Could a body (maybe Congress) prohibit tying NIL funds to a specific school?

#76
#76
The other sports didn't ask for an ATE to stop their athletes from getting NIL.

If you read carefully, I said specifically that overturning the ICA and the SATA would do that, not an exemption.

Are you ready for a draft instead of recruiting?
Forced trades instead of transfers? Unionization? Strikes? Those things go with an ATE in the pro sports that have them.
Again, you've got it ass backwards. Your last paragraph is what is coming without an anti-trust exemption. Congress can draft an anti-trust exemption essentially any way they want to. It's their law. Hell, there are proposed anti-trust exemptions in committee right now that don't include any of that.
 
#77
#77
Whatever happens. We need to get Congress involved. It's the best path to an efficient and fair solution for all.
I would agree with this 99 times out of 100, but this is the 1. And it's because Anti-Trust is their law, they are the only ones who can amend it legally in a way which would allow for revenue sharing with athletes, but at the same time preserve college sports in anything remotely resembling what it has always been (associated with the schools, multiple sports, sports for women, including most of the sports not making any money, etc.).
 
#78
#78
Again, you've got it ass backwards. Your last paragraph is what is coming without an anti-trust exemption. Congress can draft an anti-trust exemption essentially any way they want to. It's their law. Hell, there are proposed anti-trust exemptions in committee right now that don't include any of that.
Not even. You have a flawed view of what Congress can do without unintended consequences.
 
#79
#79
I have discussed this with you before, and you are incapable of hearing or understanding, but for the benefit of others so that they will not be confused by you.

Participation in NCAA football is voluntary. In all walks of life, you can voluntarily join an organization, employment or what have you, and become subject to their rules. The NCAA previously had rules against NIL. The reason those rules are no longer enforceable is because it has been ruled that the NCAA as formerly organized was a monopoly, in violation of the Antitrust laws. The 9-0 decision by the Supreme Court was simply affirming that the NCAA as organized violated Antitrust. Antitrust is a law passed by Congress. Congress is free to change its own laws. If Congress granted the NCAA (or some replacement government body an antitrust exemption, for example, let's say the exemption was granted based on 50% revenue sharing with student athletes). If 50% of the revenue was paid to student athletes, then at that point the NCAA would be in the safe harbor and would no longer be violating Antitrust. In essence, Congress would have said "we don't care that you are a monopoly, provided that you follow these rules, i.e. revenue sharing, etc.". If the NCAA complies, it can then turn around make rules based on voluntary participation, i.e. if you want to play college athletics, you have to agree to these rules, those rules can include regulation of transfers and NIL. A 13th Amendment challenge is baloney. Even the Supreme Court that you are so proud of ruling 9-0, said in that ruling that Congress could change the law and do what it wanted.
So the new law is presented in the House, has to pass, goes to Senate, has to pass, goes to the President's desk to be signed/or not, if not goes back to override veto (what majority vote does this take?), or rewrite the law, try again, then subject to constitutionality with Supreme Court. This ain't happening, not in our current political climate of nothing getting done, because of incessant fighting. It would take years or decades for anything to be done and who knows if they get it right.

Somehow the free market needs to work all of this out and things will probably have a way of correcting what is not good about NIL. Whether players eventually get that transferring from here to there and there to here is USUALLY not a good/positive thing for most. There are no guarantees that just because you transfer, you will play/start. Sure, there will be rare instances where a topnotch talent can just plug and play in any system, but that is not the norm. After being at a program and going through spring practices and summer conditioning and everything that goes on behind the scenes with learning a system and continuity with teammates and coaches, transferring is typically starting from scratch. Unless, you are just completely riding the pine and have no chance of playing time, sure, transfer. You aren't playing/helping current team much anyway, or self for that matter.
 
