25$ to vote.

#26
#26
TIGER DEN said:
HAVE GUN WILL TRAVEL THE BETTER PLAN MAY BE TO JUST SHOOT EVERYONE WHO DOESN'T VOTE !
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thanks Adolph/Stalin/Chavez/Pol Pot/Castro.

in case you didn't realize it, the right to vote is also a right not to so people should neither be paid to nor should they be forced to vote.
 
#27
#27
MG1968 said:
bad idea, there are too many ill-informed people voting already. Imagine if the KKK paid $50 to each and every one of it's toothless, redneck membership to go vote.

It's far better to have a million well-informed voters go to the polls than 10 million Oprah watchers or 100 million idiots who'll look at a candidate's middle name and immediately see the boogie man.
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yeah you need to be an elitist with a gpa of 3.9 to be able to vote ! There are alot of people in this country that don't have access to any information other than mainstream media . (Sad but true ) No one has any more right to vote than the next guy . also everyone is entitled to their opinion whether or not anyone else agrees or not ! All i say is JUST VOTE
 
#28
#28
MG1968 said:
thanks Adolph/Stalin/Chavez/Pol Pot/Castro.

in case you didn't realize it, the right to vote is also a right not to so people should neither be paid to nor should they be forced to vote.
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I agree about forcing the people , I was just joking about that part , (sorry if you disagree ) but I think there are alot of people who should take more of an interest in politics and vote , smart and not so smart
 
#29
#29
TIGER DEN said:
yeah you need to be an elitist with a gpa of 3.9 to be able to vote ! There are alot of people in this country that don't have access to any information other than mainstream media . (Sad but true ) No one has any more right to vote than the next guy . also everyone is entitled to their opinion whether or not anyone else agrees or not ! All i say is JUST VOTE
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These people live in communities without libraries?

As a side note, I would like to express the fact that I do not agree with government funded libraries. However, since they are out there, people might as well use them and vote intelligently or not at all.
 
#30
#30
the mainstream media is a better source of information than Oprah, Steven Colbert, Jon Stewart, American Idol, or popular music. Informing yourself doesn't have to involve a 3.9 gpa or access to a library or even the internet.
 
#31
#31
MG1968 said:
the mainstream media is a better source of information than Oprah, Steven Colbert, Jon Stewart, American Idol, or popular music. Informing yourself doesn't have to involve a 3.9 gpa or access to a library or even the internet.
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I agree with part of what you say , ( the library ) but most people with jobs and children have very limited time to go there and get the information that they need to be well informed voters and the mainstreet media is where they get their information , in which imo is the most biased information you can get . So I guess they should not have the right to vote because they are ( uninformed ) citizens of this country . I really wished more people had time to research all the politicians themselves but they don't ! And believe or not there have been different people here on the VN that have enlightened me to have a little different opinion of all the politicians even though I still think that all of them are after our money only for their profit . Not one of them have our countries best interest at heart
 
#32
#32
TIGER DEN said:
I agree with part of what you say , ( the library ) but most people with jobs and children have very limited time to go there and get the information that they need to be well informed voters and the mainstreet media is where they get their information , in which imo is the most biased information you can get . So I guess they should not have the right to vote because they are ( uninformed ) citizens of this country . I really wished more people had time to research all the politicians themselves but they don't ! And believe or not there have been different people here on the VN that have enlightened me to have a little different opinion of all the politicians even though I still think that all of them are after our money only for their profit . Not one of them have our countries best interest at heart
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There is always time to fit into your life what it is that your give priority to. I would be willing to place money on >90% of Americans having enough time left over after work and feeding their families, to sit down with a newspaper and a book and inform themselves so as to make an educated decision. However, most citizens of this country are uninformed because the will to educate themselves is lacking. They would rather spend their time watching Deal or No Deal (which is, by the way, the most mundane and boring game and show ever).

These are the same people who after "never having time" to read up on the issues, rush after work to their local polling station, and stand in line for an hour or two to cast a vote for someone that they essentially know nothing about. So, they can afford to waste that hour or two on that day, but can't manage to fit in 15 to 30 minutes daily to actually find out what is going on in this country?

If you haven't figured it out already, I am not about to buy into your argument for the poor, ignorant family man (or woman.)
 
#33
#33
therealUT said:
There is always time to fit into your life what it is that your give priority to. I would be willing to place money on >90% of Americans having enough time left over after work and feeding their families, to sit down with a newspaper and a book and inform themselves so as to make an educated decision. However, most citizens of this country are uninformed because the will to educate themselves is lacking. They would rather spend their time watching Deal or No Deal (which is, by the way, the most mundane and boring game and show ever).

