Considering the state of both programs

#28
#28
butch obviously he's still in the honey moon phase but that 0-2 vs muschamp stat would terrify me if im a vol fan
 
#34
#34
CBJ. He hasn't had enough time to warrant a coach change. But like Lawrence Wright said, Muschamp will get paid a lot to not show up to work.
 
#35
#35
If Butch Jones were inexplicably fired, another school would hire him in a heartbeat. Consider that flagship university in the state next door. You know ... the one that keeps getting beat by Butch Jones for top recruits (such as Shy Tuttle) and that can't seem to hold its opponents under 40 points. The one whose chief rival plucked up another "rejected SEC coach" and has had major success.

I don't think Butch will have difficulty finding another job. Even if he goes 7-5 next year and gets fired, there's going to be some smart AD that sees everything Butch has accomplished and figures he could do even more at a university that doesn't demand a conference title within 3 years.

Muschamp, on the other hand, is going to have difficulty ever getting another head coaching gig. He'll make a pretty good living as a DC at another school or in the NFL, but he has been a spectacular flop at Florida. Whereas, Butch's only crime to date has been taking over a complete trainwreck and not turning it around rapidly enough for impatient fans.
 
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#36
#36
DiderotsGhost said:
If Butch Jones were inexplicably fired, another school would hire him in a heartbeat. Consider that flagship university in the state next door. You know ... the one that keeps getting beat by Butch Jones for top recruits (such as Shy Tuttle) and that can't seem to hold its opponents under 40 points. The one whose chief rival plucked up another "rejected SEC coach" and has had major success.

I don't think Butch will have difficulty finding another job. Even if he goes 7-5 next year and gets fired, there's going to be some smart AD that sees everything Butch has accomplished and figures he could do even more at a university that doesn't demand a conference title within 3 years.

Muschamp, on the other hand, is going to have difficulty ever getting another head coaching gig. He'll make a pretty good living as a DC at another school or in the NFL, but he has been a spectacular flop at Florida. Whereas, Butch's only crime to date has been taking over a complete trainwreck and not turning it around rapidly enough for impatient fans.
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Muschamp will be a HC next season. A CUSA or Big Eadt school will hire him. If SMU doesn't get Morris or Mack Brown its a very good chance he'll be on their short list.
 
#37
#37
DiderotsGhost said:
If Butch Jones were inexplicably fired, another school would hire him in a heartbeat. Consider that flagship university in the state next door. You know ... the one that keeps getting beat by Butch Jones for top recruits (such as Shy Tuttle) and that can't seem to hold its opponents under 40 points. The one whose chief rival plucked up another "rejected SEC coach" and has had major success.

I don't think Butch will have difficulty finding another job. Even if he goes 7-5 next year and gets fired, there's going to be some smart AD that sees everything Butch has accomplished and figures he could do even more at a university that doesn't demand a conference title within 3 years.

Muschamp, on the other hand, is going to have difficulty ever getting another head coaching gig. He'll make a pretty good living as a DC at another school or in the NFL, but he has been a spectacular flop at Florida. Whereas, Butch's only crime to date has been taking over a complete trainwreck and not turning it around rapidly enough for impatient fans.
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Agreed. From a non-impatient fan standpoint, Butch is doing everything 100% the right way.

Media members will tell you that as well, even the ones who would probably rather see Tennessee fail.

Yes, the Florida loss was questionable. But as an AD, you could do a hell of a lot worse than hiring someone like Jones.

He recruits at an elite level, has won almost every game he's supposed to (and pulled off one huge upset), runs a clean program, is loved by his players, is a PR home run, and has been successful at every stop in his career.

This may be wishful thinking, but I really think that in 5 years time, the entire perception of Jones and Tennessee will be different, because we'll be winning and the program/roster will be 100 percent stable for the first time in over a decade.

And then all this drama over whether he's the right guy for the job will look just as silly as MSU fans wanting Mullen canned at any point before this season.
 
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#38
#38
HialeahGator said:
Muschamp will be a HC next season. A CUSA or Big Eadt school will hire him. If SMU doesn't get Morris or Mack Brown its a very good chance he'll be on their short list.
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It's possible, but if you look at the reasons he's failed at Florida, it doesn't seem likely that things would change at a lower-level school. If I'm the AD at North Texas, for instance, what leads me to believe that a guy that couldn't build the program up at Florida is going to somehow do it at a school with much less resources?

