BasketVol Report

#27
#27
bleedingTNorange said:
I'll wait to see Barton play before making that claim. My honest opinion is we are in the tournament last year with Barton instead of Golden, but jmo.
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You have three years of evidence from both players. It's not like Barton is a freshman or JUCO. Golden has been a better player with less talent around him.

And I think Tennessee would have been worst with Barton.
 
#28
#28
zjcvols said:
You have three years of evidence from both players. It's not like Barton is a freshman or JUCO. Golden has been a better player with less talent around him.

And I think Tennessee would have been worst with Barton.
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What do Golden's numbers look like if Joe Jackson is here the last 3 years?
 
#29
#29
zjcvols said:
I'll take results over the idea that Golden wasn't a true PG. It's not like Antonio Barton was exactly leading his team 30 minutes a night looking like Mateen Cleaves.
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Barton has been more coachable and taken a bigger leadership role in a few months than Trae ever thought about.
He was run off the team because wasn't wanted to lead CM's best team he has ever coached. Believe he cheated and got into GT if you want.
 
#30
#30
Spartacavolus said:
Nice arrogant comment. You know better, regardless of what cm thinks.
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So because I disagree with coach, I'm arrogant? I'll remember that next time you mention our lack of zone.

I have three years of evidence with stats and film that suggest Trae Golden is better than Barton. If you think Antonio Barton will double his career assist percentage, be my guest.
 
#31
#31
Spartacavolus said:
Barton has been more coachable and taken a bigger leadership role in a few months than Trae ever thought about.
He was run off the team because wasn't wanted to lead CM's best team he has ever coached. Believe he cheated and got into GT if you want.
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If that's true, which I highly doubt it is, then Martin is a hell of a lot more unethical than I thought.
 
#32
#32
Spartacavolus said:
Barton has been more coachable and taken a bigger leadership role in a few months than Trae ever thought about.
He was run off the team because wasn't wanted to lead CM's best team he has ever coached. Believe he cheated and got into GT if you want.
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All speculation on Barton. Funny how Trae's leadership wasn't in question against TAMU, Kentucky, or Florida.
 
#33
#33
zjcvols said:
You have three years of evidence from both players. It's not like Barton is a freshman or JUCO. Golden has been a better player with less talent around him.

And I think Tennessee would have been worst with Barton.
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Worse than flailing down the stretch, getting benched twice, and leading his team to first round losses in sec and nit tourneys with a poy candidate on the wing and all sec potential down low?
Not sure we are watching the same things in a game from that standoint.
 
#34
#34
Barton has made such an impression, that three weeks ago Rob Lewis said Thompson was making a case to start over Barton.

Come on. Trae has his flaws, and Barton will be a nice player here and do well, but this idea we got that much better at starting PG is silly.
 
#35
#35
zjcvols said:
So because I disagree with coach, I'm arrogant? I'll remember that next time you mention our lack of zone.

I have three years of evidence with stats and film that suggest Trae Golden is better than Barton. If you think Antonio Barton will double his career assist percentage, be my guest.
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No, because you said Trae was better than Barton, regardless of what cm thinks, and the kid hasn't played one game in Orange. You think he may have a better perspective after dealing with both when you haven't seen one live practice?
 
#36
#36
Spartacavolus said:
Worse than flailing down the stretch, getting benched twice, and leading his team to first round losses in sec and nit tourneys with a poy candidate on the wing and all sec potential down low?
Not sure we are watching the same things in a game from that standoint.
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Yes. I'm sure Trae Golden was enjoying playing with Skylar McBee and Kenny Hall 20 minutes a night.

And the team went on its run when Golden came back from injury after the Georgia loss at home. That wasn't a coincidence.
 
#38
#38
Spartacavolus said:
No, because you said Trae was better than Barton, regardless of what cm thinks, and the kid hasn't played one game in Orange. You think he may have a better perspective after dealing with both when you haven't seen one live practice?
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I go off three years of evidence. Last year at practices, I heard Martin say Maymon was fine, Stokes was dunking on people, and Trae was in the best shape of his life and had improved immensely.

It's just coach speak. You think Martin is gonna say "Well, Barton is a nice player, but he's no damn Trae Golden." Come on.
 
#39
#39
zjcvols said:
All speculation on Barton. Funny how Trae's leadership wasn't in question against TAMU, Kentucky, or Florida.
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Man, traes leadership on and off the floor has been in question since he stepped on
campus and problems peaked last year when he should be peaking. You mention 3 games out of maybe 30+? where he lead his team. Don't you understand that was a big part of the problem?
 
#40
#40
Spartacavolus said:
Like I said. You believe the plagiarism report as he enrolls in an engineering school if you want.
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Funny how the plagiarism report was untrue and everyone around the program said it was out of Martin's hand.

You believe Martin ran off Golden with Darius Thompson and Brandon Lopez as his only PG options at the time.
 
#41
#41
Spartacavolus said:
Man, traes leadership on and off the floor has been in question since he stepped on
campus and problems peaked last year when he should be peaking. You mention 3 games out of maybe 30+? where he lead his team. Don't you understand that was a big part of the problem?
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The problem was Jeronne Maymon getting hurt and overall lack of team defense.

