Tough loss, but no reason to freak out

#1

Chris4Vols22

GBO or GTFO
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#1
That game was very ugly. There are good and bad you can pull from it.

Scoring was bad. Shots were not falling for either team. Had we hit some of those gimmes we missed, the game would not be close. Same can be said for Georgetown - they were missing a lot of good shots.

Chalk the poor offensive performances up to stellar defense on both teams. This is point-and-case reasoning for Martin stressing defense so much. If we had played average NCAA defense, the game would have been over in the first half.

The biggest problems I could see with our zone attack are that we did not move enough, and that our passing was too laid back. We looked like one of Pearl's teams for a while - just standing around the perimeter passing to and fro. Nothing is going to happen if you do that against a zone. Every once in a while, Golden or Richardson would pick up the dribble and make a move - some shots went in, some didn't. However, if we could have utilized that motion or penetration throughout the whole game, we would have created many more good opportunities. Georgetown's length paired with the zone was the blockade that halted Stokes. We simply could not get the ball down low, and it's not like we weren't trying. Seems I remember a stretch of 3 turn overs in a row trying to get the ball down to the low block. I'm no bball coach, but if my instincts are right, motion/penetration and passing are the two main offensive areas I would work on.

FTs were terrible. Seriously. You can make an argument that we lost the game at the stripe.

Was very nice to see us hit the glass the way we did against a bigger and longer team. That makes me worry a little less.

The bottom line is that it was an ugly game, but it wasn't the worst loss. Heck, it's not even the worst loss this season. It's still really early, and we're still trying to find our way without Maymon. Considering the results the last time we played a quality NCAA team, I'm not too butthurt about the team's performance. Frustrating, yes, freak out, no. People, that was our 5th game we played this season. We have problems, but a lot of them are simple to fix/adjust. If we still execute offense in that manner by February, then we should probably be concerned.

Martin has not done terribly with what he has so far this season. It absolutely could be better, but it could be a heck of a lot worse. It's still very early in the season, and it seems like we weren't really prepared to be without Maymon for so long. No matter how ugly the game was last night, I'm very proud of our team for giving their all for 40 minutes. They played with purpose, and went balls-out all night. I still think Martin is going to piece together a good season. It will take a much worse performance than that to put me in freak out mode, or to declare that the season is over or that Martin is a bad coach.

Finally, to the spill over from the football and Gruden forums, we would all really appreciate it if you could only post IF AND ONLY IF you know what you're talking about. Some do, most don't.
 
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#2
#2
The thing that troubled me the most about that game was how challeged we are to get the ball inside in our half-court offensive sets, especially when it mattered with the game on the line. IIRC, We had four (4)chances to win that game at the end and all we could do was turn it over or miss a long 3-pointer at the last. Georgetown is a good defensive team, but this was a bad offensive performance for the ages.

Jarnell Stokes is a good rebounder and an intimidating physical presence inside, but he is woeful from the foul line (as is the team) and seems to have regressed in his overall offensive game. Maybe that is a function of opponents having some games to scout now after a half year of play and that enables them to better prepare for him. Nevertheless, he must adapt, if that is the reason.

Reminded me of that pre-shotclock-era 11-6 game against Temple in 1972. At least UT won that one.
 
#3
#3
The thing that troubled me the most about that game was how challeged we are to get the ball inside in our half-court offensive sets, especially when it mattered with the game on the line. IIRC, We had four (4)chances to win that game at the end and all we could do was turn it over or miss a long 3-pointer at the last. Georgetown is a good defensive team, but this was a bad offensive performance for the ages.

Jarnell Stokes is a good rebounder and an intimidating physical presence inside, but he is woeful from the foul line (as is the team) and seems to have regressed in his overall offensive game. Maybe that is a function of opponents having some games to scout now after a half year of play and that enables them to better prepare for him. Nevertheless, he must adapt, if that is the reason.

Reminded me of that pre-shotclock-era 11-6 game against Temple in 1972. At least UT won that one.

Definitely agree. We struggled to even get the ball inside - simply passing.

