Bitcoins soar to over $1000 for the first time.

#30
#30
Sandvol said:
Tulip Mania.
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From Wikipedia.org:

The modern discussion of tulip mania began with the book Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds, published in 1841 by the Scottish journalist Charles Mackay; he proposed that crowds of people often behave irrationally, and tulip mania was, along with the South Sea Bubble and the Mississippi Company scheme, one of his primary examples. His account was largely sourced to a 1797 work by Johann Beckmann titled A History of Inventions, Discoveries, and Origins. In fact, Beckmann's account, and thus Mackay's by association, was primarily sourced to three anonymous pamphlets published in 1637 with an anti-speculative agenda.[32] Mackay's vivid book was popular among generations of economists and stock market participants. His popular but flawed description of tulip mania as a speculative bubble remains prominent, even though since the 1980s economists have debunked many aspects of his account.[32]

Now imagine if you attempted to win any argument on current affairs, technology, economics or science by repeating ad nauseum the findings of three anonymous articles published nearly 350 years ago.

You'd be laughed at and thrown out on your ear.

Yet every single day a barrage of seemingly intelligent people are not just doing it but doing it with the self satisfied smugness of a bored circus chimp who found his a-hole with his pointer finger.
 
#31
#31
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.

“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
 
#32
#32
Sandvol said:
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.

“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
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That's sort of my confusion with it. I am glad that much greater minds share my confusion.
 
#34
#34
Sandvol said:
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.

“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
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The same person that said housing was not a bubble? No thanks.
 
#35
#35
mrorange211 said:
The same person that said housing was not a bubble? No thanks.
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Well, you dissed the "ancient" economist and so I thought I'd give you a modern one and you dissed him too as well as dissing me. So, who would you believe?
 
#36
#36
I believe in the market of supply and demand. Money is valuable according to the value we, the consumer, place on it.

I believe in the basis that is bitcoin: a crypto-currency without a centralised banking structure, with a set number of coins to curb inflation. This is the future of money, especially in the internet age. The intrinsic value of bitcoin is that stated above. The ease of use, and freedom to remain anonymous appeals to many demographics of people. In addition, lets consider China for a moment. Bitcoin offers the citizens of that country, for the first time, to become involved with and regularly spend a currency that is not 100% controlled by the Chinese government. That's why there has been such an increase in the volume of bitcoin; the Chinese see its inherent value and they are buying it very quickly.

That being said, I sold mine yesterday.

I believe we will see a very large dip in the next couple of weeks because people will sell off their bitcoins for Christmas money. Five years from now, however, they won't have to do this because major retailers, including Amazon and eBay will accept bitcoin, and it will become a mode of financial transaction. We can see this in the report released yesterday by Bank of America:

Bank of America deems Bitcoin the next big thing | Internet & Media - CNET News

And I only attacked you about the tulip comment, because it has so often been used to categorize economic bubbles, when in fact, the entire tulip episode in 16th century Amsterdam has largely been overblown.
 
#37
#37
mrorange211 said:
I believe in the market of supply and demand. Money is valuable according to the value we, the consumer, place on it.

I believe in the basis that is bitcoin: a crypto-currency without a centralised banking structure, with a set number of coins to curb inflation. This is the future of money, especially in the internet age. The intrinsic value of bitcoin is that stated above. The ease of use, and freedom to remain anonymous appeals to many demographics of people. In addition, lets consider China for a moment. Bitcoin offers the citizens of that country, for the first time, to become involved with and regularly spend a currency that is not 100% controlled by the Chinese government. That's why there has been such an increase in the volume of bitcoin; the Chinese see its inherent value and they are buying it very quickly.

That being said, I sold mine yesterday.

