3 Years for Improvement/Return to Relevance (Long)

#51
#51
LWSVOL said:
JMO

Jones will need to get 2 top five classes and two top 10 classes before we can compete for the East. Don't see it happening until a huge talent upgrade to level playing field
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We played neck and neck with Georgia, played Florida tight for 3 quarters, and had the ball with a chance to beat South Carolina ... with the crappy team we had this year. Why would it take 4 classes to compete with any of those teams?
 
#52
#52
govolzgo said:
We played neck and neck with Georgia, played Florida tight for 3 quarters, and had the ball with a chance to beat South Carolina ... with the crappy team we had this year. Why would it take 4 classes to compete with any of those teams?
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We had 3 chances to beat GA at the end. I believe it went int., int, fumble.
 
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#53
#53
3 years is long enough--if UT isn't back winning big by then, time to make another change.
 
#54
#54
LWSVOL said:
JMO

Jones will need to get 2 top five classes and two top 10 classes before we can compete for the East. Don't see it happening until a huge talent upgrade to level playing field
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Larry what do you think are the odds that CBJ can pull that off?
 
#55
#55
VolunteerHillbilly said:
Vols have taken a lot from Ga. Getting shut out of NC and SC has been tough.
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One of the most beneficial developments we could hope for would be if Spurrier decides to hang up his whistle and take up golf full-time. He is 67 after all. That could reopen the pipeline to South Carolina somewhat.
 
#56
#56
this is why i can't understand how people can claim dooley did anything of any significance to right the ship.

if tennessee is at least 3 years away from relevance, than dooley didn't accomplish a thing during his time at tennessee. how can the program be any better off if it will take 3 years to be relevant. it makes no sense whatsoever to me.

i believe it would normally take more than 3 years under the current circumstances to get back to where tennessee needs to be. however, it looks like tennessee is about to actually catch a break. in 2014, there are numerous legacies of legitimate quality on the recruiting trail that even derek dooley may have been able to get to come to tennessee......if he actually knew who they were.

but, the talent is not close to where it needs to be right now which is why it will take awhile.
 
#57
#57
Cartervol said:
I agree.. I also would like to know how Jones will ever get those type of classes? I don't see it.. Not with the landscape of the SEC today..
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This is why this class is so important to the long-term viability of the Vols. Butch has to show he has some big-time recruiting qualities this time, just to let the SEC know he's going to be in the hunt and in the mix for a Top Five class 2014.

Flipping Cincy recruits just isn't good enough, IMHO.

I know it's a new coaching staff, but think about this: we are on course to be no better than even with Vanderbilt this recruiting cycle.

Another month to go. Lots of time to make things happen, and elite coaches WOULD make big things happen in Y1.
 
#58
#58
Brak said:
Now that the dust has settled I thought I would give my own personal breakdown of the results I would like to see over the next 3 years for Coach Jones to show that he can lead us back to relevance.

I'll admit I was not overly excited about the Coach Jones hire at the beginning, perhaps I was too caught up in the hype of getting that irrefutable big name coach that no one could deny would win quick and unite the fan base, and I don't just mean Gruden either; simply a big name coach. In any case, the crazy whirlwind of a coaching search is now over and it is time to give the man in the driver's seat a chance to prove his worth. He has started out well with his speech in the press conference and then with retaining Coach Graham. It would have been nice to bring Tee back home but I don't see how Tee staying at USC could be faulted to Coach Jones. Below is my year to year breakdown of what Coach Jones will need to accomplish to show he can get the job done and bring us back to the level that all of us Vol fans crave.

Year 1 - Become bowl eligible, that is it. We don't even have to get the bowl win; eligibility is the key for year one. It would be, although only slightly, an improvement from this past year.

Year 2 - Bowl eligibility is a given by this time and a bowl win depending on the level of opponent in the bowl. Secondly we need a quality win over a quality opponent and not a Cincy or NC State. It needs to be against a ranked opponent and/or SEC rival. While Florida and Alabama might be out of our reach still at this point a Georgia or South Carolina shouldn't be that far of a stretch.

Year 3 - Any question or worry about reaching a respectable bowl should be gone, it should be a given by this time. Next we need to at least be competing for the East, we don't have to win it just be in the conversation. For the past three years under Dooley any hope of the East was gone by early to mid-October.

Year 4 and on - Be relevant on the national stage.

This is very similar to the grace period I was willing to give Dooley when he was hired. I found myself over the past 2-3 years trying to rationalize too many of Dooley's short comings as a coach into an excuse for more time. The year one rebuild and installation of new coaches, scheme, and personnel, year two with injuries to key players, along with countless others. Year 3 he had no more excuses and had failed at all of the above mentioned goals with the exception of year one. Clearly it was time for him to go, I think I knew that after the Kentucky (2011) game but kept trying to fool myself until the Miss St (2012) game, by the time Missouri rolled around I already knew the outcome of any game we played that we didn't clearly outmatch our opponent. Coach Jones goes into a better overall situation than Dooley with a better resume as well, but that is nowhere near a guarantee to win at this level. I'm really hoping Coach Jones gets it done and he should be given the time required to do so, it is a real shame that Vol fans have to hit the reset button once again and allow this drought of relevance to pass but if everything works out maybe it will all be worth it.
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Great post
 
#59
#59
99gator said:
this is why i can't understand how people can claim dooley did anything of any significance to right the ship.