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#80
#80
Again, you've got it ass backwards. Your last paragraph is what is coming without an anti-trust exemption. Congress can draft an anti-trust exemption essentially any way they want to. It's their law. Hell, there are proposed anti-trust exemptions in committee right now that don't include any of that.
The proposed anti trust exemption legislation is unlikely to make it out of committee. If it does, it's unlikely to pass both houses of Congress. It then has to pass judicial review by the courts. Also unlikely. If it does, say hello to the other aspects of pro sports did used above. It's one of the other. You don't get to have it both ways.

If by some miracle it gets through all of those hoops, it's going to face 13th Amendment challenges. Congress can't do anything about that, more should they if they had that power.

You obviously don't understand how the legislative and judicial branches are che is and balance on each other's power.
 
#81
#81
Again, you've got it ass backwards. Your last paragraph is what is coming without an anti-trust exemption. Congress can draft an anti-trust exemption essentially any way they want to. It's their law. Hell, there are proposed anti-trust exemptions in committee right now that don't include any of that.
You really don't understand this, do you?

If by some slim chance Congress gives the NCAA and ATE, it comes with the other things that the pro sports have in return for theirs.

Employment.
Unionization.
The right to strike.
A 131 team draft.
No recruiting.
Unwilling trades.

You can't have it both ways.
 
#82
#82
How long until an athlete sues the NCAA for only granting a certain number of years of eligibility? Or even the requirement to go be enrolled at the school? The argument would be the NCAA is prohibiting them from earning a living through NIL by ending their elibility and that forcing them to be enrolled at said school is an unnecessary burden to them as they try to earn NIL. I mean if we’re going to just kneel at the altar of the player then this shouldn’t be a problem right?
 
#83
#83
How long until an athlete sues the NCAA for only granting a certain number of years of eligibility? Or even the requirement to go be enrolled at the school? The argument would be the NCAA is prohibiting them from earning a living through NIL by ending their elibility and that forcing them to be enrolled at said school is an unnecessary burden to them as they try to earn NIL. I mean if we’re going to just kneel at the altar of the player then this shouldn’t be a problem right?
Or, as long as they are enrolled for sure. Undergrad, grad and doctorate......................

Once Nico takes off this year, we could have him for a total of 8/9 years potentially.................
 
#84
#84
Can the answers to this mess fall somewhere within the IRS codes? Can they either be 1040, or 1099 "employees"? If they are true 1099 contractors wouldn't they be subject to purely contractual agreements?
 
#85
#85
Can the answers to this mess fall somewhere within the IRS codes? Can they either be 1040, or 1099 "employees"? If they are true 1099 contractors wouldn't they be subject to purely contractual agreements?
Like the NFL athletes are contractors? Quite possibly.
 
#87
#87
How long until an athlete sues the NCAA for only granting a certain number of years of eligibility? Or even the requirement to go be enrolled at the school? The argument would be the NCAA is prohibiting them from earning a living through NIL by ending their elibility and that forcing them to be enrolled at said school is an unnecessary burden to them as they try to earn NIL. I mean if we’re going to just kneel at the altar of the player then this shouldn’t be a problem right?
I think, and I certainly don't know, the lawsuits to get rid of the "attend college" rules will start shortly after we see the schools start "revenue sharing." That makes logical sense because that's a guaranteed, paid by the school, chunk of the money that's generated from their work.

And I think the players will win and be declared employees because nothing says employee like promising a group of workers a guaranteed chunk of the money that's generated by their work.

So, yeah. If you're going to treat them like employees, expect that they're going to behave like employees and try to keep their job and income.

The schools and NCAA are screwed.

They can't get away with not sharing the huge money they make from the work of the athletes
BUT
if they share that money, the players really will become legally employees and all the headaches that come with owning a pro sports franchise.
 
#88
#88
I think, and I certainly don't know, the lawsuits to get rid of the "attend college" rules will start shortly after we see the schools start "revenue sharing." That makes logical sense because that's a guaranteed, paid by the school, chunk of the money that's generated from their work.

And I think the players will win and be declared employees because nothing says employee like promising a group of workers a guaranteed chunk of the money that's generated by their work.