These are the same people who after "never having time" to read up on the issues, rush after work to their local polling station, and stand in line for an hour or two to cast a vote for someone that they essentially know nothing about. So, they can afford to waste that hour or two on that day, but can't manage to fit in 15 to 30 minutes daily to actually find out what is going on in this country?

If you haven't figured it out already, I am not about to buy into your argument for the poor, ignorant family man (or woman.)
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there was never any doubt what so ever that YOU would buy into it and I would not expect you to " buy in to it " Vote the way most elitist would and I will vote the way I choose . Better yet why don' you go ahead and tell me who I am going to vote for instead of telling me that I should't vote at all seeing how you seem to know who should vote and who should not ! Please tell me ? I know you can
 
#34
#34
TIGER DEN said:
there was never any doubt what so ever that YOU would buy into it and I would not expect you to " buy in to it " Vote the way most elitist would and I will vote the way I choose . Better yet why don' you go ahead and tell me who I am going to vote for instead of telling me that I should't vote at all seeing how you seem to know who should vote and who should not ! Please tell me ? I know you can
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I wouldn't exactly refer to myself as "an elitist." After all, you were the one who joked that a good plan would be to "kill everyone who doesn't vote."

By the way, I really don't need to make any wild guesses about who you are going to vote for. The way in which you recklessly throw the word 'elitist' around definitely points out that you will vote for whoever will redistribute the most wealth.
 
#35
#35
therealUT said:
I wouldn't exactly refer to myself as "an elitist." After all, you were the one who joked that a good plan would be to "kill everyone who doesn't vote."

By the way, I really don't need to make any wild guesses about who you are going to vote for. The way in which you recklessly throw the word 'elitist' around definitely points out that you will vote for whoever will redistribute the most wealth.
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your right in one aspect, that you really shouldn't make any wild guesses or asumptions and since you brought it up I'm glad you put the JOKED in there and as far as the word elitist , if it don't apply to you then don't let it bother you . Only you know truly who you are , but from you earlier post , I thought you didn't want certain people to vote and I don't think there is anyone anywhere that should decide who votes and who don't . but it could be voted on by all citizens , to see if it should be illegal to leave all the voting rights to a certain group of more intelligent people , then I'm all for it
 
#36
#36
TIGER DEN said:
your right in one aspect, that you really shouldn't make any wild guesses or asumptions and since you brought it up I'm glad you put the JOKED in there and as far as the word elitist , if it don't apply to you then don't let it bother you . Only you know truly who you are , but from you earlier post , I thought you didn't want certain people to vote and I don't think there is anyone anywhere that should decide who votes and who don't . but it could be voted on by all citizens , to see if it should be illegal to leave all the voting rights to a certain group of more intelligent people , then I'm all for it
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You should pick up the Constitution and read it. You might be surprised at the lack of any idea of universal suffrage. You might also want to check out electoral process through the first century of our nation. During those years, qualified voters voted only for their US Representative and their State Legislators. They neither voted for the President nor their state's US Senators. So, feel free to call me an elitist. I will simply refer to myself as one who holds the Constitution and the idea of America, as put forth by our Founding Fathers, in high regard (feel free to read about what Adams, Franklin, Jefferson, Washington, Paine, etc. thought about democracies.)
 
#37
#37
therealUT said:
You should pick up the Constitution and read it. You might be surprised at the lack of any idea of universal suffrage. You might also want to check out electoral process through the first century of our nation. During those years, qualified voters voted only for their US Representative and their State Legislators. They neither voted for the President nor their state's US Senators. So, feel free to call me an elitist. I will simply refer to myself as one who holds the Constitution and the idea of America, as put forth by our Founding Fathers, in high regard (feel free to read about what Adams, Franklin, Jefferson, Washington, Paine, etc. thought about democracies.)
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Nice to see you bring up the relatively recent development of the direct election of US Senators. IMHO, the 17th Amendment was one of the worst things ever to happen to our Republic.
 
#38
#38
HotlantaVol said:
Nice to see you bring up the relatively recent development of the direct election of US Senators. IMHO, the 17th Amendment was one of the worst things ever to happen to our Republic.
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I could not agree more. If our electoral college vanishes, or should I say when it vanishes, then people will look back at the 17th Amendment as the beginning of the end of the Republic.
 
