What would the reaction be on this board?

#1
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MikeHamiltonFan

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#1
If Bruce Pearl had the talent that UConn or UNC has and lost the games they are losing?

Are the haters of Pearl conceding that his team is outside the top 20 in terms of overall talent? Maybe around 20-25?

Does it make them seem more idiotic when with 20-25 level talent they think he sucks if he only makes it to the Sweet 16?
 
#4
#4
MikeHamiltonFan said:
If Bruce Pearl had the talent that UConn or UNC has and lost the games they are losing?

Are the haters of Pearl conceding that his team is outside the top 20 in terms of overall talent? Maybe around 20-25?

Does it make them seem more idiotic when with 20-25 level talent they think he sucks if he only makes it to the Sweet 16?
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The reaction would be even worse than it already is, due to the fact that Bruce is missing a little something that Ol' Roy and Jim are not.... which is multiple national championship rings.
 
#5
#5
HF,
Roy and Calhoun are both excellent coaches, but in years they won the NC, did you really think more than 1-4 teams had a chance to beat them on their whole schedule?

Bruce Pearl has never APPROACHED the level of talent those guys had when they won their NCs.

If Selby was as good as advertised, joined Tobias Harris and Henry transferred to UT from Kansas and did not have to sit out a year, next years team might be similar talent wise to the ones that they won so much with.

On the other hand, if Cal cannot win a NC with the NBA talent he has on his squad? Blaming youth...when even Matta could get deep with NBA talent, then Cal is a great recruiter and a crap coach.

John Wall is the best PG I think I have watched in college. Texas and Illinois had some great ones, Cal had studs recently at Memphis and as a kid I loved watching some of Cremins guys at GT, but John Wall is amazing.
 
#6
#6
MikeHamiltonFan said:
HF,
Roy and Calhoun are both excellent coaches, but in years they won the NC, did you really think more than 1-4 teams had a chance to beat them on their whole schedule?

Bruce Pearl has never APPROACHED the level of talent those guys had when they won their NCs.

If Selby was as good as advertised, joined Tobias Harris and Henry transferred to UT from Kansas and did not have to sit out a year, next years team might be similar talent wise to the ones that they won so much with.

On the other hand, if Cal cannot win a NC with the NBA talent he has on his squad? Blaming youth...when even Matta could get deep with NBA talent, then Cal is a great recruiter and a crap coach.

John Wall is the best PG I think I have watched in college. Texas and Illinois had some great ones, Cal had studs recently at Memphis and as a kid I loved watching some of Cremins guys at GT, but John Wall is amazing.
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Thats all well and good. All I did was answer your question, which states directly:

"What would the reaction be on this board If Bruce Pearl had the talent that UConn or UNC has and lost the games they are losing?"

I answered that question.

As for John Wall, he just needs to continue working on that outside shot. He is definately the best point guard I have seen play in college since Jason Kidd.

Cremins did bring some great guys through. I always enjoyed watching Travis Best.
 
#7
#7
My favorite shirt I had as a young basketball player was the one I got at Cremins camp. A teammate of mine from childhood wanted to play for him but ended up being a football starter at GT instead.

HF I think you would admit that if Pearl had the talent of UNC right now, and was struggling this badly, the "they are young" argument would be getting him nowhere.
 
#8
#8
MikeHamiltonFan said:
My favorite shirt I had as a young basketball player was the one I got at Cremins camp. A teammate of mine from childhood wanted to play for him but ended up being a football starter at GT instead.

HF I think you would admit that if Pearl had the talent of UNC right now, and was struggling this badly, the "they are young" argument would be getting him nowhere.
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Before the fiasco, I think UNC and UT have similar talent.
Chism--4 star, Smith-4 star, Tatum-4 star, Hopson--5 star, Maze-3 star, Hall- 4 star, Prince-5 star, Williams-3 star, etc. That's definitely not bad talent.
 
#9
#9
MikeHamiltonFan said:
HF I think you would admit that if Pearl had the talent of UNC right now, and was struggling this badly, the "they are young" argument would be getting him nowhere.
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Sure, I agree 100% to that.

The difference is, when Ol' Roy says "Gosh darn it to heck, their just young", people say to themselves "Yeah, their just young. Ol' Roy knows what he's talking about. Its just like the year after the last national championship we won."

Where as when Pearl says "their just young", people say "This guy is full of excuses. He can't win."

Williams and Calhoun have demonstrated the ability to turn young teams into great teams within a few years, and have earned the right to have that leniency for down years. (Also, don't over estimate NC's talent. Larry Drew II/John Henson have a long way to go)

Its just the wrong comparison to make, IMO. Your taking two different coaches from COMPLETELY different levels and trying to make that analogy work.

Either way, I will have to pick this convo up tomorrow. I'm off.
 