I believe we will see a very large dip in the next couple of weeks because people will sell off their bitcoins for Christmas money. Five years from now, however, they won't have to do this because major retailers, including Amazon and eBay will accept bitcoin, and it will become a mode of financial transaction. We can see this in the report released yesterday by Bank of America:

Bank of America deems Bitcoin the next big thing | Internet & Media - CNET News

And I only attacked you about the tulip comment, because it has so often been used to categorize economic bubbles, when in fact, the entire tulip episode in 16th century Amsterdam has largely been overblown.
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Well, according to the person who wrote the article in Wikipedia it has been overblown. There has been a lot of revisionist history going on lately. Have you ever read Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds? And, so you're stating that the price of bitcoin is determined by supply and demand. Are you an economist?
 
#38
#38
Sandvol said:
Well, according to the person who wrote the article in Wikipedia it has been overblown. There has been a lot of revisionist history going on lately. Have you ever read Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds? And, so you're stating that the price of bitcoin is determined by supply and demand. Are you an economist?
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The book is filled with many historical inaccuracies. His discussion on the Crusades, for example, is poorly researched and fails in providing a good logical basis for his ideas. I didn't like it.

Also, I'm not a revisionist; I'm a trained historian. I would not state that tulip mania of Amsterdam was overblown, if I did not have adequate knowledge on the subject. That's not how I roll.

Now, about economics. No, I am not a trained economist. I am also not a trained recruiting analyst or football coach, but I still makes comments in those forums about those subjects. I formed my opinion about bitcoin after extensive reading on the subject. In addition, being a trained historian, I also like to think that I do have some type of historical understanding of the various dips/highs in economic history and their causes.

Please understand, I am not attacking you directly and I do not mean for it to come across in that manner.
 
#39
#39
mrorange211 said:
The book is filled with many historical inaccuracies. His discussion on the Crusades, for example, is poorly researched and fails in providing a good logical basis for his ideas. I didn't like it.

Also, I'm not a revisionist; I'm a trained historian. I would not state that tulip mania of Amsterdam was overblown, if I did not have adequate knowledge on the subject. That's not how I roll.

Now, about economics. No, I am not a trained economist. I am also not a trained recruiting analyst or football coach, but I still makes comments in those forums about those subjects. I formed my opinion about bitcoin after extensive reading on the subject. In addition, being a trained historian, I also like to think that I do have some type of historical understanding of the various dips/highs in economic history and their causes.

Please understand, I am not attacking you directly and I do not mean for it to come across in that manner.
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I don't think he was writing a history book was he?...But, a book on the psychology of crowds and herd behavior.
P.S.-I understand the attractiveness of bitcoin. Does anything have an intrinsic value unless the market gives it one? But, I do believe manias have existed and still do.
 
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#40
#40
Sandvol said:
Former Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said Bitcoin prices are unsustainably high after surging 89-fold in a year and that the virtual money isn’t currency.

“It’s a bubble,” Greenspan, 87, said today in a Bloomberg Television interview from Washington. “It has to have intrinsic value. You have to really stretch your imagination to infer what the intrinsic value of Bitcoin is. I haven’t been able to do it. Maybe somebody else can.”
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Gold/paper money doesn't have special intrinsic value. Regardless of what is used as "currency", all that matters is that people buy into it to give it its value.
 
#42
#42
mrorange211 said:
I believe in the basis that is bitcoin: a crypto-currency without a centralised banking structure, with a set number of coins to curb inflation. This is the future of money, especially in the internet age.
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Money needs to have a stable value.
 
#43
#43
PKT_VOL said:
Gold/paper money doesn't have special intrinsic value. Regardless of what is used as "currency", all that matters is that people buy into it to give it its value.
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Doesn't gold have value in what it can be used for, like as a metal?
 
#46
#46
Nerd-Vol said:
Doesn't gold have value in what it can be used for, like as a metal?
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Gold's metal value is due to its use for jewelry. However, its value is not stable either. But, its price hasn't gone up 89 fold in a year.
 
#49
#49
I wish I was smart enough to fully grasp the concept. I watched a video from bitcoin but I still don't understand. Then again I don't completely understand a lot of stuff.
 
#50
#50
Nerd-Vol said:
I wish I was smart enough to fully grasp the concept. I watched a video from bitcoin but I still don't understand. Then again I don't completely understand a lot of stuff.
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Ironic that you are NERDVOL but you don't understand bitcoin.
 
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