Are we really any better at this point?

#26
#26
Stats aside for a moment - the last 2 weeks have been disappointing, to say the least. How do we rate this seasons success when it is over? Is season over season performance most important? This is largely subjective. For me it is getting into the NCAA tournament. Another year on the outside and, after 3 years, it will not be unreasonable to look at coaching options. Not saying a change must be made, just that a look at who is out there may be in order.
 
#27
#27
NewJerseyVol said:
Stats aside for a moment - the last 2 weeks have been disappointing, to say the least. How do we rate this seasons success when it is over? Is season over season performance most important? This is largely subjective. For me it is getting into the NCAA tournament. Another year on the outside and, after 3 years, it will not be unreasonable to look at coaching options. Not saying a change must be made, just that a look at who is out there may be in order.
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The basketball forum just called and wants you to come home. :)
 
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#29
#29
NewJerseyVol said:
Stats aside for a moment - the last 2 weeks have been disappointing, to say the least. How do we rate this seasons success when it is over? Is season over season performance most important? This is largely subjective. For me it is getting into the NCAA tournament. Another year on the outside and, after 3 years, it will not be unreasonable to look at coaching options. Not saying a change must be made, just that a look at who is out there may be in order.
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Um, you realize what DS inherited right?

Raleigh was terrible, probably one of the worst coaches period in UT history. He definitely is up there with Houston and Dooley. He got 4 years and seemingly got worse every year.

So you want to give a proven winner only 3 years to turn this around and you're demanding an NCAAT appearance, and if not we can look around?
 
#30
#30
VolsSportsFan said:
Um, you realize what DS inherited right?

Raleigh was terrible, probably one of the worst coaches period in UT history. He definitely is up there with Houston and Dooley. He got 4 years and seemingly got worse every year.

So you want to give a proven winner only 3 years to turn this around and you're demanding an NCAAT appearance, and if not we can look around?
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No one needs to be calling for CDS job, or even be looking around, thats crazy. Anyone know how quick he got Irvine to the WS?
 
#32
#32
volforlife50 said:
No one needs to be calling for CDS job, or even be looking around, thats crazy. Anyone know how quick he got Irvine to the WS?
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His third year. It was the best season Irvine ever had in program history. I believe he got far that year in the tourney.
 
#33
#33
newokie03 said:
Just messing with you, I come to the baseball forum for levity. Living out here, I don't get to watch the Vols very often and this is the best place to get updated info.
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I know vol66, firestone, and various orhers watch many games. They can always help answer your questions to the best of our abilities. Vol66 is the expert on our program. Before I knew I could watch, I got my updates from him.
 
#34
#34
The despair following the SC series is excessive. Yes, SC is a college baseball juggernaut...but more than that, of ANY team in college baseball the past 3-4 years, they've shown an uncanny ability to never give up no matter how dire the situation is. They reached the CWS finals twice by coming back through the loser's bracket and beating Clemson twice so "no quit" is kinda in the bedrock of the program by now. If you follow Aaron Fitt or any national guys on twitter you'll see them all shaking their heads at all the dramatic wins they've pulled off so far. So immediately throwing in the towel because the team doesn't quite measure up to SC right now is insane. There's A LOT of teams that don't quite measure up to SC right now. There's a powerhouse in upstate SC that recruits their butt off every year but still lives in SC's shadow. You don't adopt that mindset overnight, if ever. But you sure as hell don't adopt it by getting negative so early in a coach's tenure.
 
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#35
#35
I was at that series in SC a few years ago. Even had a brief appearance on national tv in a crowd shot! Our win was incredible, unexpected. That's the beauty of baseball ... any given game has so many variables there's bound to be some surprises. Good ones and bad ones. The SC series this year gave us some bad ones, unfortunately. It happens.
I'm an optimist. Many Vols fans appear to be pessimists. First sign of trouble, and they think the worst. (Not counting you guys who have been posting here since BEFORE we showed so much promise.)
Stats and even win-loss records don't show the whole picture. If you've followed the Vols since CDS took over, and you don't see the improvement and a lot of reasons to be optimistic -- and have the patience to see their potential unfold -- you're a pessimist, period.
This team is good. Not dominant like we'd all love, but solid as hell.
Let's watch them get even better, and quit going negative so damn early and often!
 
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#36
#36
BaseVol said:
I was at that series in SC a few years ago. Even had a brief appearance on national tv in a crowd shot! Our win was incredible, unexpected. That's the beauty of baseball ... any given game has so many variables there's bound to be some surprises. Good ones and bad ones. The SC series this year gave us some bad ones, unfortunately. It happens.
I'm an optimist. Many Vols fans appear to be pessimists. First sign of trouble, and they think the worst. (Not counting you guys who have been posting here since BEFORE we showed so much promise.)
Stats and even win-loss records don't show the whole picture. If you've followed the Vols since CDS took over, and you don't see the improvement and a lot of reasons to be optimistic -- and have the patience to see their potential unfold -- you're a pessimist, period.
This team is good. Not dominant like we'd all love, but solid as hell.
Let's watch them get even better, and quit going negative so damn early and often!
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Exactly a lot of freakin season left.