So, yeah. If you're going to treat them like employees, expect that they're going to behave like employees and try to keep their job and income.

The schools and NCAA are screwed.

They can't get away with not sharing the huge money they make from the work of the athletes
BUT
if they share that money, the players really will become legally employees and all the headaches that come with owning a pro sports franchise.
That would be laid out in their "job description", we are "hiring" you to perform certain duties and training and the position you are applying for requires that you attend job training courses (classes), pass the courses (classes) and also perform the duties laid out in the sport (job) you are applying for. You are also subject to termination for not fulfilling your job requirements. Especially in right to work states.

Maybe this is the right angle to give more leverage to schools/athletic departments.............????
 
#89
#89
That would be laid out in their "job description", we are "hiring" you to perform certain duties and training and the position you are applying for requires that you attend job training courses (classes), pass the courses (classes) and also perform the duties laid out in the sport (job) you are applying for. You are also subject to termination for not fulfilling your job requirements. Especially in right to work states.

Maybe this is the right angle to give more leverage to schools/athletic departments.............????
If you like pro sports, that's how it seems to work.

You hire athletes, you negotiate with their player's union and agree to a collective bargaining agreement, set salary caps, free agency rules, etc and have some "release" and "waivers" rules to manage your roster.

The schools, however, would almost automatically lose the "4 (now 5) years of eligibility" and "academic requirements" lawsuits.
 
#90
#90
You really don't understand this, do you?

If by some slim chance Congress gives the NCAA and ATE, it comes with the other things that the pro sports have in return for theirs.

Employment.
Unionization.
The right to strike.
A 131 team draft.
No recruiting.
Unwilling trades.

You can't have it both ways.
You don't understand it. At all. All that's coming if Congress doesn't act, plus women's and non-revenue sports will go away (that's what will drive a political compromise). The University will sell the football and basketball programs to Vols, Inc. and maybe lease Neyland Stadium for games, but college sports is over without an anti-trust exemptionCongress can write one however they want, if they write one, college sports has a chance, if they don't, there's no chance, in 10 years CFB will be no more significant than minor league baseball, just a shiddier version of the NFL.
 
#91
#91
You don't understand it. At all. All that's coming if Congress doesn't act, plus women's and non-revenue sports will go away (that's what will drive a political compromise). The University will sell the football and basketball programs to Vols, Inc. and maybe lease Neyland Stadium for games, but college sports is over without an anti-trust exemptionCongress can write one however they want, if they write one, college sports has a chance, if they don't, there's no chance, in 10 years CFB will be no more significant than minor league baseball, just a shiddier version of the NFL.
I wish I had your faith that concern for women's sports and non revenue sports will spur Congress into action.

I see the political climate as feeling women should probably be at home with the kids and supporting their husband.... and less worried about college and such. "..... great again" I'm not saying that's good or bad but an observation of traditional women's roles in society. My Mom had a degree before she met my Dad. My Dad went to WWII and dropped out of high school. Mom stayed home almost immediately after they married and they soon started a family. Dad worked hard for 40 years. She could've easily out earned him (and did when we got old enough to be alone) but he worked and she stayed home. It was the "..... great again" era and the way things were done. I see us cycling back toward that.

Further, revenue is king. Without the revenue sports, I'm not certain colleges care or can actually afford to care in most cases about other sports.
 
#92
#92
If you like pro sports, that's how it seems to work.

You hire athletes, you negotiate with their player's union and agree to a collective bargaining agreement, set salary caps, free agency rules, etc and have some "release" and "waivers" rules to manage your roster.

The schools, however, would almost automatically lose the "4 (now 5) years of eligibility" and "academic requirements" lawsuits.

Unless they became employees of the school. Then the school determines pay, hours, requirements, etc.
 
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#93
#93
Unless they became employees of the school. Then the school determines pay, hours, requirements, etc.
With the inevitable Players Union negotiating for the players, yes. In pro sports, the owners and players have a "vigorous back and forth" about various rules, requirements, salaries, etc.

