What a nuclear exchange with the USSR could have looked like?

#1

Burhead

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#1
Briefing the president but keeping the public in the dark | Center for Public Integrity

Classified briefing given to Eisenhower in 1958 detailing the costs of a nuclear exchange between the US and the Soviet Union:

Twelve million Americans would be killed outright and 60 million would be dead within a year. The federal government, with the exception of the vice president and perhaps one cabinet member, would be wiped out. Citizens would be dependent on bartering for up to a year. Widespread fires would destroy 169,000 square miles of land, a larger area than the state of California. A lethal blanket of radiation would cover up to half the nation for weeks.

There would be 41 million immediate deaths in the Soviet Union and more than 100 million people dead after one month. The Gross National Product in the USSR would be reduced by 75 percent, the government would be almost completely destroyed, there would be severe transportation problems, and medical supplies would be scarce.
 
#2
#2
Plus all good water & fresh food would be toxic except that which has been stockpiled in underground bunkers. Probably no medical facilities around to help either.
 
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#3
nuke-targets-48.jpg
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Briefing the president but keeping the public in the dark | Center for Public Integrity

Classified briefing given to Eisenhower in 1958 detailing the costs of a nuclear exchange between the US and the Soviet Union:

You know, those are our estimates. I'm wondering what the Soviet estimates of the same time were. But what concerned me was this:

It nonetheless tried to look on the bright side, suggesting that “the balance of strength would be on the side of the United States” after the nuclear war, and that “the survival of the United States as a nation appears highly probable.”

Such notions would lead a person to believe a first strike scenario was an option and that a nuclear war is "winnable." I know it was 1958, but that thought process is never good. Because nobody wins in a nuclear war.
 
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Such notions would lead a person to believe a first strike scenario was an option and that a nuclear war is "winnable." I know it was 1958, but that thought process is never good. Because nobody wins in a nuclear war.

This is the belief of many of those that are leading us to war with Russia right now. To hell with the American casualties (or other casualties), we have people in charge that have already made preparations for this very scenario. And these madmen will have no problem driving us to WWIII in the hopes of winning this first strike nuclear war.

That is what keeps me up at night and should be making you and the rest of my critics more concerned. Why are we even in The Ukraine except for to have Ukraine as a location to establish missile bases right in Russia's backdoor.
 
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This is the belief of many of those that are leading us to war with Russia right now. To hell with the American casualties (or other casualties), we have people in charge that have already made preparations for this very scenario. And these madmen will have no problem driving us to WWIII in the hopes of winning this first strike nuclear war.

That is what keeps me up at night and should be making you and the rest of my critics more concerned. Why are we even in The Ukraine except for to have Ukraine as a location to establish missile bases right in Russia's backdoor.

Stop referring to it as "The Ukraine," Vlad. It doesn't belong to you anymore.
 
#10
#10
From the A-Bomb Museum:

Hiroshima after affects


Chaotic conditions made accurate accounts most difficult. Some victims were vaporized instantly, many survivors were horribly disfigured, and death from radiation was uncertain—it might not claim its victims for days, weeks, months, or even years.

The initial death count in Hiroshima, set at 42,000–93,000, was based solely on the disposal of bodies, and was thus much too low. Later surveys covered body counts, missing persons, and neighborhood surveys during the first months after the bombing, yielding a more reliable estimate of 130,000 dead as of November 1945. A similar survey by officials in Nagasaki set its death toll at 60,000–70,000. (Its plutonium bomb was more powerful, but its destructive range was limited by surrounding hills and mountains).

Additional counts indicated high levels of short-term mortality in both cities:
—Over 90% of persons within 500 meters (1,600 ft.) of ground zero in both cities died.
—At 1.5 km (almost one mile), over 2/3 were casualties, and 1/3 died.
—Of those at a distance of 2 km (1.2 mi.), half were casualties, 10% of whom died.
—Casualties dropped to 10% at distances over 4 km (2.4 mi.).

Most persons close to ground zero who received high radiation dosages died immediately or during the first day. One-third of all fatalities occurred by the 4th day; two-thirds by the 10th day; and 90% by the end of three weeks.

While casualty rates exceeded death rates, they both were highest near ground zero and declined at similar rates by increasing distance from ground zero. But the cumulative death rates (%) in both cities rose dramatically during the first two weeks, then leveled off in subsequent weeks.

