Enough with the excuses!

[sjt18]

And it is a legitimate excuse too.

If UT isn't suffering more injuries on a routine basis then possibly. But it at least appears that UT IS suffering a higher rate of injuries than other programs. It may not be a huge margin... but it doesn't have to be a huge margin. One or two good players can often be the difference in 3 or 4 wins.

At some point, a coach becomes responsible for injuries too if a) many come outside of games and b) the come at a consistently higher rate. That appears to be the case right now.

It IS a fixable problem. Other programs do not have the same level of injuries and manage to field good, physical teams. I have confidence that Jones can do so as well.... but he DOES need to.

 

[sjt18]

I would imagine only 6 wins would have a majority concerned.
7 wins would probably create a split but probably only a vocal minority using words like "replace".
There will always be a very vocal minority for anything less than the playoffs.
As far as threads or posts like "enough!!" or "I'm only gonna give" etc.,
they have no real impact on anything. If we continue to move in an upward trajectory,
staying in the spotlight, all the rants will fall on deaf ears.

You know that I've taken some pretty dogged stances. Six to me would be a fairly significant disappointment. No question I would want him to be on notice that '16 was a "Perform or else" year. Where I part with many I'm sure is that I think 7 should be the same.

I do not think anything more than 5 should cost Jones his job this year. But if he wins only 6 or 7 this year then he should have to do something pretty impressive next year to to hang on... I'd say 10+.

 

[Catbone]

We lost 3 starters for the entire season in less than 4 weeks so...

 

[sjt18]

We lost 3 starters for the entire season in less than 4 weeks so...

If that's all that's lost then UT will end up no worse than most other teams. I know the likelihood... but maybe UT's have just come early rather than late.

 

[Dr Dread]

I no reason that we should lose 6 games this season. If we do, Butch will feel some heat on the seat.

 

[chargervol]

You know that I've taken some pretty dogged stances. Six to me would be a fairly significant disappointment. No question I would want him to be on notice that '16 was a "Perform or else" year. Where I part with many I'm sure is that I think 7 should be the same.

I do not think anything more than 5 should cost Jones his job this year. But if he wins only 6 or 7 this year then he should have to do something pretty impressive next year to to hang on... I'd say 10+.

Yeah, we've always been close on that.
I'm optimistic in one way. His previous successes (daj numbers) suggest that he doesn't suck. If he continues to recruit at this level, I still feel the worst case scenario is a Richt like result.
I would be okay with that for a certain amount of time. Returns us to a very desirable coaching destination. At that point, if change were desired, it would increase the likelihood of a positive outcome.

However, given his past, Jones is just as likely to slowly and methodically improve. He seems to have the ability to adapt and adjust to demands placed on him.
Fan patience will determine how long that is given to play out.
Unfortunately though, everyone wants the Meyer and Saban results, without realizing how rare they are. Many coaches reach a championship, multiple and consistent are not common at all.

 

[ajvol01]

Apparently not. Jones already started it.

I get attacked for saying so... but attrition among guys signed by Jones is a bigger factor in having to play Fr than what Dooley left... or rather didn't leave. Yes attrition happens. But UT's attrition in Jones' first two classes has been much higher than the SEC avg. Regardless of who is to blame... it doesn't help to lose those players and constantly have to rely on Fr... at least the ones who aren't ready. When someone recruits the talent Jones has, every class will have immediate contributors like Barnett or Hurd.

Quick - name all the CBJ recruits at OL that left

 

[66volfan]

Apparently not. Jones already started it.

I get attacked for saying so... but attrition among guys signed by Jones is a bigger factor in having to play Fr than what Dooley left... or rather didn't leave. Yes attrition happens. But UT's attrition in Jones' first two classes has been much higher than the SEC avg. Regardless of who is to blame... it doesn't help to lose those players and constantly have to rely on Fr... at least the ones who aren't ready. When someone recruits the talent Jones has, every class will have immediate contributors like Barnett or Hurd.

This discussion has been had on here before. If you do a search I think you'll find the attrition is about average. Not attacking you, just disagreeing. I could be wrong too, but I don't think so.

 

[nagle]

just want to take a dump on this thread.

 

[Johncarter53]

Enough with the excuses!

 

[governmentmule]

Butch is doing a great job so far. Look at what he's done with recruiting and the fan base.I highly doubt they go 6-6 and even if they do Butch isn't going anywhere. You can't expect a NC every year.