There's a reason why most pro sports have salary caps and free agency and all kinds of perks/protections for owners and players.

The days of the college holding all the cards about the rules are over.

The days of the players holding all the cards will be over when it all becomes pro sports.
 
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#94
#94
You don't understand it. At all. All that's coming if Congress doesn't act, plus women's and non-revenue sports will go away (that's what will drive a political compromise). The University will sell the football and basketball programs to Vols, Inc. and maybe lease Neyland Stadium for games, but college sports is over without an anti-trust exemptionCongress can write one however they want, if they write one, college sports has a chance, if they don't, there's no chance, in 10 years CFB will be no more significant than minor league baseball, just a shiddier version of the NFL.
Dude, you really need to go back to school.
Take a Civics 101 class and a basic American Government class? Your speculation is ludicrous.
 
#95
#95
Unless they became employees of the school. Then the school determines pay, hours, requirements, etc.
Yes, schools can create job positions and job descriptions and requirements.

Like.......... The University of Tennessee is now hiring independent contractors to fill our "football entertainment division" positions. The job requirements and descriptions are not limited to the following, but include attending courses (classes), attending entertainment division meetings, requirements to show up and be present at certain times, until certain times and is also performance based and certain performance standards must be met. There are many different "job" openings and positions to fill and each position is particularly different and unique in job skill level and requirements as laid out and determined by said University. These positions require a minimum of one year contractual agreement and can be extended annually by the University of Tennessee, up to a 4 or 5 year maximum total employment contract. The terms are subject to change, in writing, by the University of Tennessee at any time if contractual obligations are not met.

Like any other job, you are subject to termination in accordance with state and federal law where applicable.
 
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#96
#96
Yes, schools can create job positions and job descriptions and requirements.

Like.......... The University of Tennessee is now hiring prospects to fill our "football entertainment division". The job requirements and descriptions are not limited to the following, but include attending courses (classes), attending entertainment division meetings, requirements to show up and be present at certain times, until certain times and is also performance based and certain performance standards must be met. There are many different "job" openings and positions to fill and each position is particularly different and unique in job skill level and requirements as laid out and determined by said University..

Like any other job, you are subject to termination in accordance with state and federal law if applicable.
The reason those workers have little power and can be jerked around by the school and made to do things is because a big pool of people can fill those positions.

A very, very small pool of people can play D1 football well. An even smaller pool can play D1 football well at an SEC level. An even smaller pool can play well enough to get a scholarship at an elite SEC school like UT.

You don't get to set a helluva lot of hoops to jump through when you're searching for an elite athlete.
 
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#99
#99
The reason those workers have little power and can be jerked around by the school and made to do things is because a big pool of people can fill those positions.

A very, very small pool of people can play D1 football well. An even smaller pool can play D1 football well at an SEC level. An even smaller pool can play well enough to get a scholarship at an elite SEC school like UT.

You don't get to set a helluva lot of hoops to jump through when you're searching for an elite athlete.
BINGO! It's pretty silly that some folks ignore supply and demand.
 
Yes, schools can create job positions and job descriptions and requirements.

Like.......... The University of Tennessee is now hiring independent contractors to fill our "football entertainment division" positions. The job requirements and descriptions are not limited to the following, but include attending courses (classes), attending entertainment division meetings, requirements to show up and be present at certain times, until certain times and is also performance based and certain performance standards must be met. There are many different "job" openings and positions to fill and each position is particularly different and unique in job skill level and requirements as laid out and determined by said University. These positions require a minimum of one year contractual agreement and can be extended annually by the University of Tennessee, up to a 4 or 5 year maximum total employment contract. The terms are subject to change, in writing, by the University of Tennessee at any time if contractual obligations are not met.

Like any other job, you are subject to termination in accordance with state and federal law where applicable.
Unenforceable if there are any student requirements. If there are no student requirements, then a four or five year limit in employment is stupid.
 

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