Change my mind

[Joe Vols]

.

I don’t drink. I’m just saying that is the price that has to be payed to compete for championships. Either K-town has what it takes to win or it doesn’t. You can fire and hire 100 coaches and it won’t change the fact. Also, have you ever noticed that when players or coaches leave Knoxville, they almost always do better? Even our good players do better.

 

[KB5252]

In general I agree with you 100 % but let me point out that you nor anyone else know where the line is with Saban or a lot of other coaches.. there is above average chance that a lot of things happen there that are never known.. it is what it is

But that's the problem they became public and when that happens hands are forced. Saban may have a little more leeway than others but given the current climate regarding violence against women given this was strike number two most would have done the same.

I agree that most of the time this is swept under the rug and doesn't see the light of day at most universities but when it does......

 

[Joe Vols]

The discipline issues could be a sign that our staff lacks control and discipline over the program. We may actually have more problems because the staff is not up to running a major college football program

Or maybe this town’s sports media likes to gossip about players and post things that are none of our business. I actually think college athletes privacy should be shielded because of their uncommon status in the community, and the amount of damage that can be done to their lives. Kind of like Hippa. They have to be held accountable by the court and schools, but their cases should be sealed due to the amount of notoriety they have in the community. News stories affect them way more severely than the average Joe.

 

[checkthetape]

But that's the problem they became public and when that happens hands are forced. Saban may have a little more leeway than others but given the current climate regarding violence against women given this was strike number two most would have done the same.

I agree that most of the time this is swept under the rug and doesn't see the light of day at most universities but when it does......

You are right.. at that point damage control requires his dismissal.. that's why I think that there is a major failure in leadership and these kids should be monitored closer.. I think Pruitt has proven he does not have his finger on the pulse of this team and there are basically no players that are willing and capable to hold their teammates accountable

 

[timmessee]

Agree with all except the KPD I would like to thank them for doing their job. It isn't their fault that Banks is a lost individual.

Agree. I appreciate KPD doing their job. I do wonder why they couldn't come for Banks at football practice instead of having him make his call to someone at 3:30am on a Sunday.

 

[UTK]

I saw nothing tonight to make me think next year will be any different. 2 different kinds of athletes on the field tonight. 2 different prepared teams. 2 different kinds of execution. Too many lost battles one on one by our skill players. Too many lost battles on the field in general. The talent committing is still a grade below the talent committing to UGA, UF, UA, Bama, LSU, Clemson... etc... etc... We are no better off now than when Dooley was here. Hate to be a Debbie Downer, but that is the reality as I see it. Y'all may disagree, and I hope I'm wrong.
I don't think any of our QB's are second string on any of the aforementioned teams. Nor any of our RB's. Nor our receivers. Maybe Juann. Maybe some of our O linemen and a few defensive backs. Our freshmen LB's are going to great one day though.
Until the entire community of Knoxville get committed to having a winning program it won't happen. I mean everyone. KPD, the media, the business owners, the teachers, the public and most of all THE MEDIA (especially the sports media). Until everyone decides they are going to help recruit, retain, and help the players coming in we will continue lose the recruiting battles. There is a toxic environment in K town right now towards the program and it shows. It is hostile and it isn't just on the coaches or the AD. It's on the entire town.

Next year probably is more or a 6-6 team. 2021 will be the year Pruitt has to win big with all his guys.

 

[volsack]

I don’t drink. I’m just saying that is the price that has to be payed to compete for championships. Either K-town has what it takes to win or it doesn’t. You can fire and hire 100 coaches and it won’t change the fact. Also, have you ever noticed that when players or coaches leave Knoxville, they almost always do better? Even our good players do better.

That's absolutely not the price you have to pay. You don't have let the football team terrorize a community, you don't have to have a state-run propaganda machine or have teachers abandon the university's mission to be successful. If players are doing better when they leave for other schools, its not because they don't have carte blanche to do whatever they want there, its because they are being coached better or are in a system that better fits their skillset. I'm not sure why you think turning the football program into Al-Qaeda is the right idea, but you might need to re-evaluate your life

 

[jim pique]

imw8n4u,a major crime is a U-Turn?Your logo there,are you some kind of closet stalker?Your imw8n4u denotes that you are a b.. a.. lurking.These are still kids.Watch Sabin's four minute talk about his player from MSU.Not that.given another chance,everyone does better;but,at least give them a chance.Until they dug deeper,with bottom feeders like tmz,all the campus wannabe's had was.A u-turn.

 

[7maxims]

Y’all Pruitt lappers wallow in your excuses. We are no longer UT we are a national punchline and SEC punching bag.