#10
#10
Hardwood_fanatic said:
Thats all well and good. All I did was answer your question, which states directly:

"What would the reaction be on this board If Bruce Pearl had the talent that UConn or UNC has and lost the games they are losing?"

I answered that question.

As for John Wall, he just needs to continue working on that outside shot. He is definately the best point guard I have seen play in college since Jason Kidd.

Cremins did bring some great guys through. I always enjoyed watching Travis Best.
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I'm trying to figure out what great players UCONN has. Stanley Robinson is the only guy on that team who is a sure fire NBA guy, and that's as a defender, rebounder, and energy guy. They've got good college players, nothing more. Outside of Michigan, where are the teams they've lost to currently ranked?
 
#11
#11
hatvol96 said:
I'm trying to figure out what great players UCONN has. Stanley Robinson is the only guy on that team who is a sure fire NBA guy, and that's as a defender, rebounder, and energy guy. They've got good college players, nothing more. Outside of Michigan, where are the teams they've lost to currently ranked?
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They don't have them; that's why they're record is what it is. MHF can't seem to realize that the reason no one says anything about them struggling some is because they're coaches have multiple NC's.
 
#12
#12
North Carolina's players just aren't that good. I saw the Wear brothers play at Mater Dei and couldn't believe Carolina snapped them both up. It's almost like they are trying to recreate Tyler Hansbrough. Henson's decent, but they have nowehere near the talent they had a couple of years ago with Lawson and Felton, who were studs the day they stepped on campus. In fact, about the only guys I'd want off their team are Davis and Zeller. I honestly think that Carolina needs a few typical classes to compensate and get back to their level.

Of course, 2 national titles in 5 years will garner you a lot of leeway.
 
#13
#13
LawVol13 said:
They don't have them; that's why they're record is what it is. MHF can't seem to realize that the reason no one says anything about them struggling some is because they're coaches have multiple NC's.
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Actually having accomplished something means you get the benefit of the doubt. Funny how that works.
 
#14
#14
Dudleys87 said:
UNC is on a different level, the Heels have a young team this season.
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You can say they are young all you want but GA Tech is just as young, they were relying on 3 freshmen. Look at Kentucky. Everybody is young these days with people jumping to the NBA. Being young is not an excuse anymore.
 
#15
#15
Last year,
UNC 5th nationally
2009 commits (National rank)
PF John Henson (5)
PG Dexter Strickland (34)
SG Leslie McDonald (65)
PF David Wear (59)
PF Travis Wear (60) The Tar Heels sprinted out of the blocks. Roy Williams and staff locked up five players all ranked inside the top 70 national rankings. Henson, a 6-foot-10 versatile post, is the gem. Strickland and McDonald are the future of the backcourt. The Wear twins give UNC some size and depth in the rotation.

in 2008 they were ranked 11th.
Ed Davis: No. 15 overall, No. 4 PF

Tyler Zeller: No. 33 overall, No. 7 C

Larry Drew: No. 71 overall, No. 110 PG

Justin Watts: SG

Class details
After securing five-star forward Ed Davis late in the summer, North Carolina went into Big Ten country and landed another five-star big man. Tyler Zeller, whose brother Luke Zeller is on the Notre Dame roster, will help carry on the tradition in Chapel Hill. Davis and Tyler Zeller are skilled, finesse-type players who should thrive in the up-tempo Tar Heel system. Four-star guard Larry Drew and late addition Justin Watts round out the class for coach Roy Williams.

UConn with "no good players" (meaning Calhoun and Rivals both really need at least one message board poster on here to help them out) was nationally at 10 on Rivals

2009 commits (National rank)
C Alex Oriakhi (21)
SF Jamal Coombs (50)
PG Darius Smith (71)
SG Jamaal Trice It seems like Oriakhi and Coombs have been committed to the Huskies for a decade. Both pledged to Jim Calhoun very early in the recruiting process, and over time they have improved tremendously. Coombs has developed into one of the top wings in the nation. Look for he and Oriakhi to make early contributions in Storrs along with four-star guard Darius Smith, who signed in the spring.