Butch Jones has proven he can build programs. He has not yet proven he can coach at the elite SEC level, but there's no doubt he can build a program. I just don't think you can say the same about Muschamp. At best, he's a short-term plug that helps get your defense into shape. Is there some program with a horrible defense that desperately needs him for 1-2 years? Maybe, but that's the only real argument I can see for hiring him as HC.
 
#39
#39
DiderotsGhost said:
It's possible, but if you look at the reasons he's failed at Florida, it doesn't seem likely that things would change at a lower-level school. If I'm the AD at North Texas, for instance, what leads me to believe that a guy that couldn't build the program up at Florida is going to somehow do it at a school with much less resources?

Butch Jones has proven he can build programs. He has not yet proven he can coach at the elite SEC level, but there's no doubt he can build a program. I just don't think you can say the same about Muschamp. At best, he's a short-term plug that helps get your defense into shape. Is there some program with a horrible defense that desperately needs him for 1-2 years? Maybe, but that's the only real argument I can see for hiring him as HC.
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All he's really proven at this point is that he can follow Brian Kelly and maintain what he started.
 
#40
#40
bowlinggreenvol said:
All he's really proven at this point is that he can follow Brian Kelly and maintain what he started.
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Disagree.

Either you give him credit for being able to coach or you give him credit for being able to recruit....or you admit he' a good all-around coach.

He proved he could coach at Cincinnati. And he's proving he can recruit at Tennessee (and at Cincy as well, considering his classes were better than Kelly's).

And FWIW, Butch has a better win (South Carolina last year) than any win on Kelly's resume.
 
#41
#41
Lawrence Wright said:
Beat me to it.

UF fans know Muschamp isn't the answer, he'll get fired in November, get bought out and land on his feet as a DC at a major program.

At this point UT fans don't know if Jones is the answer. UT has more offensive talent than UF, yet can't score against teams with a pulse. Senior QB graduating leaves question marks at the position for 2015.

Neither coach is in a happy place right now.
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As an Atlanta Falcons and Vols fan, it has been so long since my football "happy place" has been touched that I've forgotten what it feels like.
 
#42
#42
Falcons02 said:
As an Atlanta Falcons and Vols fan, it has been so long since my football "happy place" has been touched that I've forgotten what it feels like.
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I'm right there with you.

Though, really hasn't been that long for the Falcons. They were good a few years ago --- even if it seems like an eternity ago. Sucks that Mike Smith might get fired. I've always sort of liked him since he was an ETSU guy.
 
#43
#43
Aesius said:
Disagree.

Either you give him credit for being able to coach or you give him credit for being able to recruit....or you admit he' a good all-around coach.

He proved he could coach at Cincinnati. And he's proving he can recruit at Tennessee (and at Cincy as well, considering his classes were better than Kelly's).

And FWIW, Butch has a better win (South Carolina last year) than any win on Kelly's resume.
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You agree he's proven he can build programs? That's what the argument was, not if he was a good coach. Butch took over two programs that had experienced immediate success and maintained that. And one could argue Cincy declined, considering Kelly never won less than 10 games and was coming off back to back BCS bowls.

We will be his first turnaround project and if he pulls us out then he would've proven he's capable of building or re-building a program. At this point he's not had to do that.

FTR Kelly beat Rose Bowl champ Stanford who finished #6 and went into Norman and stomped #8 OU in 2012. Those are both great wins and euqivalent in quality to Carolina. The USC win Is likely "bigger" only because it was an upset. It's harder to have big upsets when your team is ranked on a pretty consistent basis.
 
#44
#44
DiderotsGhost said:
I'm right there with you.

Though, really hasn't been that long for the Falcons. They were good a few years ago --- even if it seems like an eternity ago. Sucks that Mike Smith might get fired. I've always sort of liked him since he was an ETSU guy.
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I was actually a student ar ETSU when Mike Cavan was HC there...seems like Smitty was a QC coach or something and left when Cavan did.

I root for the man and think he has overall done a good job in ATL but the last 20 games or so (especially road games) have been btutal. And it doesn't help that his speciality is Def and the D BLOWS. Kind like CBJ... he's an offensive guy.... it makes the O actually feel worse knowing that.
 
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