'17' Juco S Johnathan Abram

#51
#51
2014 Draft

Here's the breakdown of the 2014 draft total players drafted.

Five star - 16

Four star - 77

Three star - 92

Two star or unrated - 71

So yes there have been thousands of 3 star and lower rated players to go on to the NFL. The problem is that the 4 and 5 star recruits only make up about 10% of the total pool of athletes for each class across the country combined. In the link above. There were only 422 4 and 5 star recruits for the 2010 class which would have been in the 2014 draft given they hadn't left school early. And 4,078 3 star or lower rated players in the 2010 class.

63.6% of the 2014 draft were 3 star or lower rated players. Now granted it is more difficult to make it to the NFL as a 3 star or lower athlete because of the number of 3 star athletes total.
 
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#53
#53
Smokey123 said:
How much do recruiting rankings matter? NFL All-Pro team includes just one 5-star recruit | Chicago Sun-Times

https://www.google.com/amp/www.sbna...tball/2015/6/22/8743525/nfl-two-star-recruits

Nearly half of top 50 NFL Draft prospects were 3-star high school recruits or worse | High School Sports Blog

Oh, and Super Bowl winning Denver broncos had 23 3*'s on their team
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Thanks Smokey for the links. I read the first one only so far. Very good read. Still, just by that article, there are how many players in the NFL per year? 53 X 32 teams= 1696 player per season plus the injury replacements & so on.

It's certainly not in the thousands. It could be up to 1000 I guess but more figuring would have to be done to get that. I'm all for 3* recruits making it bigtime.

Cam is no doubt going to be drafted come the draft in 2017. I don't know how high but 2nd-3rd round seems about right. I doubt he reaches the 1st round but I hope he does. I'll read those other 2 articles later buddy. Thanks for posting them to read. :good!:BTW, Denver having 23 former 3* recruits really was a shock to me. That's for sure!
 
#54
#54
tonybologna said:
Thanks Smokey for the links. I read the first one only so far. Very good read. Still, just by that article, there are how many players in the NFL per year? 53 X 32 teams= 1696 player per season plus the injury replacements & so on.

It's certainly not in the thousands. It could be up to 1000 I guess but more figuring would have to be done to get that. I'm all for 3* recruits making it bigtime.

Cam is no doubt going to be drafted come the draft in 2017. I don't know how high but 2nd-3rd round seems about right. I doubt he reaches the 1st round but I hope he does. I'll read those other 2 articles later buddy. Thanks for posting them to read. :good!:BTW, Denver having 23 former 3* recruits really was a shock to me. That's for sure!
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It's a bag of lies, Tony!

Don't believe it!

3* are not 4*.

Remember Bama, Ohio State, Clemson. *4 and above are the way.

Don't fall in the trap of mediocrity.
 
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#55
#55
LittleVol said:
It's a bag of lies, Tony!

Don't believe it!

3* are not 4*.

Remember Bama, Ohio State, Clemson. *4 and above are the way.

Don't fall in the trap of mediocrity.
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I'm not. Why do you think I was the one that brought up the point about Cam & his 3* recruit status being few & far between that turn into superstars or even stars. Thanks!
 
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#57
#57
chavisut said:
Yeah. I'll save you the research Tony, there are a ton of successful 3 stars in the NFL. You're welcome.
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I didn't say there was anybody but upcoming Cam did I? No, I didn't I said they're few & far between. You'll are also missing I said(or thought I did) that turn into stars or superstars.

That's where you'll are missing this 3* thing. How many 3* stars or superstars are in the NFL or have been in the NFL? If I did forget that part in a previous reply about 3*'s turning in to stars/superstars I'm sorry but that's the additional stuff I meant to this topic.

I knew there was 3* players in the NFL but few & far between become stars/superstars either in college(like Cam) or in the NFL. Thanks!
 
#58
#58
tonybologna said:
I didn't say there was anybody but upcoming Cam did I? No, I didn't I said they're few & far between. You'll are also missing I said(or thought I did) that turn into stars or superstars.

That's where you'll are missing this 3* thing. How many 3* stars or superstars are in the NFL or have been in the NFL? If I did forget that part in a previous reply about 3*'s turning in to stars/superstars I'm sorry but that's the additional stuff I meant to this topic.

I knew there was 3* players in the NFL but few & far between become stars/superstars either in college(like Cam) or in the NFL. Thanks!
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They're *3 for a reason.
 
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#59
#59
BruinVol said:
Define not many?

If you saying only a few thousand 3stars have played in the NFL then I agree with you.
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You do realize the only real way your argument holds any weight is because there are just not that many 5* awarded out of high school. There are far, far more 3* than 5* players. If 5*s were awarded as much as even 4*, your argument would fail.