If Stokes can't break 60% from the line, teams are going to pick up on that, and he will become a liability.
 
#4
#4
Very frustrated. The free throws, 3point % and end of game shot selection can only get better. Got to get Stokes the ball more
 
#5
#5
Yes, I forgot about the poor shot selection and abundance of missed 3s.

Goes hand-in-hand with our inability to penetrate or pass through the zone. Too little movement = poor shot selection.
 
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#6
#6
The thing that troubled me the most about that game was how challeged we are to get the ball inside in our half-court offensive sets, especially when it mattered with the game on the line. IIRC, We had four (4)chances to win that game at the end and all we could do was turn it over or miss a long 3-pointer at the last. Georgetown is a good defensive team, but this was a bad offensive performance for the ages.

Jarnell Stokes is a good rebounder and an intimidating physical presence inside, but he is woeful from the foul line (as is the team) and seems to have regressed in his overall offensive game. Maybe that is a function of opponents having some games to scout now after a half year of play and that enables them to better prepare for him. Nevertheless, he must adapt, if that is the reason.

Reminded me of that pre-shotclock-era 11-6 game against Temple in 1972. At least UT won that one.

I agree with the Stokes point. I really like the guy, he seems like a good kid with his head on his shoulders. Unfortunately, he hasn't displayed 5 stars worth of offense yet. He's had a flash here or there, but he's not dominating like he should be, or was expected to be. I'm sure that will get better when Maymon gets back, but that's a long ways away, IF it happens.
 
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#7
#7
I agree with the Stokes point. I really like the guy, he seems like a good kid with his head on his shoulders. Unfortunately, he hasn't displayed 5 stars worth of offense yet. He's had a flash here or there, but he's not dominating like he should be, or was expected to be. I'm sure that will get better when Maymon gets back, but that's a long ways away, IF it happens.

I see what you're saying, but he is getting used to handling NCAA double and triple teams right now. If you take away this game, his post offense has looked pretty great, especially with the immense pressure he gets.
 
#8
#8
Yes, I forgot about the poor shot selection and abundance of missed 3s.

Goes hand-in-hand with our inability to penetrate or pass through the zone. Too little movement = poor shot selection.

If mcbee ever did pump fake and drive... it would be a 100% guarenteed wide open lay up
 
#9
#9
Very frustrated. The free throws, 3point % and end of game shot selection can only get better. Got to get Stokes the ball more

Until Hall or someone else steps up, even if we get him the ball more it is still going to be against double/triple teams. Him or any player for that matter will struggle against those odds.
 
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#10
#10
I don't understand what everyone expects out of Stokes? I mean as soon as or before he even touches the ball he gets 2 to 3 guys on him. With Maymon back, that won't happen...
 
#12
#12
I don't understand what everyone expects out of Stokes? I mean as soon as or before he even touches the ball he gets 2 to 3 guys on him. With Maymon back, that won't happen...

Yes, teams have been able to try to control him with the double so far. As I said earlier, he's still done a pretty good job handling them (minus the Georgetown game).
 
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#13
#13
I remember when the team pressed to change pace, patroled the passing lanes and got steals, denied the inbounds pass, scored on plays from inbounding the ball. Now they are tough and chase their man persistantly, too tired to shoot effectively.

We will not meet another team this year that misses so many open shots. Some people here think it was great and Thompson said it was awful...and he won. Go figure.

Our best hope this year is that Maymon comes back soon. With him we could be only a 1 loss team. Maybe none. He will open up the offense and make Stokes look better.

Nothing can be done for Kenny, he has persistant and apparently severe fumbleitis. I am not sure how that prevents better boxing out.

Our second best offensive weapon never gets effective screening to get him open and he is shooting 38% and 42% on threes.
 
#14
#14
Wow, now that you say that, why the hell is that not in his repertoire?!?!

I don't know if this is sarcastic or not .. I'm saying everytime mcbee gets the ball the person on him KNOWS he's going to shoot a 3. He could have so many open mid range jumpers, runners, etc because of his ability to hit the 3's. He can't be that bad of a mid range shooter the way he shoots 3's.
 