 

[VolsGrad1989]

The discipline issues could be a sign that our staff lacks control and discipline over the program. We may actually have more problems because the staff is not up to running a major college football program

It's easy to discipline the players how you like when you have 36-37 that can play well and contribute on ONE SIDE OF THE BALL. You can run off 10-15 on each side of the ball and still have 21-26 that contribute on both sides of the ball. Do you not think they are being disciplined? If they weren't, many wouldn't have been shown the door or left on their own because it is too tough for them!

 

[imw8n4u]

imw8n4u,a major crime is a U-Turn?Your logo there,are you some kind of closet stalker?Your imw8n4u denotes that you are a b.. a.. lurking.These are still kids.Watch Sabin's four minute talk about his player from MSU.Not that.given another chance,everyone does better;but,at least give them a chance.Until they dug deeper,with bottom feeders like tmz,all the campus wannabe's had was.A u-turn.

I never said anything about any specific player or situation, I was asking for clarification on what exactly the OP expected when he said the KPD plays a role in the success of the football team. As for my "logo" as you call it, that is from a personalized license plate, so you can stop with whatever nonsense you are trying to infer from my chat board handle. Finally, I agree with Saban on this, dumb things kids do shouldn't ruin their lives, and in most cases the better outcome is for them to stay in school. However, there should not be special treatment from law enforcement in those matters.

 

[Volank]

I think apathy has set in more than a toxic environment of the various factions of the city and community. Overall I agree with your post. I have heard our sports media defending JG for years because of his recruiting ranking and I never understood that approach. The kid does not have it, he has stars from HS but no football savvy. A top 5 recruiting class made up of the wrong players will not help, we need SEC quality players to fill in the roster and then we can worry about signing the marque top 5 recruiting classes. I have been burned on Butch Jones and Lane kiff's classes that jumped up into the top of the rankings that had huge holes and actually did more harm than good. We need SEC quality players 3 deep and we do not have that, not even close IMO

Truth. Class ranking is pointless if we don't have good evaluations and then proper development. It is what has gotten us to today. After Butch's first 2 classes he had paper tigers and voluntaty workouts. That wont cut it. Too'o Too'o, Crouch, Wright, Morris, etc are legit marquee guys but when we are selling the results of the past 10yrs we can't have that top to bottom. But that doesn't mean we can't get guys who will be solid sec players with development.

Is what it is. Everyone says they understand we have to rebuild but can't stomach it while we are in the middle of it.

 

[Vol Main]

Our team took the lead away from the number three team in the country, until the very end of the first half. That is improvement. Obviously, they are not where they need to be. I hope we see more complete games this season.

 

[Volank]

Where did all that come from. I saw reasons for optimism tonight. A team that fights and can hold their heads up. I don't expect us to compete for championships anymore, those days are gone.

Overdramatic much. Butch had 2 squads that with competent coaching should have been in the SEC Champ game. BUTCH JONES of all people. If he is able to assemble a team that has the talent to compete then we can compete for trophies with the right coach. Commitment and coaching, we have everything else.

Unfortunately we can't sign 32 players in a class anymore to accelerate the process.

 

[DonjoVol]

Truth. Class ranking is pointless if we don't have good evaluations and then proper development. It is what has gotten us to today. After Butch's first 2 classes he had paper tigers and voluntaty workouts. That wont cut it. Too'o Too'o, Crouch, Wright, Morris, etc are legit marquee guys but when we are selling the results of the past 10yrs we can't have that top to bottom. But that doesn't mean we can't get guys who will be solid sec players with development.

Is what it is. Everyone says they understand we have to rebuild but can't stomach it while we are in the middle of it.

We've been in a constant rebuild for over 10 years now. During that time the other traditional big time programs went out and either rebuilt or just reload every year. Not to mention those programs went out and got actual great coaches.

Bama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, and LSU are all doing great. Missouri and A&M have been better programs than Tennessee has since they joined the SEC. South Carolina has been better than us the past decade. Kentucky and Vandy have caught up with us. Let all that sink in.

 

[cgrish]

KPD? Are you suggesting the police should look the other way on player's crimes to help the football team?

It appears he is, and I totally strongly disagree with him. If players don't respect authority of kpd they will not have respect for any leadership. And thus will not listen to coaches.

 

[Volank]

We've been in a constant rebuild for over 10 years now. During that time the other traditional big time programs went out and either rebuilt or just reload every year. Not to mention those programs went out and got actual great coaches.

Bama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, and LSU are all doing great. Missouri and A&M have been better programs than Tennessee has since they joined the SEC. South Carolina has been better than us the past decade. Kentucky and Vandy have caught up with us. Let all that sink in.

Yes.. well documented stuff. What do these facts change about our current situation? Does that mean we should hire someone new after 2yrs? Have less patience?