So its a quality v quantity argumen.
 
#61
#61
BigOrangeTrain said:
You do realize the only real way your argument holds any weight is because there are just not that many 5* awarded out of high school. There are far, far more 3* than 5* players. If 5*s were awarded as much as even 4*, your argument would fail.

So its a quality v quantity argumen.
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My argument?

Hell yea I am a star gazer. I want 5 stars all day long.

wth are you talking about?
 
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#64
#64
My opinion is this: If the recruiting services rated more players as 5* recruits, their product would be watered down and this is bad for their business. I personally believe there are many more 5* recruits out there. They just don't get the bump because its not good for the recruiting game.

The best players make it to the NFL regardless of their star rating. Case solved. Thank you. Now, back to your pissing contests.
 
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#65
#65
Batman1948 said:
My opinion is this: If the recruiting services rated more players as 5* recruits, their product would be watered down and this is bad for their business. I personally believe there are many more 5* recruits out there. They just don't get the bump because its not good for the recruiting game.

The best players make it to the NFL regardless of their star rating. Case solved. Thank you. Now, back to your pissing contests.
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No.

Not everybody can be the best. That's why there are so few *5.
 
#66
#66
Robtn77 said:
2014 Draft

Here's the breakdown of the 2014 draft total players drafted.

Five star - 16

Four star - 77

Three star - 92

Two star or unrated - 71

So yes there have been thousands of 3 star and lower rated players to go on to the NFL. The problem is that the 4 and 5 star recruits only make up about 10% of the total pool of athletes for each class across the country combined. In the link above. There were only 422 4 and 5 star recruits for the 2010 class which would have been in the 2014 draft given they hadn't left school early. And 4,078 3 star or lower rated players in the 2010 class.

63.6% of the 2014 draft were 3 star or lower rated players. Now granted it is more difficult to make it to the NFL as a 3 star or lower athlete because of the number of 3 star athletes total.
Click to expand...
Based on those numbers, about 22% of 4-star and 5-star recruits make it to the NFL and about 4% of 3-star and lower recruits make it to the NFL. These numbers seem consistent with the ideas that a) 4-star and 5-star recruits are much more likely to become NFL quality players than 3-star and below recruits (about .22 /.04 = 5.5 times as likely), and yet still only about one out of every five 5-star and 4-star recruits are likely to become NFL quality players (1 / 0.22 = 4.5)... which seems consistent with the idea that one would preferably want to stack the roster with 5-star and 4-star recruits in order to field as many future NFLers as possible (e.g. max about 0.22 × 25 × 4 = 22). Rosters from classes of all 3-star and below recruits would, on average, end up with only about 4 future NFLers (.04 × 25 × 4 = 4.0).
 
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#67
#67
Vols said:
Based on those numbers, about 22% of 4-star and 5-star recruits make it to the NFL and about 4% of 3-star and lower recruits make it to the NFL. These numbers seem consistent with the ideas that a) 4-star and 5-star recruits are much more likely to become NFL quality players than 3-star and below recruits (about .22 /.04 = 5.5 times as likely), and yet still only about one out of every five 5-star and 4-star recruits are likely to become NFL quality players (1 / 0.22 = 4.5)... which seems consistent with the idea that one would preferably want to stack the roster with 5-star and 4-star recruits in order to field as many future NFLers as possible (e.g. max about 0.22 × 25 × 4 = 22). Rosters from classes of all 3-star and below recruits would, on average, end up with only about 4 future NFLers (.04 × 25 × 4 = 4.0).
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I'm pretty sure in my post I said it was more difficult for a 3 star player to make it to the NFL in the last sentence. That's not what I was responding to. The comment was made that not many 3 star players make it to the NFL. My post was to show that there are more 3 star and lower rated athletes making it to the NFL than 4 or 5 star players. Just stating facts when some just make comments with nothing to back it up.
 
#68
#68
Vols said:
Based on those numbers, about 22% of 4-star and 5-star recruits make it to the NFL and about 4% of 3-star and lower recruits make it to the NFL. These numbers seem consistent with the ideas that a) 4-star and 5-star recruits are much more likely to become NFL quality players than 3-star and below recruits (about .22 /.04 = 5.5 times as likely), and yet still only about one out of every five 5-star and 4-star recruits are likely to become NFL quality players (1 / 0.22 = 4.5)... which seems consistent with the idea that one would preferably want to stack the roster with 5-star and 4-star recruits in order to field as many future NFLers as possible (e.g. max about 0.22 × 25 × 4 = 22). Rosters from classes of all 3-star and below recruits would, on average, end up with only about 4 future NFLers (.04 × 25 × 4 = 4.0).
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Nice numbers.