2008


8. Connecticut Huskies
Ater Majok: No. 13 overall, No. 3 PF

Kemba Walker: No. 14 overall, No. 5 PG

Nate Miles: No. 79 overall, No. 18 SG

Scottie Haralson: SG

Chukwuma Okwandu: C

Class details
Jim Calhoun took care of his needs at point guard in the fall with the signing of five-star prospect Kemba Walker. This spring he snagged the big man his program needed with five-star forward Ater Majok. The Huskies also have a shooter on the way in Scottie Haralson and are counting on four-star Nate Miles for perimeter scoring.
Previous rank: 8
 
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#16
#16
By the way, Kansas was 6 last year:
2009 commits (National rank)
SG Xavier Henry (8)
PG Elijah Johnson (24)
PF Thomas Robinson (31) The Jayhawks continue to recruit well and recruit nationally. Robinson, a top-40 prospect from Baltimore via Brewster Academy in New Hampshire, is one of the elite rebounders in the class. His presence should be felt the minute he arrives in Lawrence next fall. Johnson, a Las Vegas native, is one of the most athletic point guards in the country. When he's at the top of his game, he is one of the best at his position. The last pickup for the Jayhawks was top-10 prospect Henry, who is out of Oklahoma. Henry chose Kansas after being released from his Letter of Intent with Memphis.

They were 2 the year before
Marcus Morris: No. 29 overall, No. 10 PF

Markieff Morris: No. 50 overall, No. 18 PF

Travis Releford: No. 70 overall, No. 16 SG

Tyshawn Taylor: No. 77 overall, No. 11 PG

Tyrone Appleton: PG

Mario Little: SF

Quintrell Thomas: No. 150 overall, No. 38 PF
 
#17
#17
TN was 7th in 2008 for the best recruiting class of Bruce Pearls time (by far) and was unranked last year.

Scotty Hopson: No. 5 overall, No. 2 SG

Emmanuel Negedu: No. 40 overall, No. 13 PF

Renaldo Woolridge: No. 53, No. 11 SF

Philip Jurick: No. 68 overall, No. 12 C

Bobby Maze: PG

Daniel West: PG

Class details
The SEC school landed a premier prospect in Scotty Hopson, a five-star standout and national top-10 player, in the late signing period. His addition was a major coup for Bruce Pearl's program. Junior college guard Bobby Maze and Michigan native Daniel West will challenge for time at the point guard position. The Vols looked long and hard for a big forward that could stretch the defense but also crash the boards when needed. They found their man in California top-60 prospect Renaldo Woolridge. Coach Bruce Pearl and his staff locked up in-state big man Phillip Jurick early in the spring. Tennessee's recruiting class received a late boost with the addition of four-star power forward Emmanuel Negedu.

Jurick was an in state project who quit the team and never contributed. Negedu would have been a major contributor if he had not suffered a freak heart attack and had to have a pacemaker installed.

So the Pearl class minus Jurick and Negedu would not have even been top 10.

It is a nice reminder of how good Woolridge should become though.

All those who are saying JP Prince should count as the player from Memphis that Arizona was thrilled to get must want to edit out his illness, almost dying, doing nothing for Arizona and then moving back to TN. Bruce Pearl did not get a 5 star guard when he got JP. He got a freakishly athletic guy who was injured over and over during his time here and who may put together a nice senior year.

It is hilarious to read unchallenged on here that TN has the same level of talent as UNC.

There are no answers so far in this thread as to where people think their team stacks up talent wise this year.
 
#19
#19
hatvol96 said:
I'm trying to figure out what great players UCONN has. Stanley Robinson is the only guy on that team who is a sure fire NBA guy, and that's as a defender, rebounder, and energy guy. They've got good college players, nothing more. Outside of Michigan, where are the teams they've lost to currently ranked?
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Exactly. Thats why I referred mostly to only UNC (Whose talent isn't exactly off the charts). UConn has nothing in the variety of great players, or top tier talent this season.

MHF with some of his thread ideas reminds me of the guy at work everyone can't stand. You know, the guy with bad breath and a annoying laugh who shows up at a party uninvited, causing everyone to moan and say "WTF is he doing here?".

I guess thats just life, everybody has gotta have one.
 
#24
#24
Hardwood_fanatic said:
Exactly. Thats why I referred mostly to only UNC (Whose talent isn't exactly off the charts). UConn has nothing in the variety of great players, or top tier talent this season.

MHF with some of his thread ideas reminds me of the guy at work everyone can't stand. You know, the guy with bad breath and a annoying laugh who shows up at a party uninvited, causing everyone to moan and say "WTF is he doing here?".

I guess thats just life, everybody has gotta have one.
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The guy everyone loves at the office is the guy who mocks everyone elses opinions and says "I knew that would happen" after the fact in sports, but when asked to make a prediction says "I cannot predict the future."

The guy who says "it is too early" to judge the basketball season when it is 1/3 through and who when it is 2/3 through says "I never said I can make a prediction!".

That guy is a real winner...the guy who lives in Boston and wears a Yankees hat and keeps coming over to the Boston sports board to mock their team...nice
 
#25
#25
Sabanocchio said:
Tell us all again how great coaches Billy Gillespie and Rich Rod are, Hat.
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Gillispie is great enough that he's been as deep into the NCAA Tournament as Bruce Pearl ever has. If Gillispie is so bad, what does that make a coach he dominated?
 
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