Trae had his issues. His inconsistency was troublesome. But he was still a solid player. This idea he was some sort of cancer as you portray him is ridiculous.
 
#42
#42
zjcvols said:
This idea he was some sort of cancer as you portray him is ridiculous.
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Laziness is contagious. I can't count how many times I've heard something along the lines of: this teams more focused, this team works harder, this team is dedicated, come from the players mouths.

I like/d golden, I was one of his biggest supporters. I think golden is the better basketball player, but I think Barton fits what Martin wants to do and needs much better.
 
#43
#43
bleedingTNorange said:
This idea he was some sort of cancer as you portray him is ridiculous.
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Laziness is contagious. I can't count how many times I've heard something along the lines of: this teams more focused, this team works harder, this team is dedicated, come from the players mouths.[/QUOTE]

I think that has to do with two straight NITs, being a year older, and having their captain back. Still a young team last year.

Barton might be the better leader. Yet I haven't seen how he performs down by 10 on the road as the senior PG either. I have three years of evidence on both players. The simple truth is that in their careers, Trae Golden>Antonio Barton. Maybe that changes. I have my doubts.

Either way, it shouldn't matter with this team.
 
#44
#44
bleedingTNorange said:
This idea he was some sort of cancer as you portray him is ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Laziness is contagious. I can't count how many times I've heard something along the lines of: this teams more focused, this team works harder, this team is dedicated, come from the players mouths.

I like/d golden, I was one of his biggest supporters. I think golden is the better basketball player, but I think Barton fits what Martin wants to do and needs much better.[/QUOTE]

Maybe. I do think we will benefit from Barton's D, but we will miss Golden's pick and roll ability/drive and dish ability.
 
#45
#45
zjcvols said:
Funny how the plagiarism report was untrue and everyone around the program said it was out of Martin's hand.

You believe Martin ran off Golden with Darius Thompson and Brandon Lopez as his only PG options at the time.
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I firmly believe cm suggested Trae transfer after more off the court personality and leadership issues arose as CM knew he had a better team last year than it performed and did not want to lay awake at night worried about his career depending on a head case that can go zombie at any moment. Even missing a shot or two early sends your leader into zombieland. You can't coach like that. Been there. Done it. And since CM played ball, he knows as a teammate how teammates can be affected, or infected as we called it.
 
#46
#46
zjcvols said:
Laziness is contagious. I can't count how many times I've heard something along the lines of: this teams more focused, this team works harder, this team is dedicated, come from the players mouths.

I like/d golden, I was one of his biggest supporters. I think golden is the better basketball player, but I think Barton fits what Martin wants to do and needs much better.
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Maybe. I do think we will benefit from Barton's D, but we will miss Golden's pick and roll ability/drive and dish ability.[/QUOTE]


I think you are off today z. Golden seldom drove anywhere except hard to his right for a pull up or another dribble for a shoulder bump finish. He wasn't ever a draw and dish guy. I wish he would've run more pick and roll but when the D knows you are going to your right everytime its pretty easy to defend.
 
#47
#47
Spartacavolus said:
I firmly believe cm suggested Trae transfer after more off the court personality and leadership issues arose as CM knew he had a better team last year than it performed and did not want to lay awake at night worried about his career depending on a head case that can go zombie at any moment. Even missing a shot or two early sends your leader into zombieland. You can't coach like that. Been there. Done it. And since CM played ball, he knows as a teammate how teammates can be affected, or infected as we called it.
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I believe your wrong and that CM would be a complete dumbass for doing that with no guaranteed backup plan. He's not a dumbass.

Then I would wonder what CCM was thinking that he could find a better option. Because, based on three years of evidence, he didn't. Instead he got the fourth guard off Memphis' bench that isn't a true PG.

Crisis averted. Still a good team.
 
#48
#48
Spartacavolus said:
Maybe. I do think we will benefit from Barton's D, but we will miss Golden's pick and roll ability/drive and dish ability.
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I think you are off today z. Golden seldom drove anywhere except hard to his right for a pull up or another dribble for a shoulder bump finish. He wasn't ever a draw and dish guy. I wish he would've run more pick and roll but when the D knows you are going to your right everytime its pretty easy to defend.[/QUOTE]

And it was effective still. Our best offense was Golden or McRae pick and roll with Stokes. Golden struggles left, but he's not as incompetent as you say. I've seen about 15 Barton games. He's not better at the PNR than Golden. Not only do my eyes tell me that, but his low assist percentage and low 2 point percentage bears that out.

And for a guy that had some not very good options around him, he was 1st, 2nd and 4th in assist percentage at Tennessee his three years here. If Golden wasn't a good passer averaging four a game, what does that make Barton? He was very good at finding the open big men when they rolled properly.
 
#50
#50
you will see. I think Barton and Thompson can both throw it out to McRae as he hits @ 75% from 3 in an 8 game ridiculous streak CM is more confident in Thompson than he was Trae as well and it has been no secret.
I wonder how the timing of the quick switch in commitment was with the goings on with Trae.
 
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