back as a contender for conference and national titles. Our tradition is too strong. I think we are similar to Ohio State, Oklahoma, or Michigan and just one correct head coach hire away from glory again. AD Hamilton based on his BB hire of bruce Pearl seems to be a judge of coaching talent.
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Excellent post and I think the comparison to OSU of, say, 6-10 years ago is dead on. A vibrant young coach who can recruit and who brings discipline and excitement to the Vols could make a huge difference down the road. As is, I don't see Fulmer leaving unless he is forced out. He might not be as wildly (and irrationally) popular as, say, a Bobby Bowden or Joe Paterno at their respective schools, but he is entrenched enough that it is going to take a lot to get him to move on (I see him retiring, not going to another school or to the NFL).

 
#22
#22
Right you are. he'll put up a few more years of average but not great seasons like say a R.C. Slocum did at A&M and eventually resign and fade into the sunset with a nice severance package. In the interim I think I'll plan some skiing trips out west around New Years when the major bowls are played.
 
#23
#23
(rockydoc @ Jan 3 said:
I would be very optimistic if I were a Florida fan. I thought Meyer was a good hire even when he struggled at first. It appears that Florida State and Miami may be in a little downturn, so the Gaters should have good recruiting years.

I'm not optimistic for UT in the short term i.e. Fulmer's remaining time as coach. However, in the long term we will be back as a contender for conference and national titles. Our tradition is too strong. I think we are similar to Ohio State, Oklahoma, or Michigan and just one correct head coach hire away from glory again. AD Hamilton based on his BB hire of bruce Pearl seems to be a judge of coaching talent.
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Yeah i agree. Meyer was pretty impressive at Utah, and he seems adept enough to change his scheme to find something that works. I think Fulmer is gonna struggle with all these new coaches in the league, LSU, Florida, Auburn, Georgia, and it appears Bama may have turned the corner this year too.
 
#24
#24
(lawgator1 @ Jan 2 said:
Did you watch Notre Dame and OSU? To me, both of those teams were outstanding in terms of drive and heart and talent. Now, put them in the SEC and maybe they are not as successful as they were this year. But in terms of bowl game performance I think both were excellent football teams. With Meyer, I expect to see UF reach that level of consistent play. And with the talent Florida can get year in and year out, UF really ought to be nationally competitive very shortly.
Click to expand...


I think those 2 coaches got the most out of their team by motivating them to play above themselves.

Meyer's pretty original, he created his own scheme and offensive philosophy while at Utah. If it doesnt work at Florida, he will continue to modify it does work.
 
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