Vols had their large amount of success until going into rapids the last two weeeks Auburn Tigers and even rockier the Gamecocks.
Egregious the way they lost the first two games that's why I say rockier.

Throught the reguar season including conference games most teams are going to go through a slump.
The Vols are going through it right now.
I'm optimistic they'll get out of it because this good team is going to get out of the mire of the slump.
 
#40
#40
Great come from behind vs vandy this Saturday night 10-9 two runs scored in a 3-2 count two outs the game winning double came off a first rate closer.
Can't recall having that kind of clutch performance vs a top 25 team that late in a long time.

Like the huskies last shot on final seconds win over the gators in the final seconds that's the way I think of the valiant dramatic come from behind win.
Still got game 3 but that's a major stride.
 
#41
#41
firestorm said:
Great come from behind vs vandy this Saturday night 10-9 two runs scored in a 3-2 count two outs the game winning double came off a first rate closer.
Can't recall having that kind of clutch performance vs a top 25 team that late in a long time.

Like the huskies last shot on final seconds win over the gators in the final seconds that's the way I think of the valiant dramatic come from behind win.
Still got game 3 but that's a major stride.
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I agree last years team would have quit and not won that game. This team is getting tougher in theses close games and it will pay off at the end. The only way you learn to preform in those type pressure situations is to be in them.
 
#42
#42
volfan411 said:
I agree last years team would have quit and not won that game. This team is getting tougher in theses close games and it will pay off at the end. The only way you learn to preform in those type pressure situations is to be in them.
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And theyve shown they can do it vs a quality team most recently vs a great closer.
Large confidence builder. Maybe this can be a season changer or turning point.

I recall those heartbreakers of comebacks past vols teams could not finish including 2010 vs Lsu with a bases loaded situation.
Why I bring that up to show how different this vols team is. Adversity reveals character vols shined in as in the 9th loaded the bases came back from 0-2 count to make it 3-2 and then deliver a game winning double.
A day after a blown lead it was vandy that was on the wrong end of a blown lead in one of the worst possible ways.
Vandy had the ball location at home but to a little to high. In field winning runs are more impressive in my opinion that gw homeruns or grandslams because players could still get thrown out.

I think its dann rare that a great closer loses a game he could and should have finished in that way with two outs along with the bases get loaded

Never stop fighting till the fight is done elliot ness said in the untouchables 80s movie and thats what the vols have been including most recently saturday.

Damn proud of the these guys and on saturday great to be a ut vols fan. A young vol proved to be valiant and clutch prospering when the vols need him the most.
 
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#43
#43
I started this thread last year and people on here really didn't like it. This team has shown that my assessment was correct. So here I go again.

First of all let me say that firing CDS is not the answer. Coach Bergy needs to go. His style and personality is a remake of CTR. He constantly degrades and demoralizes players. Why did it take him half a season to see Pruiett is his best option at third? Our middle infield is the worse in the SEC. Numbers dont lie. He runs the infield defense, do I need to say more? CDS also lets him run our offense, again numbers dont lie.

This years Mizzou team is proof it doesnt take 4 year to turn a program around. CDS is our best option he just needs to get better assistants. CDS runs a clean program and I have alot of respect for that.

As for the posters blaming it on Raleigh,REALLY! This is a CDS team. Only Wormsley remains and he's a non-factor. This group of players has not lived up to their hype, for what ever reason.

My opinion is Coach Bergy will continue to ruin UT baseball and CDS will continue to let him do so. Bergy is basically in charge of player development and our results on the field speak for his coaching ability.

So at this point "Are we really any better?" The answer is complicated. We have a better head coach, but our assistants are worse. The talent level is not better as these players have not lived up to their projections.
 
#44
#44
volforlife50 said:
I started this thread last year and people on here really didn't like it. This team has shown that my assessment was correct. So here I go again.

First of all let me say that firing CDS is not the answer. Coach Bergy needs to go. His style and personality is a remake of CTR. He constantly degrades and demoralizes players. Why did it take him half a season to see Pruiett is his best option at third? Our middle infield is the worse in the SEC. Numbers dont lie. He runs the infield defense, do I need to say more? CDS also lets him run our offense, again numbers dont lie.

This years Mizzou team is proof it doesnt take 4 year to turn a program around. CDS is our best option he just needs to get better assistants. CDS runs a clean program and I have alot of respect for that.

As for the posters blaming it on Raleigh,REALLY! This is a CDS team. Only Wormsley remains and he's a non-factor. This group of players has not lived up to their hype, for what ever reason.

My opinion is Coach Bergy will continue to ruin UT baseball and CDS will continue to let him do so. Bergy is basically in charge of player development and our results on the field speak for his coaching ability.

So at this point "Are we really any better?" The answer is complicated. We have a better head coach, but our assistants are worse. The talent level is not better as these players have not lived up to their projections.
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I missed this last year.......

I've seen a lot over the years and have been exposed to many things, I posted a while back that I sensed a bad vibe going on with the team. Wasn't sure if it was player animosity towards each other or coaches. You can just tell by the body language that something is going on, if you are correct in your assumptions posted above then that would explain a lot of things.
 
