Space Exploration

Are NASA's future missions and budget justified?

  • It's worth the time and expenditures

    Votes: 223 66.0%

  • Complete waste of money

    Votes: 41 12.1%

  • We need to explore, but not at the current cost

    Votes: 74 21.9%
  • Total voters
    338
#476
#476
Grand Vol said:
Discussed as well in this thread lol.

To me as I stated before, we've never really taken the logical steps into the cosmos like that. We're still in the exploratory mode and haven't crossed the threshold into colonization yet. But I'd assume that would be an eventual step in the process.

Mars does make a good jumping point for exploration of the outer solar system. Resupplying said colony wouldn't be easy and it would need self sustainment to a degree. And the only way to determine what would be needed for that partial self sustainment would be exploration in the beginning.

And for PKT, it would make a well located base to serve as a dandy anti-PHA platform to knock off inbound threats to Earth. :)
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Thanks....I haven't been to this thread in awhile now & forgot what was discussed here without going back & reading all that's been said. And now the thread has been turned into a topic of God & His Glory.
 
#477
#477
PKT_VOL said:
Precisely. Which goes against the glory argument.
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How so? It's contradictory for Him to design the universe in such a way that it displays His glory, and then humble Himself to save us?

Jesus was both God's message to man about God, and also God's message to man about man as man should be. It's a theological concept known as the hypostatic union.

So, the section of scripture carries this message:

"God, who deserves all glory, out of love for you, still humbled Himself on your account. So no matter how much glory you think you deserve, humble yourself anyway. God who deserves all glory gave you the example. Not deserving glory, humble yourself."

How is that a contradictory message?
 
#478
#478
W.TN.Orange Blood said:
Thanks....I haven't been to this thread in awhile now & forgot what was discussed here without going back & reading all that's been said. And now the thread has been turned into a topic of God & His Glory.
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Which as I pointed out hasn't been turned into a "you're a stupid head" debate yet.
 
#479
#479
PKT_VOL said:
Like I stated earlier, I seem to think more highly of your God than you do (bigger purpose than glory).
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I disagree. You seem intent on lowering Him to our level, I am intent to raise Him far above.

And good luck in your poker game. :hi:
 
#480
#480
I can't read through all of this debate so I must ask just a few questions;

1) for the devout, God is all powerful and there is only one God, correct? If this is your belief why couldn't God create other worlds and intelligent life?
2) Where in the Bible does it say Earth and man are the only creations of God?

IMHO, we are not alone in the universe, God had to create more than just us.
 
#481
#481
hog88 said:
I can't read through all of this debate so I must ask just a few questions;

1) for the devout, God is all powerful and there is only one God, correct? If this is your belief why couldn't God create other worlds and intelligent life?
2) Where in the Bible does it say Earth and man are the only creations of God?

IMHO, we are not alone in the universe, God had to create more than just us.
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1) He could.
2) It doesn't specifically speak to this. Any belief is inference.
 
#482
#482
PKT_VOL said:
Those verses are very vague. I included the Milky Way in my last post in case he wanted to showoff a black hole, billions of other stars and planets, a unified galaxy, etc.

There are multiple ways to show off. He can show of equally at the macro-level. He could have always shown out better on this planet and solar system but he didn't.

What I don't understand is how you can look at the rest of the observable universe, the implied mulitverse via inflation (Level 1 and 2) and quantum mechanics (Level 3), and not have a reasonable doubt as to whether Earth and mankind are the center of all creation. That maybe, you (not just you, many feel the same way) suppress and minimize God's plan, creation, aspiration, and power to just Earth and mankind.
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I am guessing you aren't a parent of multiple children. I know many parents, including my own, who have said their children are the center of their lives, but they have several children, a spouse and themselves so multiple centers in their lives. Do my parents love me less because they also love my sisters???? (most people in this conversation should be smart enough to recognize the comparison)

God is love, God/Jesus didn't go around shutting doors and closing people out. In fact it was quite the opposite, Jesus welcomed the outcasts, in this case aliens. So if they live good lives, according to God, I believe he will welcome them into heaven.

and as far as the whole made in the 'image' of God thing, that was a mis-translation from way way back. The original Aramaic word is actually closer to 'attributes' than physical 'image'. So it is quite possible God bestowed the 'attributes' on multiple forms of life, aliens. Those attributes would not have to be physical in nature.

only the first part was directed at you PKT, the rest just goes to towards that debate/conversation.
 
#483
#483
PKT_VOL said:
2) You should know that I don't accept that God "deserves" glory for being God any more than Zeus "deserves" glory for being Zeus or Allah "deserves" glory for being Allah.
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Don't Read if you are uber Christian, your mind will melt.