*

*Figure 11. Relation of casualty (0---0) and mortality (*---*) rates to distance from ground zero. (Impact, p. 86. Fig, 11)

*

*Figure 12. Cumulative death rate of atomic bomb victims. (Impact, p. 86. Fig. 12)


Injury Phases
A.First two weeks: mainly burns from rays and flames, and wounds (trauma) from blast and falling structures.
B. 3rd week through 8th week: symptoms of damages by radioactive rays, e.g., loss of hair, anemia, loss of white cells, bleeding, diarrhea. Approximately 10% of cases in this group were fatal.
C. 3rd and 4th months: “some improvement” in burn, trauma, and even radiation
injuries. But then came “secondary injuries” of disfiguration, severe scar formations (keloids), blood abnormalities, sterility (both sexes), and psychosomatic disorders.
D. Even now, after over half a century later, many aftereffects remain: leukemia,
A-bomb cataracts, and cancers of thyroid, breast, lungs, salivary glands, birth defects, including mental retardation, and fears of birth defects in their children, plus, of course, the disfiguring keloid scars.
 
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This is the belief of many of those that are leading us to war with Russia right now. To hell with the American casualties (or other casualties), we have people in charge that have already made preparations for this very scenario. And these madmen will have no problem driving us to WWIII in the hopes of winning this first strike nuclear war.

That is what keeps me up at night and should be making you and the rest of my critics more concerned. Why are we even in The Ukraine except for to have Ukraine as a location to establish missile bases right in Russia's backdoor.

News flash, but the federal government has been planning to survive a nuclear exchange for about six decades now...I don't know if you heard, but we landed men on the moon and returned them safely to Earth as well.

And I'd be surprised if the military didn't have a warplan scenario that involved a nuclear exchange brought about from a regional conflict that starts in the Ukraine. (sorry VP, old habit) In fact, I'd be surprised if there weren't plans to nuke Canada gathering dust in a file cabinet somewhere.

I live 20 miles from primary targets listed on both the scenarios listed on that map and I have no doubt there is a Russian SS-18 dialed in on Tinker AFB and the surrounding areas with the ten 550 Kt minimum MIRVs it happens to carry. And said MIRVs will create Oklahoma Lake when they happen to land. And I happen to sleep very well at night knowing that if I don't get it in the exchange, there is no place nearby I can bug out to that's out of the radiological fallout path since the EMP will likely destroy unshielded vehicles. And knowing the wind patterns I also know there is a significant chance of fallout coming in from Amarillo (Pantex plant), Dallas-Fort Worth (major urban area, military-industrial location, Joint Base Fort Worth), Wichita (military industrial location, McConnell AFB), McAlester Army Ammo Plant (east) or the location previously known as Cheyenne Mountain Air Station that would be henceforth known as Cheyenne Crater. So knowing I cannot stop it creates a sense of peace in my head.

Frankly, if things like this keep you up and night being scared of items completely and utterly out of your control, you probably need some professional help. Because there is nothing you can or will do to stop a nuclear exchange. Nothing.

But I still have high hopes of getting my methane/pig **** fueled vehicle running and improvised weapons and rolling on the Mad Max idea. And/or creating a Thunderdome in my backyard. Anyone got Tina Turner's number handy?
 
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And the i40/i75/i81 junctions. It would cripple interstate Commerce.

Roads are easy to repair/rebuild and the secondary roads like 11E become primary routes instead (providing they aren't glassed over)

Industries like ORNL and Alcoa aren't as easy to get going again.
 
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Roads are easy to repair/rebuild and the secondary roads like 11E become primary routes instead (providing they aren't glassed over)

Industries like ORNL and Alcoa aren't as easy to get going again.

It's more along the lines of the nuclear fallout but I get what you're saying.... Although, as a Carson Newman alumni from Knoxville, I hate 11E with a passion. Just what the new market police need... More traffic.
 
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It's more along the lines of the nuclear fallout but I get what you're saying.... Although, as a Carson Newman alumni from Knoxville, I hate 11E with a passion. Just what the new market police need... More traffic.

Being that the traditional wind patterns run west to east, I'd almost say they'd used secondary road networks that run north-south instead to avoid fallout patterns. Having said that to say this, the idea of a "limited" exchange is nonsense because as soon as the first city is hit on either side, it escalates as the opposing side will retaliate.

There was a decent movie some years ago called "By Dawn's Early Light." It was an HBO picture that showed an accidental limited nuclear exchange between the US and the USSR (at the time). But it showed how quickly things can and will spiral out of control and I personally think the ending was a little far fetched.
 
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News flash, but the federal government has been planning to survive a nuclear exchange for about six decades now...I don't know if you heard, but we landed men on the moon and returned them safely to Earth as well.

Preparing for a nuclear attack is one thing. But during the Cold War, there was Mutually Assured Destruction.

These guys in charge are more than willing to "initiate" a nuclear war. Big difference. One is a defensive posture and preparation. These madmen are more than willing to push the button for the sake of what? Not freedom or any of that nonsense. They are willing to blow up the world for the sake of cleaning up the economic mess that this world is about to plunge into.
 
