A comparison of Christianity and Islam.

#51
#51
gsvol said:
The biggest cause of the clash is islam's demand that they be the highest authority and all others must be subject to their authority worldwide.



John also said that if all the miracles performed by Jesus were recorded, that all the books of the world couldn't contain them.

I am not familiar with any claim that Solomon was the son of God, where do you get that??

Are you familiar with the book; Christ the Eternal Tao, or for that matter the teachings of Lao Tse??

Mathew 27;43:

for he said; "I am the Son of God."
(this was said by the mockers.)

Mathew 27;54:

"Truly this was the Son of God."
(spoken by the Roman Centurian.)

He was crucified for claiming to be the Son of God and didn't deny it, and this weekend we will celebrate Easter to commemorate His resurrection that proved who He really was.
Click to expand...


Right, what I'm saying is that I don't think there is any mention in Matthew,Mark, or Luke that Jesus himself ever claimed to be Son of God....Thus, the references to son of god by the mockers or the Roman Centurian COULD HAVE been put in later (not saying they were, but could have).

Also, we actually don't know why Jesus was crucified. Keep in mind that he was persecuted by the Roman authorities, not the Jewish leaders... The Romans only cared about political issues, and usually didn't get involved with religious or local problems (the reason why John the Baptist was beheaded by Herod).... Thus, the reason for his death by Roman hands had to be on political grounds, not religious ones....

And sorry but no, I am not familiar with the book or Lao Tse.
 
#52
#52
WPAINE said:
Actually, the story of Jesus saving the adulterer was added in a later addition of John. It is not found in the oldest documents that we have since found of John.

Also, in the Old Testament, Solomon was believed to be the Son of God as well....And Jesus never claims that he is the Son of God, the Creator of Man... The closest he comes is when he says "I am" to John the Baptist's question....Not saying he is or isn't, but in order for your statement to be right that Jesus claimed to be the Son of God, then you are basing that off of these two words (I am), which could have been added for literary sense, or could have been accurately recorded... Who knows.

Also, outside of John, Jesus being the Son of God is, I believe, not touched upon at great length in Matthew, Mark, or Luke....
Click to expand...

Interesting I'll have to do some reading about that. What would consider the Holy Trinity?

Luke 2:49 "Didn't you know I had to be in my Father's house."

John: 2:16 "... How dare you turn my Father's house into a market!"

John 10:18 "... This the command I received from my Father."

John 10: 28-29 "I give them eternal life, and they shall never parish... My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one."

John 14:2 "... in my Father's house are many rooms."
John 14:7 "If you really new me, you would know my Father as well."

John 14:9 "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, "Show us the Father'? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?"

John 14:13 "... So that the Son may bring glory to the Father."

Sounds like admitting to be the Son of God to me.
 
#53
#53
WPAINE said:
Right, what I'm saying is that I don't think there is any mention in Matthew,Mark, or Luke that Jesus himself ever claimed to be Son of God....Thus, the references to son of god by the mockers or the Roman Centurian COULD HAVE been put in later (not saying they were, but could have).

Also, we actually don't know why Jesus was crucified. Keep in mind that he was persecuted by the Roman authorities, not the Jewish leaders... The Romans only cared about political issues, and usually didn't get involved with religious or local problems (the reason why John the Baptist was beheaded by Herod).... Thus, the reason for his death by Roman hands had to be on political grounds, not religious ones....

And sorry but no, I am not familiar with the book or Lao Tse.
Click to expand...


Sure we do.
 
#54
#54
WPAINE said:
Also, we actually don't know why Jesus was crucified. Keep in mind that he was persecuted by the Roman authorities, not the Jewish leaders... The Romans only cared about political issues, and usually didn't get involved with religious or local problems (the reason why John the Baptist was beheaded by Herod).... Thus, the reason for his death by Roman hands had to be on political grounds, not religious ones....
Click to expand...

Not according to the gospels

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2027:11-26;&version=31;

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark 15:1-15;&version=31;

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke 23: 1-23;&version=31;

BibleGateway.com - PassageLookup: John 18:28-40;
 
Last edited:
#55
#55
Jesus was crucified by the romans to save face with the jews. That was their political desire. The jews wanted Christ dead because of his blasphemous assertions stating He was the Son of God and His outburst at the temple. Jewish religious leaders were afraid of His following and the romans were afraid of a jewish uprising. If you read the bible, also note Jesus' response on taxes and things of that nature. Every teaching of His was twisted to give cause for the romans to convict Him by the jewish leaders, therefore Pontius gives the line "I wash my hands of this" or something of that nature. The only thing the romans cared about was preventing an uprising, the only thing the jewish leaders cared about was removing the "obstacle" they perceived in Jesus.
 
#56
#56
JZVOL said:
Interesting I'll have to do some reading about that. What would consider the Holy Trinity?

Luke 2:49 "Didn't you know I had to be in my Father's house."

John: 2:16 "... How dare you turn my Father's house into a market!"

John 10:18 "... This the command I received from my Father."

John 10: 28-29 "I give them eternal life, and they shall never parish... My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one."

John 14:2 "... in my Father's house are many rooms."
John 14:7 "If you really new me, you would know my Father as well."

John 14:9 "Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, "Show us the Father'? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?"

John 14:13 "... So that the Son may bring glory to the Father."

Sounds like admitting to be the Son of God to me.
Click to expand...


My apologies, if you read my other posts my point was that outside of the book of John (in regards to matthew, mark, luke, and john) you have to connect some dots in order to find where Jesus referred to himself as the Son of God/Creator of Man....
 
#57
#57
joevol24 said:
Jesus was crucified by the romans to save face with the jews. That was their political desire. The jews wanted Christ dead because of his blasphemous assertions stating He was the Son of God and His outburst at the temple. Jewish religious leaders were afraid of His following and the romans were afraid of a jewish uprising. If you read the bible, also note Jesus' response on taxes and things of that nature. Every teaching of His was twisted to give cause for the romans to convict Him by the jewish leaders, therefore Pontius gives the line "I wash my hands of this" or something of that nature. The only thing the romans cared about was preventing an uprising, the only thing the jewish leaders cared about was removing the "obstacle" they perceived in Jesus.
Click to expand...


I think Jesus is pretty clear that he doesn't want to get involved in the political parts of society.. Give unto Caesar what is Caesar's, etc... I'll have to dig some old books up on all of this and will post more later on the subject...
 
#58
#58
OrangeEmpire said:
Why?
Click to expand...
Do to the fact that there is way too many religions.There is one god and one god only,all the Christ,Mohammad,Buddha,and the like are all bull.
I refuse to have faith within literature written by drunken men in ancient times.
I worship God in my own way...not by what a particular religion deems proper.
 
#59
#59
#60
#60
WPAINE said:
I'm confused how this doesn't confirm that he was crucified by the Romans? All 4 passages you highlight discuss how it was the Roman authorities....
Click to expand...
I was responding to where you said he was persecuted by the Romans, not the Jewish authorities. Pilate crucified Jesus at the behest of the Jewish authorities only after asserting that he found no reason to do so and then giving them the chance to free him...when they chose to release Barabbas.

I'm not saying the Romans played no part in it but the Jewish authorities are not off the hook.
 
#61
#61
WPAINE said:
My apologies, if you read my other posts my point was that outside of the book of John (in regards to matthew, mark, luke, and john) you have to connect some dots in order to find where Jesus referred to himself as the Son of God/Creator of Man....
Click to expand...

He spoke mostly in parables so that His people would achieve a higher understanding.

WPAINE said:
I think Jesus is pretty clear that he doesn't want to get involved in the political parts of society.. Give unto Caesar what is Caesar's, etc... I'll have to dig some old books up on all of this and will post more later on the subject...
Click to expand...

Thirty years ago when some others in the church I attended wanted to get our religion involved in politics, I said that; "historically, when religion has descended to the political plane, religion has been corrupted and politics has remained the same."