#15
#15
You guys kill me with we have to get the ball inside. That was the least of our worries last night.

Penetration is what should of been their main priority last night followed by getting someone at the free throw line. They did neither.
 
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#16
#16
Out side of Stokes our team just isn't that talented and honestly that is why I think we are lucky to have Cuonzo. He has done really well with a team I'd be surprised if Pearl could win 15 games with and his recruiting is good so we are building.
 
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#17
#17
When will it be time to freak out?
We've faced 2 ranked teams and shot about 26% against each of them.
We shot 16% from the line in the 2nd half against G.
There aren't words to describe how bad that is.
I really don't see 15 wins for this team without Maymon.
 
#18
#18
-I can't believe we can't get the ball to Richardson or stokes at the ft line against the zone and take it to the basket or kick back out to the wing or key. It's basketball 101.
-I don't know why we don't have an inside out game. It's the black hole down there, and I don't blame them. We pin guys on our hips all the time but not a single player, outside of mcbee tbh, knows how to get angles on an entry pass and get them the ball in scoring position.
-why the hell we want a halfcourt slow game is beyond me. Stokes can outrun any big man. Hall sometimes as well. We have length and finishing ability with mcrae and richardson who can do damage in the open court. We have a couple of shooters that will make shots if we push the pacex draw the d and kick.

Just really disappointed so far with seeing the same things as last year. And no maymon isn't a valid excuse for things I refer to.
 
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#19
#19
I don't know if this is sarcastic or not .. I'm saying everytime mcbee gets the ball the person on him KNOWS he's going to shoot a 3. He could have so many open mid range jumpers, runners, etc because of his ability to hit the 3's. He can't be that bad of a mid range shooter the way he shoots 3's.

Was being serious.
 
#20
#20
-I can't believe we can't get the ball to Richardson or stokes at the ft line against the zone and take it to the basket or kick back out to the wing or key. It's basketball 101.
-I don't know why we don't have an inside out game. It's the black hole down there, and I don't blame them. We pin guys on our hips all the time but not a single player, outside of mcbee tbh, knows how to get angles on an entry pass and get them the ball in scoring position.
-why the hell we want a halfcourt slow game is beyond me. Stokes can outrun any big man. Hall sometimes as well. We have length and finishing ability with mcrae and richardson who can do damage in the open court. We have a couple of shooters that will make shots if we push the pacex draw the d and kick.

Just really disappointed so far with seeing the same things as last year. And no maymon isn't a valid excuse for things I refer to.

Thank you for the first sentence.
 
#21
#21
Yes, I forgot about the poor shot selection and abundance of missed 3s.

Goes hand-in-hand with our inability to penetrate or pass through the zone. Too little movement = poor shot selection.

This is the biggest problem I saw last night with our inability to solve the zone.
 
#22
#22
Two things this team needs to work on - 1)free throw shooting, we are a physical team and will be going to the line a lot need to be in the mid-high seventies as a team on the road. 2) make the 12-16 foot jump shot consistently, without Maymon teams will pack it in (OKst) against us daring us to shoot those 12- 16 footers. At home we do good with this but must be carried over to the road games.

I believe this team has the potential to be very good from the last month of the season into the tournaments. They play good defense and have a good inside game. If we get on a roll shooting the ball towards the end look out.
 
#23
#23
When will it be time to freak out?
We've faced 2 ranked teams and shot about 26% against each of them.
We shot 16% from the line in the 2nd half against G.
There aren't words to describe how bad that is.
I really don't see 15 wins for this team without Maymon.

Same things were said last year and we finished 2nd in the SEC
 
#24
#24
When will it be time to freak out?
We've faced 2 ranked teams and shot about 26% against each of them.
We shot 16% from the line in the 2nd half against G.
There aren't words to describe how bad that is.
I really don't see 15 wins for this team without Maymon.
I'm concerned now, but it will be really bad if we look that crappy against Memphis.
 

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