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Preparing for a nuclear attack is one thing. But during the Cold War, there was Mutually Assured Destruction.

These guys in charge are more than willing to "initiate" a nuclear war. Big difference. One is a defensive posture and preparation. These madmen are more than willing to push the button for the sake of what? Not freedom or any of that nonsense. They are willing to blow up the world for the sake of cleaning up the economic mess that this world is about to plunge into.

Find Therapist
 
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#19
#19
Roads are easy to repair/rebuild and the secondary roads like 11E become primary routes instead (providing they aren't glassed over)

Industries like ORNL and Alcoa aren't as easy to get going again.

In that 600-page Russian book I read that has made me an expert in the Ukraine thread, the author stated that entire Russian industries (like 300-500 factories or so) were removed from Moscow to the Urals over the course of two or three weeks (something absurd like that) as the Germans threatened the capital. I may be skewing the numbers somewhat from memory, but it was something ridiculous.

Perhaps communism wasn't completely inefficient afterall.
 
#20
#20
News flash, but the federal government has been planning to survive a nuclear exchange for about six decades now...I don't know if you heard, but we landed men on the moon and returned them safely to Earth as well.

And I'd be surprised if the military didn't have a warplan scenario that involved a nuclear exchange brought about from a regional conflict that starts in the Ukraine. (sorry VP, old habit) In fact, I'd be surprised if there weren't plans to nuke Canada gathering dust in a file cabinet somewhere.

I live 20 miles from primary targets listed on both the scenarios listed on that map and I have no doubt there is a Russian SS-18 dialed in on Tinker AFB and the surrounding areas with the ten 550 Kt minimum MIRVs it happens to carry. And said MIRVs will create Oklahoma Lake when they happen to land. And I happen to sleep very well at night knowing that if I don't get it in the exchange, there is no place nearby I can bug out to that's out of the radiological fallout path since the EMP will likely destroy unshielded vehicles. And knowing the wind patterns I also know there is a significant chance of fallout coming in from Amarillo (Pantex plant), Dallas-Fort Worth (major urban area, military-industrial location, Joint Base Fort Worth), Wichita (military industrial location, McConnell AFB), McAlester Army Ammo Plant (east) or the location previously known as Cheyenne Mountain Air Station that would be henceforth known as Cheyenne Crater. So knowing I cannot stop it creates a sense of peace in my head.

Frankly, if things like this keep you up and night being scared of items completely and utterly out of your control, you probably need some professional help. Because there is nothing you can or will do to stop a nuclear exchange. Nothing.

But I still have high hopes of getting my methane/pig **** fueled vehicle running and improvised weapons and rolling on the Mad Max idea. And/or creating a Thunderdome in my backyard. Anyone got Tina Turner's number handy?

Quite frankly, I'm starting to get more worried about these Islamic State bastards getting their hands on some nukes than I am war with Russia.

And I'm looking forward to the new "Mad Max" movie.
 
#21
#21
Being that the traditional wind patterns run west to east, I'd almost say they'd used secondary road networks that run north-south instead to avoid fallout patterns. Having said that to say this, the idea of a "limited" exchange is nonsense because as soon as the first city is hit on either side, it escalates as the opposing side will retaliate.

There was a decent movie some years ago called "By Dawn's Early Light." It was an HBO picture that showed an accidental limited nuclear exchange between the US and the USSR (at the time). But it showed how quickly things can and will spiral out of control and I personally think the ending was a little far fetched.

I still swear by "Red Dawn" (1984).
 
#23
#23
Being that the traditional wind patterns run west to east, I'd almost say they'd used secondary road networks that run north-south instead to avoid fallout patterns. Having said that to say this, the idea of a "limited" exchange is nonsense because as soon as the first city is hit on either side, it escalates as the opposing side will retaliate.

There was a decent movie some years ago called "By Dawn's Early Light." It was an HBO picture that showed an accidental limited nuclear exchange between the US and the USSR (at the time). But it showed how quickly things can and will spiral out of control and I personally think the ending was a little far fetched.
Thanks for the info. I don't pretend to be an expert on this stuff so it's cool to get info from people more knowledgeable than myself
 
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Thanks for the info. I don't pretend to be an expert on this stuff so it's cool to get info from people more knowledgeable than myself

It's something I looked into some years ago. I don't pretend to be an expert either but all one needs to do is look at seasonal weather patterns to determine where fallout might occur.
 
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lulz, everyone growing up wanted to stand on a mountaintop and scream "Wolverines!" while wielding their AK and the hat off a dead Russian Major.

To this day, whenever that movie comes on TV, the world stops spinning for a couple hours, at least at my house.

I remember acting out scenes from it as a kid, back in the fields and woods behind my family's farm. In those days, I was only armed with a Ruger .22, but I graduated in due time.
 

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