#40
#40
therealUT said:
You should pick up the Constitution and read it. You might be surprised at the lack of any idea of universal suffrage. You might also want to check out electoral process through the first century of our nation. During those years, qualified voters voted only for their US Representative and their State Legislators. They neither voted for the President nor their state's US Senators. So, feel free to call me an elitist. I will simply refer to myself as one who holds the Constitution and the idea of America, as put forth by our Founding Fathers, in high regard (feel free to read about what Adams, Franklin, Jefferson, Washington, Paine, etc. thought about democracies.)
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you may refer to yourself any way you wish. But we don't live in the first century of our country anymore and at this point every one has the right to vote if you are a legal citizen with no restrictions and they should . although there are certain groups of people that think there should only be an elite group of people voting ( I respectfully disagree with this logic ) I'm headed to sports now Good night :wavey:
 
#41
#41
TIGER DEN said:
you may refer to yourself any way you wish. But we don't live in the first century of our country anymore and at this point every one has the right to vote if you are a legal citizen with no restrictions and they should . although there are certain groups of people that think there should only be an elite group of people voting ( I respectfully disagree with this logic ) I'm headed to sports now Good night :wavey:
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Not so. Citizens under the age of 18 are not allowed to vote. 18, 19, and 20 year old Citizens are allowed to vote, yet have restrictions placed upon their freedoms that Citizens 21 and above do not.
 
#42
#42
TIGER DEN said:
you may refer to yourself any way you wish. But we don't live in the first century of our country anymore and at this point every one has the right to vote if you are a legal citizen with no restrictions and they should . although there are certain groups of people that think there should only be an elite group of people voting ( I respectfully disagree with this logic ) I'm headed to sports now Good night :wavey:
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I agree. Point being I can assure you there are a lot of soldiers that fight and have fought for this country that probably lack/lacked the education to understand the concepts of war,voting,etc. I know my uncle who was KIA in Normandy in 1944, went in as a poorly educated farmer just to be able to help his mom and dad get by and feed the family.I just can't see not letting him or others like him vote.Kind of crazy if you ask me.Don't ask them to fight if they can't vote!
 
#43
#43
Tell me exactly why soldiers, just for being soldiers, should have a say in the policies of a nation?
 
#45
#45
I understand that, but utfantilidie seems to imply that they should have more of a right to vote than anyone else. I would wholeheartedly disagree (Starship Troopers???)

If soldiers had more of a right to vote than others, than we would be immersed in wars of territorial gain...

If the income tax is going to be around for a while (unfortunately it will be), then I believe the right to vote should first be restricted to those who put more money into the system than the system spends on them. The next step from there is to have a completely elementary quiz at the polling station.
 
#46
#46
therealUT said:
If the income tax is going to be around for a while (unfortunately it will be), then I believe the right to vote should first be restricted to those who put more money into the system than the system spends on them. The next step from there is to have a completely elementary quiz at the polling station.
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Works for me.
 
#48
#48
this is the threat that a candidate like obama is. he has potential to bring out a youth that both: doesnt usually vote but when they do they vote overwhelmingly democrat. if they do come out in the same numbers other demographics do it will be hard for him to lose.

therealUT said:
I could not agree more. If our electoral college vanishes, or should I say when it vanishes, then people will look back at the 17th Amendment as the beginning of the end of the Republic.
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the most convincing argument the other way of course, is that more people voted for Gore then Bush, but we all know who became president. it's especially convincing to most these days now that we've had 7 years of that result.

we already change the way we allocate the electoral college. wasnt it originally intended to chose without voter involvement? a couple states award theirs proportionally already i believe.

republicans in CA tried to get a ballot initiative that would award it's electoral votes proportionally, an obvious partisan move that would almost lock democrats out of the white house. luckily it didnt get on the ballot.

california passed a law to award theirs to the winner of the national popular vote in the event that enough states to equal 270 do the same. it may have got the veto by arnold but my point is that it seems like it's just a matter of time... for better or worse...
 
#49
#49
falseintellect said:
this is the threat that a candidate like obama is. he has potential to bring out a youth that both: doesnt usually vote but when they do they vote overwhelmingly democrat.
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Haven't the Democrats been bitten by the youth vote strategy repeatedly? No matter how energized they seem, they find better things to do on election day.
 
#50
#50
then those youths grow up and realize that the higher taxes they're actually having to pay as the result of an Obama presidency aren't producing the promised results of lower poverty and economic prosperity.
 
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