CBJ and company have to get that translated to wins,he has been a great recruiter and the fans are behind him and the team

now we shall see if he can "out coach" other teams,I'm going with 7 wins,which I know is on the low side,but CBJ has a lot to show on the football field,till he has shown that,i'm being conservative on the wins

and here is to hoping the injury bug stops with fall practice,this team can't afford many injuries,due to the lack of quality depth and no,i don't count freshmen as quality depth

 

[sjt18]

However, given his past, Jones is just as likely to slowly and methodically improve. He seems to have the ability to adapt and adjust to demands placed on him.
Fan patience will determine how long that is given to play out.
Unfortunately though, everyone wants the Meyer and Saban results, without realizing how rare they are. Many coaches reach a championship, multiple and consistent are not common at all.

Expecting 8 wins in year 3 is far from expecting that though. Eight is a very reasonable pace for improvement.

 

[sjt18]

Quick - name all the CBJ recruits at OL that left

Quick- point to where I limited depth issues to the OL.

FTR, he's the one constantly complaining about not having enough depth. Other than what seems to be a high injury rate, I'm on record saying that I don't think his quality depth is much different from most other teams. Everyone has thin spots.

 

[sjt18]

This discussion has been had on here before. If you do a search I think you'll find the attrition is about average. Not attacking you, just disagreeing. I could be wrong too, but I don't think so.

I've done a little peeking around the SEC. UT seems high among key opponents. Someone posted a more in depth study yesterday that suggested that UT's injury rate was higher than average.

 

[KBVol]

I see what you're saying but another 6 win season will warm CBJ's seat a bit.

6 wins would be a fairly epic fail this year. His seat would be significantly hotter than a bit warm in 2016 IMHO.

 

[sjt18]

Butch is doing a great job so far. Look at what he's done with recruiting and the fan base.I highly doubt they go 6-6 and even if they do Butch isn't going anywhere. You can't expect a NC every year.

So if you are not satisfied with 6-6 that means you must expect a NC which is a reach too far?

Fallacy of limited alternatives much?

 

[ajvol01]

I've done a little peeking around the SEC. UT seems high among key opponents. Someone posted a more in depth study yesterday that suggested that UT's injury rate was higher than average.

Hard to argue with "a little peeking" and "seems high"

 

[chargervol]

Expecting 8 wins in year 3 is far from expecting that though. Eight is a very reasonable pace for improvement.

I never suggested anything different.
Honestly can't tell if you are suggesting I did.

 

[Remy]

We've got one QB on the roster that has taken a varsity snap in a game. We're one disastrous hit away from revealing what depth issues we really have. The offensive playbook becomes extremely limited if Dobbs get taken off on a stretcher, no matter how good Dormady or Jones are, which I hope never happens. Were it to occur many here on VN would be on their hands and knees every night praying for 7 or 8 win season. CBJ has every reason in the world to keep citing depth issues, they're real, and QB is not our only our problem area. Not as many as we had, but we still have some, best believe that.

 

[sjt18]

I never suggested anything different.
Honestly can't tell if you are suggesting I did.

Nope. Agreeing with you against a few others here who don't seem to think actually winning games is the goal of all this... :naughty:

 

[sjt18]

We've got one QB on the roster that has taken a varsity snap in a game. We're one disastrous hit away from revealing what depth issues we really have. The offensive playbook becomes extremely limited if Dobbs get taken off on a stretcher, no matter how good Dormady or Jones are, which I hope never happens. Were it to occur many here on VN would be on their hands and knees every night praying for 7 or 8 win season. CBJ has every reason in the world to keep citing depth issues, they're real, and QB is not our only our problem area. Not as many as we had, but we still have some, best believe that.

The depth issues this team has can and probably will prevent them from winning the SEC. They shouldn't prevent them from winning 8 games. Everyone... short of say Bama has depth issues somewhere.

 

[butchna]

Quick- point to where I limited depth issues to the OL.

FTR, he's the one "constantly complaining about not having enough depth. Other than what seems to be a high injury rate, I'm on record saying that I don't think his quality depth is much different from most other teams. Everyone has thin spots.

"Constantly" huh? Is it the same brand of CONSTANTLY as your usual hangups on here? Or has he just mentioned it more than once? Hard to know when you're exaggerating...since you're CONSTANTLY exaggerating.

 

[butchna]

Nope. Agreeing with you against a few others here who don't seem to think actually winning games is the goal of all this... :naughty:

Speaking of exaggerating...or is it misrepresentation?

 

[photovol]

I went to the utsports website and counted 55 freshman, redshirt freshman and sophomores on the roster.

I don't know how many are walkons of those 55, but that's a lot.

Say what you want, but this season "youth" is a legitimate cause for concern.

Someone will always take the girl with the skinny leggs

 

[sjt18]

"Constantly" huh? Is it the same brand of CONSTANTLY as your usual hangups on here? Or has he just mentioned it more than once? Hard to know when you're exaggerating...since you're CONSTANTLY exaggerating.

Yep. Constantly... as in repeatedly... as in multiple press conferences this August and pretty much every few press conferences since he accepted the job.:thumbsup: