Also, we held the #3 team to 60 points tonight

#27
#27
sorry to bring reality to the convo... but UConn aint all that. We could've beat this team by 10+. Our weak mentality and extremely low Bball IQ (ie dumb turnovers) is killing this team. KH has to do a better job of getting through to these girls or we'll just be spinning our wheels for the foreseeable future. They haven't improved with the TO's ONE bit! Not one! I'm sure CKH is addressing it, she probably needs to change her strategy. If we are going to lose because of turnovers, I'd play ANYONE who doesn't turn it over! That means sitting Horston, Davis, Brown and Burrell until they can prove they can play with ball security. QUIT rewarding these girls for STUPID play! Sometimes you need to sacrifice wins to prove a point and improve for the future. This team is going nowhere this year anyway. Culture change is tough.
 
#28
#28
1reVOLver said:
As has been said often the past few days, this year's iteration of the Evil Empire is not as good as most recent versions. They depend on two freshmen and a couple of sophomores. Their bench is short.

They have struggled against some less than stellar competition. And last night their two best scorers missed a load of open shots.

Yes, our defense was pretty good, for the first half at least.

But they have a coach who preaches, "If the shots aren't falling, play better defense." So they did. They embarassed us (we embarassed ourselves, if you prefer) in the third quarter, then coasted to the end.

Are we making progress? Yes.
Are we better coached than last year? Certainly.
Should we get a consolation prize for something we did last night? If that's what it takes to get you through your day...

But consider this. A weaker than usual (for their team) opponent had an off night offensively. We lost. It wasn't close. Kellie has her work cut out for her. The postgame pressers by both coaches were honest and articulate and mutually respectful. That is an improvement.
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That's the way I saw the game also. While our defense did limit uconn's effectiveness in the paint, it was their own inability to hit open 3 point shots (4 of 18) that made them beatable last night. Unfortunately, not by us.
I also agree that we're headed in the right direction, though there are parts missing that must be filled. Next year Green will be one of those parts. Let's see what CKH can do to fill the other parts.
 
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#29
#29
Nute Gunray said:
The Lady Vols held UConn to 60 points. This is good and they should have won this game. I think that the number of turnovers will be the barometer for the improvement of the play of the LVs. This may not happen until next year.
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With this team, as the parts now stand, will not overcome turnovers and other things.
1 st. No ball handler at the point and if we find/develop one the rest of the team just is to sloppy with passes. Whats with these looping passes some of them not even cross court but 10-15 feet?
2 nd. At this time the "weave" out front looks like a traffic jam, how hard should this be for supposedly good players.
3 rd. The whole bunch seem to have a fragile psyche. Let a little go wrong and they fall apart. Where is the emotion?
4 th. Our "big" in the middle, is just and only that, big. Adds very little at this point.
5 th. Young, inexperienced, weak of arm and leg and as far as I can tell slow footed.

As you say "next year". But some of what I see may not be overcome even next year. I think a "Pat" type fire is gonna need to be built under this bunch. When Kellie thinks "babying" this bunch has gone far enough, she has got to get really tough. I just hope that time comes soon.
 
#30
#30
You guys were one player away from a potential win last night. A point guard with authority and control of the team on the court. If Zaay Green was healthy she would have cut the turnovers in half. Give yourselves 13 more shots; 20+ potential points. Kellie didn't lose the game. Players being forced to play outside their skill set by a manpower shortage is the culprit. Take Sabrina out of Oregon and what do you have - Tennessee in Green. Take Crystal out of UConn and you have 25 UConn turnovers. I hate to see fans criticize players and coaches for issues outside their control. Yes, someone could have recruited a backup point guard, but that person is not Kellie. Stop trying to fix blame; Enjoy your team. Expect greatness and you will have it.
 
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#31
#31
madtownvol said:
Did not post much on this game because I was not that optimistic about the outcome, particularly on hostile court.

Honestly, the defensive effort was first rate but when a team makes 27 TOs (and maybe half unforced), that is just too many possessions to lose.

Again, we saw that this team has some deficiencies. Our post players got outplayed. Key, in particular, does not work hard enough (or strong enough to get post position). She is good when the game is not too physical; KK does better in the scrum, in terms of holding position but her inability to jump, slow reflexes, and no quality post moves, make her a non-factor.

When Horston is struggling (and this was not her night), there is just not enough offensive punch beyond Rennia and some occassional bursts from Rae.

On the whole, I think this game is reasonable step in the right direction, particularly in terms of the first half. The LVs shot themselves in the foot with TOs or they could have a double digit lead at the end of the first half.

In the second half, they unfortunately looked like the team that lost to KY and melted under pressure.

We are still in January and I think they can get much better against pressing teams.

Obviously, the next stretch of conference games are where it will matter.

This game was just a media spectacle.
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Like what you say until your last sentence.

No not a media spectacle. The renewal of a ongoing battle. As was stated by announcers, this is the rivalry that made women's basketball. It will be and should be treated as such. (also went a long way in the development of a big part of ESPN women's sports coverage)
 
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#32
#32
Just a few days ago we had 20 turnovers to Bamas 6 and won on a miracle shot even if Davis has made them before. 27 turnovers to 11 versus UConn so that is 47 turnovers in 80 minutes while the opponents only have 17. We make a lot of turnovers and we don't force many. Turnovers only hurt you when you have more than the opponent. We seem to play decent defense but not very good at making teams turn it over. This is almost totally why were losing to the better teams.
 
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#34
#34
lvocd said:
I’m guessing that most of the CT fans were probably expecting to score at least 80 against a team they considered to be no competition.

They only scored 60 points, and many of those were literally handed to them by Tennessee after they lost their composure and started giving the game away. CT fans really can’t be all that smug about this win. Yes, a win is a win is a WIN. But the fact that this particular Tennessee team held their vaunted “well-oiled-machine” of an offense to 60 points should make them think.
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And we could only score 7 in the 3rd. That’s pathetic.
 
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#37
#37
NeedOrange said:
You guys were one player away from a potential win last night. A point guard with authority and control of the team on the court. If Zaay Green was healthy she would have cut the turnovers in half. Give yourselves 13 more shots; 20+ potential points. Kellie didn't lose the game. Players being forced to play outside their skill set by a manpower shortage is the culprit. Take Sabrina out of Oregon and what do you have - Tennessee in Green. Take Crystal out of UConn and you have 25 UConn turnovers. I hate to see fans criticize players and coaches for issues outside their control. Yes, someone could have recruited a backup point guard, but that person is not Kellie. Stop trying to fix blame; Enjoy your team. Expect greatness and you will have it.
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Yes, games like these show how big of a loss Zaay has been. We also don't have Collins do to the transfer who was another capable scorer with good athleticism. Imagine Collins on the floor instead of Kam and a guard rotation of Jazz, Zaay, and Horston. With that option, the team could have afforded to not rely on Jordan so much who just was not on her game or not ready for the bright lights.
 
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#38
#38
jeff1vol said:
sorry to bring reality to the convo... but UConn aint all that. We could've beat this team by 10+. Our weak mentality and extremely low Bball IQ (ie dumb turnovers) is killing this team. KH has to do a better job of getting through to these girls or we'll just be spinning our wheels for the foreseeable future. They haven't improved with the TO's ONE bit! Not one! I'm sure CKH is addressing it, she probably needs to change her strategy. If we are going to lose because of turnovers, I'd play ANYONE who doesn't turn it over! That means sitting Horston, Davis, Brown and Burrell until they can prove they can play with ball security. QUIT rewarding these girls for STUPID play! Sometimes you need to sacrifice wins to prove a point and improve for the future. This team is going nowhere this year anyway. Culture change is tough.
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So, you are saying sit an all-conference, and potential AA player, along with 90% of the offense to feature Rennie, Jazz, McCoy, Harris, KK, Key, and Saunders?

But Rennie had one TO (a really bad one) in 3 minutes and KK had 4 on 20. So, they gotta sit too, right? Not sure why you are sitting Brown who only had one TO in 20+ but hey lets prove a point.

Jeezus, when this board melts down it really melts down.
 
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#39
#39
savannahfan said:
Like what you say until your last sentence.

No not a media spectacle. The renewal of a ongoing battle. As was stated by announcers, this is the rivalry that made women's basketball. It will be and should be treated as such. (also went a long way in the development of a big part of ESPN women's sports coverage)
Click to expand...


Well, in some sense, all sports is a media spectacle. And there was a time when this game was significant because the programs were the most likely to win the NC and near locks to be final four teams.

Now, it is a game between 3 and 23 and if not for ESPN hyping the game because of the history, it would not have attracted that much inherent attention unless there had been an upset.

Uconn-Baylor was much closer to the spirit of the original series when the LVs were a national powerhouse.

I agree with the sentiment of CPS who stated the game had evolved to the point where there are many other rivalries that can capture attention.
 
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#40
#40
VolsFan-TX said:
I agree it was a good defensive effort. However, the offense had more turnovers (27) than made FGs (19), made 3-pointers (5) and made FTs (2) combined. It is hard to beat many teams when that happens.

I guess if we are looking for positives, then the overall defense and defensive rebounding (35) was good.
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That’s astounding. For field goals, we shot 33.9% to their 31.5%. For 3 pointers, we shot 33.3% to their 22.2%. Foul shots, we shot 2 of 7, while they shot 10 of 15.
We just kept giving them the ball.
 
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#41
#41
Raebo said:
Was it our defense that held them to 60 or was it their poor shooting? They made 4 out of 18 3 point shots, 22%. Most of them were open shots.
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It was their off shooting night. We left them open all night. We have been lucky most teams we play have not shot it well.
 
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#42
#42
As with most games, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. UConn's defense (Griffin) caused some of the LV turnovers but many were unforced and committed by players who were not comfortable playing in that environment. Some of UConn's many missed shots were the result of the LV interior defense but UConn missed a bunch of open shots it typically makes. UConn has some talented players who are not mentally tough enough to assume the roles vacated by Collier and Samuelson. That was not high quality basketball by either team last night but that was lost in the media hype and drama. Hopefully next year's game will produce better basketball.
 
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#43
#43
It’s not just our passing. Will leave out names, but I cringe every time I see our players dribble behind the back. How many times have we seen players dribble on their own feet? How many times have we seen players still dribbling, and losing the ball, as they drive the paint? Why are we dribbling under the basket when surrounded by the other team’s players? Why would our player dribble while facing the opponent? Some players don’t dribble the ball at all.

Heard of a Coach who made a player take a ball with him everywhere, to class, etc. Maybe that should be done, because to me, none of our players are confident dribbling the ball.
 
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#45
#45
madtownvol said:
So, you are saying sit an all-conference, and potential AA player, along with 90% of the offense to feature Rennie, Jazz, McCoy, Harris, KK, Key, and Saunders?

But Rennie had one TO (a really bad one) in 3 minutes and KK had 4 on 20. So, they gotta sit too, right? Not sure why you are sitting Brown who only had one TO in 20+ but hey lets prove a point.

Jeezus, when this board melts down it really melts down.
Click to expand...

Exactly! Read again if necessary. Play the players that take care of the ball. They are going to lose if they play or not. WHY? Because they turn. the. ball. over. 20+ times a game. Maybe... just MAYBE, they'll get the hint and VALUE the ball a bit more. WOW... what a "meltdown".
 
#47
#47
Our length presents great challenges for teams trying to score the ball.

Unfortunately, our shooting wouldn't hit the broad side of a barn.
 
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#48
#48
VolsFan-TX said:
Holding UConn to 60 is great until you realize the Lady Vols only scored 45.
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And that they held us to 14 points for the WHOLE second half. More TO’s than points.

Credit To UConn’s defense for loss of the Lady Vol’s loss of composure. Loss of composure isn’t the end of the world in one game We saw it happen to UConn in the last 5 minutes of their Baylor game

They’re young. They played a damn good first half. UConn’s defense showed Coach where to put some of her teaching/development skills

Davis belongs on a court with anybody
 
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#50
#50
With the score 37-33 Uconn at that point we had 22 turnover they had 10.... You cant shoot poorly AND have that many turnovers. If you protect the ball and don't give it to them freely you have a chance of someone getting hot and make a run. But you cant do both.
 
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