Why does TN HS football stink?

#1
General Jack

General Jack

Vorschlaghammer
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#1
Not trying to offend anyone, and "stink" is probably a little harsh, but year in year out TN don't have many nationally recognized players, and only a third or so of the VOLS roster are in-state, less than that in starting roles.

I grew up in K-town, and I can tell you after watching football at my high school, which is usually one of the better in the area, and then seeing it in Louisiana (where my wife is from) and now down here in Texas, there's just no comparison. Tennessee isn't a huge state, but we have the 16th largest population (as of 2000). States such as Louisiana, South Carolina, Mississippi and, I hate to say it, Alabama, have smaller populations but stronger HS football.

And Texas and Florida, while having approximately 3 and 2 times as many residents have many times more blue chip prospects.

What gives? Its really weird 'cause college football doesn't get any bigger than it does in TN, but the HS football is just so mediocre.
 
#2
#2
It isnt that well funded. Coaches arnt that great. Level of competition is not very good...etc.
 
#3
#3
Lack of population base. rare to non-exsistant middle school programs
 
#4
#4
I think the last two posts should be combined to come up with the answer. It isn't (in my experience) as prevalent among middle schoolers as is basketball, baseball, and maybe even soccer. If a majority of 6th-8th grade kids starting playing and practicing before high school, then started training and lifting weights while playing High School ball, then it might be a lot better.

The rest of the country better hope that we don't get a lot more in-state talent, cause a consistently good in-state haul combined with our ability to recruit the best players nationally could make us unbelievably good.
 
#5
#5
Isn't it just strange given our passion for college football? You have to wonder why the interest hasn't trickled down to the high school and middle school level.

I somewhat agree with lack of population base, but we seem to have a disproportionately low number of top tier players, i.e. florida has 2 to 2.5 times our population, but 5 times as many blue chip HS players.
 
#6
#6
Knox County Schools for instance do not have a middle school program
 
#7
#7
Originally posted by Vol67@Aug 4, 2005 2:21 PM
Knox County Schools for instance do not have a middle school program
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But teams like Webb do get the 8th graders involved w/ the JV teams. That could explain much of their success. In Knox County public schools basketball is the top sport.
 
#8
#8
I haven't seen the same type of 'recruiting' among High Schools like I saw in Georgia either. Coaches actively recruit players from other districts to move in order to play.
Parents, obviously, can make those sort of decisions in TN but I haven't seen nor heard of the schools being actively involved.

How does that make a difference? Well, IMHO, it allows for easier scouting. You can go to a 'Parkview HS' game in Georgia nad see a whole team of blue chip players at once. In TN those players would be scattered across several teams state wide.

Maybe it happens here, I just haven't observed it.
 
#9
#9
I think part of the reason for this is the lack of African American people in the state of Tennessee. The two cities that produce some of the best talent in the state are Memphis and Chattanooga. Two cities that have a higher minority race % than others in the state. If you look at a football roster/pictures, the % of african american players vs the % of african american population within the state you will see a huge discreptcy. I don't care if you start people playing at the age of 3, if they don't have the athleticism they don't have the athleticism. Good coaching and hard work can only take you so far (High School). College football, especially the SEC, is just too competitive to get by on coaching alone.

*Note - This is not intended to be racist AT ALL. Just stating some things from personal experiences growing up in the state. Please do not read this the wrong way.
 
#10
#10
When I was in High School (90's) at Marion County outside of Chattanooga we had some great teams for years...Part of that was a direct result of some great coaching at the middle school level..when that started to go away the school came back down to earth. I think that's probably what's going on statewide. Here in Florida they play sports year-round and by the time kids are in 6th grade they are light years beyond other states in sport knowledge...can't hurt.
 
#11
#11
maryville and alcoa have middle school programs, and have very rich tradition, these two schools are power-houses in the state and play very good football, with very good athletes, AND coaches
 
#12
#12
Originally posted by maryvillereb2003@Aug 4, 2005 3:15 PM
maryville and alcoa have middle school programs, and have very rich tradition, these two schools are power-houses in the state and play very good football, with very good athletes, AND coaches
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Id agree with that.
Theres also some really good talent further North East, with jr.high programs.
 
#13
#13
Checkerboard Charley could also speak to this, Sparta/White county has an excellent middle school football record. Almost every year a bowl team that is at least ranked in the top 10, if not the top 5. But somewhere, somehow when they get to High school, for some reason which no one seems to have an answer for, they just dont do as well. Its always amazed me.
 
#14
#14
I always thought that tennessee was good in highschool football. I have lived all up and down the east coast and have been to 4 highschools and it seems to me that the only place i have been were the talent level is extremely high is florida. I mean I lived in Virginia Beach and football is crazy good there. NC is good as well. But when I lived in tennessee I didnt really see any drop off. I mean tennessee turns out good players every year. just look at Patric turner. But I am willing to say that in tennessee most of the great sports players play basketball.
 
#15
#15
Originally posted by vols2345@Aug 4, 2005 3:37 PM
I always thought that tennessee was good in highschool football.  I have lived all up and down the east coast and have been to 4 highschools and it seems to me that the only place i have been were the talent level is extremely high is florida.  I mean I lived in Virginia Beach and football is crazy good there.  NC is good as well.  But when I lived in tennessee I didnt really see any drop off.  I mean tennessee turns out good players every year.  just look at Patric turner.  But I am willing to say that in tennessee most of the great sports players play basketball.
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I agree that we turn out some good players every year, it just seem like a disproportionately low number. I would love to see 2/3 of our roster from in-state, but sadly, if that were the case we'd probably be lucky to stay in the top 25 on a consistent basis. Most of our legitimate stars (i.e. career in NFL) in the past couple of decades have been from out of state, the notably exceptions being Al Wilson and John Henderson.
 