#45
#45
volforlife50 said:
I started this thread last year and people on here really didn't like it. This team has shown that my assessment was correct. So here I go again.

First of all let me say that firing CDS is not the answer. Coach Bergy needs to go. His style and personality is a remake of CTR. He constantly degrades and demoralizes players. Why did it take him half a season to see Pruiett is his best option at third? Our middle infield is the worse in the SEC. Numbers dont lie. He runs the infield defense, do I need to say more? CDS also lets him run our offense, again numbers dont lie.

This years Mizzou team is proof it doesnt take 4 year to turn a program around. CDS is our best option he just needs to get better assistants. CDS runs a clean program and I have alot of respect for that.

As for the posters blaming it on Raleigh,REALLY! This is a CDS team. Only Wormsley remains and he's a non-factor. This group of players has not lived up to their hype, for what ever reason.

My opinion is Coach Bergy will continue to ruin UT baseball and CDS will continue to let him do so. Bergy is basically in charge of player development and our results on the field speak for his coaching ability.

So at this point "Are we really any better?" The answer is complicated. We have a better head coach, but our assistants are worse. The talent level is not better as these players have not lived up to their projections.
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Not to mention he runs us out of games on the basepaths. He is going to get to CDS fired if anything does.
 
#46
#46
volforlife50 said:
I started this thread last year and people on here really didn't like it. This team has shown that my assessment was correct. So here I go again.

First of all let me say that firing CDS is not the answer. Coach Bergy needs to go. His style and personality is a remake of CTR. He constantly degrades and demoralizes players. Why did it take him half a season to see Pruiett is his best option at third? Our middle infield is the worse in the SEC. Numbers dont lie. He runs the infield defense, do I need to say more? CDS also lets him run our offense, again numbers dont lie.

This years Mizzou team is proof it doesnt take 4 year to turn a program around. CDS is our best option he just needs to get better assistants. CDS runs a clean program and I have alot of respect for that.

As for the posters blaming it on Raleigh,REALLY! This is a CDS team. Only Wormsley remains and he's a non-factor. This group of players has not lived up to their hype, for what ever reason.

My opinion is Coach Bergy will continue to ruin UT baseball and CDS will continue to let him do so. Bergy is basically in charge of player development and our results on the field speak for his coaching ability.

So at this point "Are we really any better?" The answer is complicated. We have a better head coach, but our assistants are worse. The talent level is not better as these players have not lived up to their projections.
Click to expand...

I agree with your assessment. If you look at player development with the position players, the results have been mediocre to poor. The pitching has been good enough to stay competitive but this team plays with very little confidence.

No question a staff shakeup is needed, but with CDS only having one year left on his deal I wonder who he could hire that could make a big impact. When you hire a head coach who is a pitching guy, the head assistant who is in charge of the position players is going to have a huge impact on the program. Its unfortunate things have turned out the way they have because CDS is a standup guy who, with the right staff, could have this program in much better shape.
 
#47
#47
FGT said:
I agree with your assessment. If you look at player development with the position players, the results have been mediocre to poor. The pitching has been good enough to stay competitive but this team plays with very little confidence.

No question a staff shakeup is needed, but with CDS only having one year left on his deal I wonder who he could hire that could make a big impact. When you hire a head coach who is a pitching guy, the head assistant who is in charge of the position players is going to have a huge impact on the program. Its unfortunate things have turned out the way they have because CDS is a standup guy who, with the right staff, could have this program in much better shape.[/QUOTE}

Will CDS let Bergy go based on their past relationship on the field and current friendship.
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#48
#48
OldTimer said:
FGT said:
I agree with your assessment. If you look at player development with the position players, the results have been mediocre to poor. The pitching has been good enough to stay competitive but this team plays with very little confidence.

No question a staff shakeup is needed, but with CDS only having one year left on his deal I wonder who he could hire that could make a big impact. When you hire a head coach who is a pitching guy, the head assistant who is in charge of the position players is going to have a huge impact on the program. Its unfortunate things have turned out the way they have because CDS is a standup guy who, with the right staff, could have this program in much better shape.[/QUOTE}

Will CDS let Bergy go based on their past relationship on the field and current friendship.
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Probably would be very difficult. It might be just as difficult for CDS to hire someone that he would have complete confidence in to take on so much responsibility within the program. This is especially true seeing that year 5, if there is one, will be make or break for CDS. The SEC record in his tenure is now 33-73. At the salaries these guys are getting now, I'm not sure how much longer poor performance can be tolerated.
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#49
#49
I have seen this story before with the current defensive coordinator at Auburn.

The old "it's not him. It's his assistants." ploy.

yeah, no.
 
#50
#50
It will be time to look deep within during the off season. CDS is a proven winner. But something is amiss in player development and possibly recruiting. The old small ball versus long ball thing is a system question. Both styles work with the right players and development. CDS has zero trouble getting in the door with recruits' families and is highly respected on all levels. The hard part is looking at his contract's last year in 2016. No renewal - recruiting is in question. Whether Hart will remain supportive or not we will soon learn.
 
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