TN's back is against the wall. After Haslam meddling, the Currie/Schiano disaster and everything you described we need stability more than anything right now.

Because of what you described it's hard for us to go out and win over the recruits Bama, UGA, LSU, Ohio State really want. We will get a few (morris, wright, too'o too'o, crouch) and I'm not saying we stop swinging at those. But the only way to get ourselves out of this hole is to get as many of those we can and then fill-in with solid SEC guys the bama's don't have room for. We can take recruits from mizzou, uk, scar, ole miss, etc. All programs that sadly been better than us. Keep stability in the S&C program and develop these guys into solid players. Rebuild the roster into a legitimate SEC roster top to bottom.

In time, we will have a competitive roster. Then go beat uk, vandy, scar, mizzou regularly and improve our prestige and record. Maybe steal some games from uga, uf, bama. Then move from lower top tier guys, to the marquee top tier recruits.

It sucks, but that is reality and there is no other way to do it. If TN can find some wins against scar, uk, vandy, mizzou, miss st this year then I do think this is the low point b/c regardless if this staff is the long term answer they are proven evaluators and recruiters. They can at least rebuild the roster if given the chance and that is the only way to get TN out of cellar.

 

[cgrish]

Well, the teams we are competing against aren’t playing by the same rules. So stop the bitching when we lose because of a talent discrepency. And for crying out loud quit blaming it all on the coaches. He can’t be blamed for the community scaring recruits away.

The community is not scaring recruits away. If they are they are the ones who want to break the law and get away with it. I for one don't want them at Ut.

 

[DonjoVol]

Yes.. well documented stuff. What do these facts change about our current situation? Does that mean we should hire someone new after 2yrs? Have less patience?

TN's back is against the wall. After Haslam meddling, the Currie/Schiano disaster and everything you described we need stability more than anything right now.

Because of what you described it's hard for us to go out and win over the recruits Bama, UGA, LSU, Ohio State really want. We will get a few (morris, wright, too'o too'o, crouch) and I'm not saying we stop swinging at those. But the only way to get ourselves out of this hole is to get as many of those we can and then fill-in with solid SEC guys the bama's don't have room for. We can take recruits from mizzou, uk, scar, ole miss, etc. All programs that sadly been better than us. Keep stability in the S&C program and develop these guys into solid players. Rebuild the roster into a legitimate SEC roster top to bottom.

In time, we will have a competitive roster. Then go beat uk, vandy, scar, mizzou regularly and improve our prestige and record. Maybe steal some games from uga, uf, bama. Then move from lower top tier guys, to the marquee top tier recruits.

It sucks, but that is reality and there is no other way to do it. If TN can find some wins against scar, uk, vandy, mizzou, miss st this year then I do think this is the low point b/c regardless if this staff is the long term answer they are proven evaluators and recruiters. They can at least rebuild the roster if given the chance and that is the only way to get TN out of cellar.

I'm still willing to give Pruitt a chance. However, from what I've seen so far this season I still don't see him as the answer long term as our head coach. There are still 7 games left. Tennessee would need to win 5 of the last 7 to show that they are making progress. Very doubtful that we do that but it is possible.

Firing a coach after 2 seasons is not unheard of. Memphis did it to Larry Porter. Since that firing Memphis has improved greatly. Houston just fired Major Applewhite after 2 winning seasons. Which was strange. But the administration did not like the 70-14 bowl loss to Army last year and went out and supposedly upgraded by hiring Holgorsen. If Pruitt wins less than 5 games as head coach this year it will be really hard to justify keeping him. If we do fire him then we will have no choice but to actually go after and hire a big name coach this time around.

We need to eventually get to a point where we don't just steal games from Georgia, Florida and Bama. But we have to be beating them on a regular basis. Florida went 9-1 against us this decade. Georgia 8-2. Bama is of course undefeated against us since Saban has been there. That cannot continue into the next decade if this program is to be successful.

 

[Joe Vols]

The community is not scaring recruits away. If they are they are the ones who want to break the law and get away with it. I for one don't want them at Ut.

The community most assuredly is attacking the players and coaches. Because the media, and sports media are a part of the community. Say what you want, but it is clear to any level headed person that it takes more than money and a big nice building with all the bells and whistles to recruit. It takes more than high paid coaches who are star recruiters. It takes the right culture and climate to excite, motivate, and inspire the recruits to want to be there, live there, and be a part of the community. Some communities (cities) understand that, and some are too stubborn or too lazy to realize it.
A good start would be cancelling your paid subscriptions to the poisonous sports media surrounding the program and constantly attacking the players and coaches.
When the fans boo the team and leave early, it sticks in the back of players minds. It makes them not like fanbase they are playing for. When you don’t like your boss, it is hard to stay motivated to do yoir best. The media, the fans, the store owners in town, the police department, the faculty are all the face of what or who “UT” is to these players. And right now it has negative connotation to each man in that locker room.
Cade Mayes choosing UGA over a community he grew up in should have been a real eye opener, but keep on denying the harbingers in the room.