#16
#16
Originally posted by vols2345@Aug 4, 2005 3:37 PM
I always thought that tennessee was good in highschool football.  I have lived all up and down the east coast and have been to 4 highschools and it seems to me that the only place i have been were the talent level is extremely high is florida.  I mean I lived in Virginia Beach and football is crazy good there.  NC is good as well.  But when I lived in tennessee I didnt really see any drop off.  I mean tennessee turns out good players every year.  just look at Patric turner.  But I am willing to say that in tennessee most of the great sports players play basketball.
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I agree that we turn out some good players every year, it just seem like a disproportionately low number. I would love to see 2/3 of our roster from in-state, but sadly, if that were the case we'd probably be lucky to stay in the top 25 on a consistent basis. Most of our legitimate stars (i.e. career in NFL) in the past couple of decades have been from out of state, the notably exceptions being Al Wilson and John Henderson.
 
#17
#17
that is true. I think i may of like Chad pennigton to come to UT. Oh well.
 
#18
#18
Originally posted by dan4vols@Aug 4, 2005 4:32 PM
Checkerboard Charley could also speak to this, Sparta/White county has an excellent middle school football record. Almost every year a bowl team that is at least ranked in the top 10, if not the top 5. But somewhere, somehow when they get to High school, for some reason which no one seems to have an answer for, they just dont do as well. Its always amazed me.
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Dan now your talking something entirely different with the plateau region. It has been my experience(4 decades worth) that the plateau kids have farming and other things during spring thru late fall that occupy their time and just really don't have a use for football once they get to the high school level
 
#19
#19
Originally posted by vols2345@Aug 4, 2005 6:37 PM
that is true.  I think i may of like Chad pennigton to come to UT.  Oh well.
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Pennington was offered to walk-on at UT, but Marshall offered a scholarship and it was also during Peyton's reign.
 
#20
#20
Originally posted by GvHm6@Aug 4, 2005 3:55 PM
I haven't seen the same type of 'recruiting' among High Schools like I saw in Georgia either. Coaches actively recruit players from other districts to move in order to play.
Parents, obviously, can make those sort of decisions in TN but I haven't seen nor heard of the schools being actively involved.

How does that make a difference? Well, IMHO, it allows for easier scouting. You can go to a 'Parkview HS' game in Georgia nad see a whole team of blue chip players at once. In TN those players would be scattered across several teams state wide.

Maybe it happens here, I just haven't observed it.
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Private's in Tennessee recruit, public schools if caught get in big trouble with the Ronnie Carter Mob Cartel
 
#21
#21
Originally posted by Vol 4 Life@Aug 4, 2005 4:42 PM
I agree that we turn out some good players every year, it just seem like a disproportionately low number.  I would love to see 2/3 of our roster from in-state, but sadly, if that were the case we'd probably be lucky to stay in the top 25 on a consistent basis.  Most of our legitimate stars (i.e. career in NFL) in the past couple of decades have been from out of state, the notably exceptions being Al Wilson and John Henderson.
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Don't forget Jason Whitten.
 
#22
#22
I don't know about current practices, but 45 years ago UT just didn't recruit for football from E. Tennessee and not much in the rest of the state (all good football players apparently came from the coal fields of PA).

Ron Widby went to UT on a basketball scholarship (was a 4 sport letterman) and was a punter for Dallas in the NFL. D.D. Lewis went to Mississippi State on a football scholarship and also played for Dallas. They both played HS ball at Knox Fulton. If I remember correctly, UT didn't even talk to D.D.

Memphis players can go to either Ole Miss, Miss State, Bama, or Arkansas and be closer to home than if they came to Knoxville.
 
#23
#23
We recruit the crap out of SC, GA , Bamma , Fla.

Recently NC has become a hot-bed of major talent. Always a heavy handful of Tn talent, They for the most part just dont make the cut.

I always see Soddy-Daisy, Oak Ridge, Brentwood, Alcoa kids with UT passes around Neyland pregame then mingle on field before kick-off .

Right now i think from my parts of Tn we have 1 kid on the squad roster, A Sr. QB, turned tight end from Sullivan South Kingsport Tn.

As of late, some TE that went pro? I know he plays for my NFL Team, even when his nose is broken and his jaws wired shut?
Teddy Gaines(DB), and some kid that kicked true...? Alex Walls
 
#24
#24
IBleedOrange24/7

11. Blake Garrettson DT 6-3/277 Morristown (TN) Morristown East
UT is after him
 
#25
#25
We already got a verbal from McClendon (Chattanooga), and of course Brandon Warren's a stud, but he's verballed to Florida State.

No doubt there are good players from TN every single year, especially in the Memphis area and in East Tennessee. The problem is that there are always a few headliners, then a bunch of guys destined for Vandy/MTSU/Memphis. Georgia, FL, and even SC have much more "depth" of talent, if you know what I mean. It's just damn near impossible for UT to fill its needs year in and year out without recruiting 2/3 of its roster elsewhere.
 
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