God and Allah are the same thing. The muslim God is the God of Abraham, who is the God of the Jews, who is the 'father' of Jesus, (this is why we had/still have all that fighting for Israel/Jerusalem/the "Holy Land")

but please continue to lump all of us Christians together with the idiots out there; while making incorrect statements, either based on willful ignorance or ignorance based on your lack of faith, or based on the fact that too many Christians would rather hate than love.

I find this whole argument amusing and intruiging. We Christians base our belief on a/the, what I believe is a fact, God that created the whole universe/multiverse. We as humans can't not comprehend how large our galaxy is yet alone the universe and maybe multiverse (a lot of theories on what this is so won't try to quantify it here). Yet here is this conversation trying to quantify/explain how God, who is all powerful, and created things we can't comprehend, works. We won't know, can never know exactly what God planned/wanted/etc, just enjoy the ride. And keep the debate going, i like it and am sad that I am a couple of days late.
 
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#484
#484
LouderVol said:
Don't Read if you are uber Christian, your mind will melt.




God and Allah are the same thing. The muslim God is the God of Abraham, who is the God of the Jews, who is the 'father' of Jesus, (this is why we had/still have all that fighting for Israel/Jerusalem/the "Holy Land")

but please continue to lump all of us Christians together with the idiots out there; while making incorrect statements, either based on willful ignorance or ignorance based on your lack of faith, or based on the fact that too many Christians would rather hate than love.

I find this whole argument amusing and intruiging. We Christians base our belief on a/the, what I believe is a fact, God that created the whole universe/multiverse. We as humans can't not comprehend how large our galaxy is yet alone the universe and maybe multiverse (a lot of theories on what this is so won't try to quantify it here). Yet here is this conversation trying to quantify/explain how God, who is all powerful, and created things we can't comprehend, works. We won't know, can never know exactly what God planned/wanted/etc, just enjoy the ride. And keep the debate going, i like it and am sad that I am a couple of days late.
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Not trying to bash, but it seems like a huge cop out to say that the reason you don't understand something is because God made it that way. My brain constantly tries to find answers to things...it's human nature. I don't understand the whole concept of burying your head in the sand and proclaiming "God did it so I won't question it".
 
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#486
#486
GoBigOrangeUT said:
Not trying to bash, but it seems like a huge cop out to say that the reason you don't understand something is because God made it that way. My brain constantly tries to find answers to things...it's human nature. I don't understand the whole concept of burying your head in the sand and proclaiming "God did it so I won't question it".
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edit*I also don't think I ever said "don't question it" I was just saying "don't act like you already know, one way or the other"

I am not saying to not try and understand, if you go back and read my posts I am all for it. I am all for exploring, I just don't think we (humans and people on this board) will ever actually figure it all out. I think there will always be an unknown, and I don't see that as a bad thing. I think the more we know the better we can understand, but to operate under the assumption that we DO know how something works that is infinite is presumptive. that's all i am saying.
 
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#489
#489
Dark Matter Detected? Latest Discovery Has Potential to Explain Mass of Entire Universe

Ultimately, the dark void of space is not, in fact, a void. Rather, the space between galaxies and stars and planets is generally filled with hot* gas* (the temperature is often of order ten million kelvin, or higher). This gas is composed of heavy elements that escape from the galaxies and accumulate in the space between these large cosmic structures. These gas elements can be detected from their emission lines in X-ray (they generally include things like oxygen, neon, magnesium, silicon, sulfur, argon, and so on).

According to Harvard scientists, “the relative abundances of these elements contain valuable information on the rate of supernovae in the different types of galaxies in the clusters since supernovae make and/or disburse them into the gas.” As the team was looking at these emission lines and determining their composition, they uncovered a line with no known match—a line that does not correspond to any know element. In short, they saw a line in a particular spectral interval not expected to have any features.

What could this line be? The scientists interpretation of the data is incredible, and has amazing implications. They suggest that the line is the result of the decay of a putative, long-sought-after dark matter particle, the so-called “sterile neutrino.” Sterile neutrinos are, at this point, entirely hypothetical particles, which is why the discovery would be so notable. These particles are neutral leptons – neutrinos that do not interact via any of the fundamental interactions of the Standard Model except gravity. The scientists note, “it had been suggested that the hot X-ray emitting gas in a galaxy cluster might be a good place to look for dark matter signatures, and if the sterile neutrino result is confirmed it would mark a breakthrough in dark matter research.”
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#493
#493
GoBigOrangeUT said:
Our God is an awesome God! Even the "empty" vacuum of space has material that God made!
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Only 5% of our observable universe is made up of ordinary/normal matter. The other 95% is dark matter and dark energy.

...and we know next to nothing of dark matter and dark energy.
 
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