I think this recent history has proven me to be correct, nowadays it is quite fashionable to demonize the 'religious right' and the Christian religion hasn't gained so much but islam, which is necessarily political in nature,
according to it's own tenants, has gained greatly.
 
#62
#62
TENNFOLD1974 said:
Do to the fact that there is way too many religions.There is one god and one god only,all the Christ,Mohammad,Buddha,and the like are all bull.
I refuse to have faith within literature written by drunken men in ancient times.
I worship God in my own way...not by what a particular religion deems proper.
Click to expand...

Would you care to share how your worship God?
 
#63
#63
vader said:
I was responding to where you said he was persecuted by the Romans, not the Jewish authorities. Pilate crucified Jesus at the behest of the Jewish authorities only after asserting that he found no reason to do so and then giving them the chance to free him...when they chose to release Barabbas.

I'm not saying the Romans played no part in it but the Jewish authorities are not off the hook.
Click to expand...

From the Jewish side, I think they wanted to get rid of him because he was a threat to the establishment. From the Roman's side, I think they wanted to get rid of him because he was a threat to their authority, similar to the way all modern tyranny's systematically kill political "criminals".

As much as I dog religion, Jesus the man had plenty to say about social justice and compassion. I have no problem respecting his teachings. The divine miracles and divinity stuff is what I think is bogus.
 
#65
#65
WPAINE said:
My apologies, if you read my other posts my point was that outside of the book of John (in regards to matthew, mark, luke, and john) you have to connect some dots in order to find where Jesus referred to himself as the Son of God/Creator of Man....
Click to expand...

Oh, gotcha!
 
#66
#66
rjd970 said:
As much as I dog religion, Jesus the man had plenty to say about social justice and compassion. I have no problem respecting his teachings. The divine miracles and divinity stuff is what I think is bogus.
Click to expand...

What miracle do you think is bogus??

TENNFOLD1974 said:
meditation
Click to expand...

Any particular form?

Can you do a clock hour without moving while keeping you mind completely quiet??

Do you also fast?
 
#67
#67
gsvol said:
What miracle do you think is bogus??



Any particular form?

Can you do a clock hour without moving while keeping you mind completely quiet??

Do you also fast?
Click to expand...
No particular form,no fasting.
I just take 15 min of my day,sit back and reflect and try to tap in with my higher power(God)
 
#68
#68
TENNFOLD1974 said:
No particular form,no fasting.
I just take 15 min of my day,sit back and reflect and try to tap in with my higher power(God)
Click to expand...

I used to take thee day fasts occasionally but haven't for a long time, if nothing else they contribute to more self control.

I truly believe meditation is good for the soul, I probably don't do it enough.

It was funny though that once when I tried to do the daily sixty minute of stillness and quietness form, it was about thirty days before I could keep my mind quiet for five minutes. Eventually I got there and I discovered a deep pool of tranquility within myself of which that I had previously been unaware.

Prayer isn't a bad thing either. Some people pray and others both pray and listen or wait for an answer.
 
#69
#69
Happy Easter! Jesus rose from the dead for each one of us. It's a fact, and you can choose to believe now, by faith, or after life on Earth during judgment.
 
#70
#70
TENNFOLD1974 said:
Do to the fact that there is way too many religions.There is one god and one god only,all the Christ,Mohammad,Buddha,and the like are all bull.
I refuse to have faith within literature written by drunken men in ancient times.
I worship God in my own way...not by what a particular religion deems proper.
Click to expand...

So you aren't an agnostic then? A deist.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#72
#72
1.) The Bible is clear why Jesus was crucified. The reason was the disturbance in the Temple.

2.) So it is evil for religion to tell you not to have sex in your house but the government criminalizing it is ok?
 
#73
#73
I Cor. 15:12-19
The Resurrection of the Dead
12But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. 15More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. 16For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. 18Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. 19If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are to be pitied more than all men.
 
#74
#74
JZVOL said:
Happy Easter! Jesus rose from the dead for each one of us. It's a fact, and you can choose to believe now, by faith, or after life on Earth during judgment.
Click to expand...


Happy Easter back!! :)

John 3;18:

"He that believeth in Him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top