CBJ among the most elite coaches in college football.

#51
#51
CroKev said:
Unlike "MoneyBall," this system does not tell you how to win but, rather, tells you who has been effective and efficient - which usually translates to wins. The best application for it would be for hiring a HC. We better get CBJ on a long term contract because it's not the rest of college football that we have to worry about luring him away, but, instead, I can see the NFL calling in 2 or 3 years...
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Hart must have used this metric in his selection process ...... But then how did Gundy and Strong sneak in ahead of CBJ?
 
#52
#52
daj2576 said:
The thing that stuck out to me is the quote about the resistance from people who reject numerical predictors in football. That is very true.

.
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People poo poo what they have trouble understanding, and what goes against traditional beliefs.

"Moneyball" in baseball is one example.

Another is when computer derived count systems were developed for blackjack. Casino owners welcomed counters with open arms. After millions started going out the door, welcomes turned into bans.
 
#54
#54
darkgable said:
Because numbers don't tell the whole story. I don't mind stats but some people act as if they are conclusive. Predictors yes, conclusive in a future outcome? No. Numbers will never account for heart, the will to win. There's no % for resiliency. The numbers said statistically I would be dead by 25 due to gun violence and the life I was living. But the numbers couldn't account for ones will to straighten up and seek an education. Just sayin. I'm done.
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You're right. Intangibles often make the difference in all walks of life. There are exceptions everywhere to be sure, but past performance more often than not is a good predictor of future success. If you standardize the numbers correctly to allow for an accurate comparison you learn from what proves to be valuable information. Also, the system looks to be valid based on who's at the top... shouldn't surprise anybody.

Plus, the way CBJ seems to have attitudes soaring in Knoxville among the team, I think we have both bases covered
 
#57
#57
darkgable said:
Because numbers don't tell the whole story. I don't mind stats but some people act as if they are conclusive. Predictors yes, conclusive in a future outcome? No. Numbers will never account for heart, the will to win. There's no % for resiliency. The numbers said statistically I would be dead by 25 due to gun violence and the life I was living. But the numbers couldn't account for ones will to straighten up and seek an education. Just sayin. I'm done.
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gangsta gangsta
 
#59
#59
Oskie Volum said:
I read through this thread just shaking my head with so much Dooley hate just to make themselves feel better about themselves. Obviously u r a smart one that thinks outside the box. I would add CBJ to the none rebuilder list. May not have been handed gems like Fulmer, but still nothing like some of the others.

Welcome to the hated group of the logical.
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Are you seriously painting yourself and anyone else who STILL supports Dooley as the "logical" ones? Give us all a break. The guy was a joke who basically swindled $10M+ from UT to get his jackhammer and drill this program even further into the ground that it already was when it hit rock-bottom after Kiffin left.

However, here's the thing about these kind of lists/metrics. If this list had been released a year ago and Dooley had been at or near the bottom (which he almost certainly would have been) then the overwhelming majority of people would have shouted this down as nonsense or just somebody hating. Now it comes out with our new hire near the top of the list and the same sheep are falling all over themselves saying this is some great predictor of our impending rise to the top. The real truth is we have no idea what we have in Jones, and realistically we probably won't even know for a year or more.
 
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#60
#60
bleedorange0037 said:
Are you seriously painting yourself and anyone else who STILL supports Dooley as the "logical" ones? Give us all a break. The guy was a joke who basically swindled $10M+ from UT to get his jackhammer and drill this program even further into the ground that it already was when it hit rock-bottom after Kiffin left.

However, here's the thing about these kind of lists/metrics. If this list had been released a year ago and Dooley had been at or near the bottom (which he almost certainly would have been) then the overwhelming majority of people would have shouted this down as nonsense or just somebody hating. Now it comes out with our new hire near the top of the list and the same sheep are falling all over themselves saying this is some great predictor of our impending rise to the top. The real truth is we have no idea what we have in Jones, and realistically we probably won't even know for a year or more.
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So we know that we don't know...at some point in triplicate?...I know it doesn't make sense...just trying to keep pace
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#63
#63
bleedorange0037 said:
Are you seriously painting yourself and anyone else who STILL supports Dooley as the "logical" ones? Give us all a break. The guy was a joke who basically swindled $10M+ from UT to get his jackhammer and drill this program even further into the ground that it already was when it hit rock-bottom after Kiffin left.

However, here's the thing about these kind of lists/metrics. If this list had been released a year ago and Dooley had been at or near the bottom (which he almost certainly would have been) then the overwhelming majority of people would have shouted this down as nonsense or just somebody hating. Now it comes out with our new hire near the top of the list and the same sheep are falling all over themselves saying this is some great predictor of our impending rise to the top. The real truth is we have no idea what we have in Jones, and realistically we probably won't even know for a year or more.
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Agree for the most part with your first paragraph, not so much on the second. I think we do have a pretty good idea of what we have with Butch, this list/metric notwithstanding. I think 6 seasons as HC is a pretty good sample size... He's won 50 of 77 games, nearly 2 out of every 3 games. The question really most seemed to have was could he recruit the necessary athletes to be successful in the SEC... an early #1 ranked class by Rivals suggest he can.

By the way, regarding the post you originally responded to.... what the hell is a "none rebuilder"? Any idea? Respectfully submitted
 
#67
#67
AllVolForLife_16 said:
Not even a fair comparison. SEC talent beats Big East talent all day long. He never had a chance with Cincy's defense going up against Bray, Hunter, and Rogers.
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Fair and accurate point. Plus, at the end of the season Butch had won 10 games and a conference championship. Dooley? Not so much.
 
#68
#68
KBVol said:
Agree for the most part with your first paragraph, not so much on the second. I think we do have a pretty good idea of what we have with Butch, this list/metric notwithstanding. I think 6 seasons as HC is a pretty good sample size... He's won 50 of 77 games, nearly 2 out of every 3 games. The question really most seemed to have was could he recruit the necessary athletes to be successful in the SEC... an early #1 ranked class by Rivals suggest he can.

By the way, regarding the post you originally responded to.... what the hell is a "none rebuilder"? Any idea? Respectfully submitted
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What we don't know about Jones is he is able to beat teams who are more talented than him with any regularity. There's not much of a book on him in that regard, and its what he's going to have to do to be successful in Knoxville, at least for the first couple years.
 
#69
#69
bleedorange0037 said:
What we don't know about Jones is he is able to beat teams who are more talented than him with any regularity. There's not much of a book on him in that regard, and its what he's going to have to do to be successful in Knoxville, at least for the first couple years.
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You're right, good point. However, I did read an article shortly after Butch was hired that showed he, on average, has won 2 games per season that "on paper" he was not expected to. Don't recall from where.... maybe another poster on here knows of the article an can provide the link. Anywho, we'll have a better idea about our head coach soon enough.
 
#70
#70
KBVol said:
Fair and accurate point. Plus, at the end of the season Butch had won 10 games and a conference championship. Dooley? Not so much.
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But but but, it was a shared conference championship, so obviously it doesn't count.
 
#73
#73
bleedorange0037 said:
If this list had been released a year ago and Dooley had been at or near the bottom (which he almost certainly would have been) then the overwhelming majority of people would have shouted this down as nonsense or just somebody hating. Now it comes out with our new hire near the top of the list and the same sheep are falling all over themselves saying this is some great predictor of our impending rise to the top. The real truth is we have no idea what we have in Jones, and realistically we probably won't even know for a year or more.
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Correct. Plus they would have ridiculed it for having Jones near the top.
 
#74
#74
CBJ need to win in the SEC before he can be considered an elite coach......he has a bunch of winning to do to be an elite coach, don't you think?
 
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