Another way one could crunch the numbers...

If you could use the composite * rating for each draft eligible player in a draft, and then find out what % of each * was drafted.

In this case, this counts for people who are no longer playing football as well, since they were subject to a rating in HS. Probably pretty difficult to do, but that would give a more accurate picture of what those HS athletes actually accomplished in college, and their potential pro futures.
 
#69
#69
Robtn77 said:
I'm pretty sure in my post I said it was more difficult for a 3 star player to make it to the NFL in the last sentence. That's not what I was responding to. The comment was made that not many 3 star players make it to the NFL. My post was to show that there are more 3 star and lower rated athletes making it to the NFL than 4 or 5 star players. Just stating facts when some just make comments with nothing to back it up.
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Oh, sorry. Wasn't trying to rebut what you said. Was interested by the data you provided.
 
#70
#70
Lol

Did y'all forget those rankings are intended for a collegiate analysis, not an NFL prediction? Once you're in the league, nothing is handed to you and stars don't matter.

But if you're trying to say stars don't matter lol Bama, Clemson, Oh St, etc all disagree.
 
#71
#71
nicksjuzunk said:
If a player did not produce in Highschool, I don't really care to take them as a JUCO.

JUCO exceptions:

1. Highly rated in high school, but didn't have the grades, or transferred from his D1 school: see, Kamara.

2. Not highly rated in school, due to grades, but was an obvious animal. See CP84

3. Freakish athlete who barely knows the game due to living overseas. 33% chance of success, IMO. See Kongbo
------
I really don't care for guys who were lightly recruited in HS, and all of the sudden look like decent players. You find some, but then you also.... Woody Quinn, Jeff George, DJ Henderson, Lanier, Blair... There are a ton more, but I can't even remember their names
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Depends on the player and what position they play. You rarely get dominating D-linemen from Juco. LBs are even more of the exception. CBs and safeties are usually 50/50 just like RBs and WRs. I definitely don't like Juco O-linemen, TEs, or QBs(Cam Newton doesn't count lol).
 
#72
#72
IndianaVolunteer said:
Lol

Did y'all forget those rankings are intended for a collegiate analysis, not an NFL prediction? Once you're in the league, nothing is handed to you and stars don't matter.

But if you're trying to say stars don't matter lol Bama, Clemson, Oh St, etc all disagree.
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I know we need to get some of these highly rated athletic CBs. Mark Fields at Clemson is playing lights out as a Freshman. Kid is dominating WRs.
 
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#73
#73
The Breakerboy said:
I know we need to get some of these highly rated athletic CBs. Mark Fields at Clemson is playing lights out as a Freshman. Kid is dominating WRs.
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Fields is a sophomore. We went after him and one of his teammates (TE for UNC now) in 2015 but couldn't manage to get enough traction with them.
 
#74
#74
Darth_Shiveman said:
Fields is a sophomore. We went after him and one of his teammates (TE for UNC now) in 2015 but couldn't manage to get enough traction with them.
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Oh thought he was a freshman. He's dominating though which is why we've got to either leave our top notch DBs on defense or recruit more top notch guys.

Byrd looks great on offense but we don't throw the ball enough to warrant a switch. I have little doubt he'd be entrenched as a starter at CB right now.

Osborne must play more he looks good.

Warrior should've been inserted into the line up. Shoop just has to get to work and coach the back end up. I like Martinez but his time has come. Our guys don't make nearly enough plays for my taste. It's been an ongoing problem and for bringing Terry Fair back to replace him. I think he could make that group do numbers and actually develop #8. 😎😎😎😎
 
#75
#75
The Breakerboy said:
Oh thought he was a freshman. He's dominating though which is why we've got to either leave our top notch DBs on defense or recruit more top notch guys.

Byrd looks great on offense but we don't throw the ball enough to warrant a switch. I have little doubt he'd be entrenched as a starter at CB right now.

Osborne must play more he looks good.

Warrior should've been inserted into the line up. Shoop just has to get to work and coach the back end up. I like Martinez but his time has come. Our guys don't make nearly enough plays for my taste. It's been an ongoing problem and for bringing Terry Fair back to replace him. I think he could make that group do numbers and actually develop #8. 😎😎😎😎
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Warrior looked great in run support against USCe. Osborne's athleticism was evident.


I get that the coaches are worried about blown coverages, but at what point is it not just as much of a risk to have the kids in there like Buchanan who don't bust their coverages but get toasted regardless?
 
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