 

[sechamp2012]

Our team took the lead away from the number three team in the country, until the very end of the first half. That is improvement. Obviously, they are not where they need to be. I hope we see more complete games this season.

I agree even though #3 UGA met the line of 26, it did not happen like a normal blowout with 2nd ans 3rd teamer's playing for UGA the whole 2nd half. The game wasn't truly completely decided to the end of the 3rd. That's why their D coordinator was still calling blitzes trying to knock a true freshman QB out of the game.
It was still a blowout but the timeline was different than I suspected.

 

[Remy]

I saw nothing tonight to make me think next year will be any different. 2 different kinds of athletes on the field tonight. 2 different prepared teams. 2 different kinds of execution. Too many lost battles one on one by our skill players. Too many lost battles on the field in general. The talent committing is still a grade below the talent committing to UGA, UF, UA, Bama, LSU, Clemson... etc... etc... We are no better off now than when Dooley was here. Hate to be a Debbie Downer, but that is the reality as I see it. Y'all may disagree, and I hope I'm wrong.
I don't think any of our QB's are second string on any of the aforementioned teams. Nor any of our RB's. Nor our receivers. Maybe Juann. Maybe some of our O linemen and a few defensive backs. Our freshmen LB's are going to great one day though.
Until the entire community of Knoxville get committed to having a winning program it won't happen. I mean everyone. KPD, the media, the business owners, the teachers, the public and most of all THE MEDIA (especially the sports media). Until everyone decides they are going to help recruit, retain, and help the players coming in we will continue lose the recruiting battles. There is a toxic environment in K town right now towards the program and it shows. It is hostile and it isn't just on the coaches or the AD. It's on the entire town.

Chandler could have gone anywhere in the country, Trey Smith, our two frosh starting OTs, as well as Too'too, and Crouch. Methinks rather me knows you're waaaaaaaaaay too much of a Debbie Downer,

 

[CAVPUT]

You’re right it’s not getting any better. But you undersold the fact that it’s progressively getting worse. The incoming class is about the worst we’ve ever seen. Unless Pruitt could all of the sudden make the biggest recruiting push ever. And so far Pruitt this staff has not proven to be amazing recruiters. They’ve won a few battles but nowhere near enough to close the gap and the most troubling thing is it’s getting worse when they should do headed in the opposite direction having had a little time now

Wouldn't say it's a bad class just that it's incomplete. Pruitt needs to load up the rest of this class with TN hs kids, 1 or 2 grad transfer qbs and scour the juco for defensive help.

 

[GBOkahuna]

I saw nothing tonight to make me think next year will be any different. 2 different kinds of athletes on the field tonight. 2 different prepared teams. 2 different kinds of execution. Too many lost battles one on one by our skill players. Too many lost battles on the field in general. The talent committing is still a grade below the talent committing to UGA, UF, UA, Bama, LSU, Clemson... etc... etc... We are no better off now than when Dooley was here. Hate to be a Debbie Downer, but that is the reality as I see it. Y'all may disagree, and I hope I'm wrong.
I don't think any of our QB's are second string on any of the aforementioned teams. Nor any of our RB's. Nor our receivers. Maybe Juann. Maybe some of our O linemen and a few defensive backs. Our freshmen LB's are going to great one day though.
Until the entire community of Knoxville get committed to having a winning program it won't happen. I mean everyone. KPD, the media, the business owners, the teachers, the public and most of all THE MEDIA (especially the sports media). Until everyone decides they are going to help recruit, retain, and help the players coming in we will continue lose the recruiting battles. There is a toxic environment in K town right now towards the program and it shows. It is hostile and it isn't just on the coaches or the AD. It's on the entire town.

I saw us put up two touchdowns on #3 Georgia and a team that didn’t quit. Look at the depth issues and talent on the field. Pruitts players are more skilled and already playing better. To think we stood a chance last night is unrealistic and childish. Yes we should have 3 wins right now but all of those loses were due to QB play. This is probably the worst shape the program has even been in and to blame that on Pruitt is ridiculous. You don’t come into a team that was 4-8 and expect to be taking down top 10 opponents in 2 years. This is a process. Enjoy watching these young men progress and come into their prime. I think we have a bright future.

 

[Other_Guy]

The discipline issues could be a sign that our staff lacks control and discipline over the program. We may actually have more problems because the staff is not up to running a major college football program

So Pruitt assembled an SEC experienced staff, of which everyone is terrible at controlling and disciplining?