if tennessee is at least 3 years away from relevance, than dooley didn't accomplish a thing during his time at tennessee. how can the program be any better off if it will take 3 years to be relevant. it makes no sense whatsoever to me.

i believe it would normally take more than 3 years under the current circumstances to get back to where tennessee needs to be. however, it looks like tennessee is about to actually catch a break. in 2014, there are numerous legacies of legitimate quality on the recruiting trail that even derek dooley may have been able to get to come to tennessee......if he actually knew who they were.

but, the talent is not close to where it needs to be right now which is why it will take awhile.
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What if the talent is there but that talent was never exploited properly due to lack of good coaching. Ole Piss for example. They had some talent but a decent coach exploited that talent. A&M had decent coaching plus a damn good QB. Who's to say that bUTch and staff puts aces in their places and makes this team far more competitive than the last Guy. Just saying.
 
#60
#60
darkgable said:
What if the talent is there but that talent was never exploited properly due to lack of good coaching. Ole Piss for example. They had some talent but a decent coach exploited that talent. A&M had decent coaching plus a damn good QB. Who's to say that bUTch and staff puts aces in their places and makes this team far more competitive than the last Guy. Just saying.
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There lies the problem. Right now enough talent is not there. Our best talent went pro.
 
#61
#61
Eddie Vol Halen said:
This is why this class is so important to the long-term viability of the Vols. Butch has to show he has some big-time recruiting qualities this time, just to let the SEC know he's going to be in the hunt and in the mix for a Top Five class 2014.

Flipping Cincy recruits just isn't good enough, IMHO.

I know it's a new coaching staff, but think about this: we are on course to be no better than even with Vanderbilt this recruiting cycle.

Another month to go. Lots of time to make things happen, and elite coaches WOULD make big things happen in Y1.
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It is absolutely absurd for any rational human being to think that a coach is going to come into a program in December and start flipping a boatload of four and five star recruits. I would like to meet that staff especially in the sec. A few here and there yes but the way some of you are thinking is fantasy. This staff knows what its doing. They're not stupid.
 
#62
#62
darkgable said:
It is absolutely absurd for any rational human being to think that a coach is going to come into a program in December and start flipping a boatload of four and five star recruits. I would like to meet that staff especially in the sec. A few here and there yes but the way some of you are thinking is fantasy. This staff knows what its doing. They're not stupid.
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Saban did it.

Gruden would have done it.

Hell, James Franklin is doing it at Vanderbilt.
 
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#64
#64
Our program will have little equity until we beat Florida or Alabama. Think about it... this year (2012) was the chance--we had Florida beat when that moron Muschamp called a fake punt. A few series later we were down and it went from an 8-9 win season to, well, what we got. It was Dooley's Waterloo and, in my opinion, set us back as a program two to three years. You could feel the air being let out of Neyland Stadium and it was symbolic of what was happen.

The climb at this point looks very steep. Jones has plenty of work to do and will need to beat a few teams he's not supposed in the first two years. If he does that, he'll have UT back in the conversation in year 3 and 4.
 
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#65
#65
darkgable said:
Not one of them flipped a boatload. You're speculating on Gruden. Franklin didn't. Saban his first year? Show me. Don't speculate.
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Flipped, shipped, whatever.

Saban pulled a top three class his first year at Alabama.

Gruden pulling talent to Tennessee is the same kind of "speculating" as speculating the sun will rise tomorrow.

Franklin pulled unheard of talent to Vanderbilt his first year, and now he is killing it.

Elite coaches recruit at an elite level (for their school). At Tennessee an elite coach is in the Top Five often and Top 10 regularly. Butch has to show he is that calibre. Cincy flips won't do it.
 
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#66
#66
Eddie Vol Halen said:
Flipped, shipped, whatever.

Saban pulled a top three class his first year at Alabama.

Gruden pulling talent to Tennessee is the same kind of "speculating" as speculating the sun will rise tomorrow.

Franklin pulled unheard of talent to Vanderbilt his first year, and now he is killing it.

Elite coaches recruit at an elite level (for their school). At Tennessee an elite coach is in the Top Five often and Top 10 regularly. Butch has to show he is that calibre. Cincy flips won't do it.
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I'm still confused on that boatload from Candy. You're speculating. Unreal expectations from les miserable. Its amazing to me. I understand the passion but some of you go overboard.
 
#68
#68
Eddie Vol Halen said:
Flipped, shipped, whatever.

Saban pulled a top three class his first year at Alabama.

Gruden pulling talent to Tennessee is the same kind of "speculating" as speculating the sun will rise tomorrow.

Franklin pulled unheard of talent to Vanderbilt his first year, and now he is killing it.

Elite coaches recruit at an elite level (for their school). At Tennessee an elite coach is in the Top Five often and Top 10 regularly. Butch has to show he is that calibre. Cincy flips won't do it.
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"A-Freaking-MEN"......

Bama has won three natl championship in four years for a freaking reason - and that reason is because they have the best talent in the freaking country!!!!

How many #1 recruiting classes has Saban had??? In the last five years I do not believe he has been out of the top 5....

Top 20 does not generally do well vs top 5.
 
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#69
#69
Good OP.

I just more or less want to see a better coached team in 2013 that plays like they expect to win. What we need more than anything is a culture change.
 
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