Danny White is impressed by Josh Heupel's rebuild of Vols football, (and so am I)

[JohnWardForever]

Dabo uses faith as a recruiting ploy. Plain and simple.

BOTH need to take a lesson from Rick Barnes. Christians don't throw the F Bomb during games.... Frickin is no different.

 

[volplaya8]

Josh isn't like that at all, he just leads by example.

Name of girl in your avatar…for educational purposes only of course!

 

[walkenvol]

BOTH need to take a lesson from Rick Barnes. Christians don't throw the F Bomb during games.... Frickin is no different.

Then I guess CJH isn’t Christian enough for you either as we all remember the GIF of him questioning the official with “you’ve got to be ****ing kidding me”.

 

[pimo1]

Pruitt's recruits still made up the majority of the 1st and 2nd string in 2022.

View attachment 643238

as true as that may be Huep has had an amazing record of rehabbing players lost in the shuffle and bringing players in from the portal that contributed. Most of the guys he brings in via portal tend to meet or exceed expectations. Honestly recruiting and player-development were not issues with Pruitt. He and the other coaches preceding him had culture issues. Part of that was them but part was also the AD itself. They had the pieces for good teams CJH came and built a program. The same is true for basketball and baseball.. once the AD changed over they all took off. Because of a good AD that allowed good coaches to do what they do. I have no idea what the previous coaches could have done under the current AD and structure in place or if they would have been hired at all but this current combo is cooking with Wesson and at least trending in the right direction in almost all sports.

 

[BeardedVol]

as true as that may be Huep has had an amazing record of rehabbing players lost in the shuffle and bringing players in from the portal that contributed. Most of the guys he brings in via portal tend to meet or exceed expectations. Honestly recruiting and player-development were not issues with Pruitt. He and the other coaches preceding him had culture issues. Part of that was them but part was also the AD itself. They had the pieces for good teams CJH came and built a program. The same is true for basketball and baseball.. once the AD changed over they all took off. Because of a good AD that allowed good coaches to do what they do. I have no idea what the previous coaches could have done under the current AD and structure in place or if they would have been hired at all but this current combo is cooking with Wesson and at least trending in the right direction in almost all sports.

The 2022 record, and starting lineup still refutes the myth that some people have created around Heupel, concerning this supposed complete exodus of talent when Pruitt was fired.

Until surpassed, 2022 still stands as Heupel's best season here, and the reality is that it was accomplished with a majority of players that he didn't recruit. There was still enough talent on the roster for him to work with and achiee a 10-2 regular season record, with wins over Alabama and Florida. That doesn't happen in the SEC without significant talent on a roster.

That being said, even had Pruitt been retained, and the talent that exited when he was fired still been here in 2022, I highly doubt he'd have managed a result anywhere close to what Heupel accomplished that season. He was a bad coach, who couldn't get the most out of what talent he was able to recruit.

 

[Volador]

The UT Vols Cannonball Express has left the station and is on time Ladies & Gentlemen. Grab a seat while you can cuz conductor Heupel ain't gonna wait on you or nobody!

​

 

[pimo1]

The 2022 record, and starting lineup still refutes the myth that some people have created around Heupel, concerning this supposed complete exodos of talent when Pruitt was fired.

Until surpassed, 2022 still stands as Heupel's best season here, and the reality is that it was accomplished with a majority of players that he didn't recruit. There was still enough talent on the roster for him to work with and achiee a 10-2 regular season record, with wins over Alabama and Florida. That doesn't happen in the SEC without significant talent on a roster.

That being said, even had Pruitt been retained, and the talent that exited when he was fired still been here in 2022, I highly doubt he'd have managed a result anywhere close to what Heupel accomplished that season. He was a bad coach, who couldn't get the most out of what talent he was able to recruit.

I am not part of that group. 2022 was accomplished with a lot of Pruitts players but a lot of them played in much different roles than they did under Pruitt. The Stars of that team were not guys that people had pegged as stars during Pruitt's days, especially the Offense. Harrison Bailey was 'Pruitt's' QB. Milton for sure, and I think also Hooker were CJH guys Jaylen Wright was CJH, Velus Jones and Javonta Payton were CJH. yes, Hyatt was here under Pruitt but CJH unlocked him. Some of those are 2021 guys but my point is a lot of the major contributors to those first 2 teams were portal guys CJH brought in and guys that had been buried on the bench under Pruitt. Math says in your first 1-2 years most of your team is gonna be made up of the last coaches guys unless you're Colorado. But who were the Stars of 2022?

QB Hooker/Milton... let's call it a push here? Pruitt returns and Harrison Bailey is our starter.
RB Jabari Small (Pruitt) Jaylen Wright Dylan Sampson (both CJH) clear win by CJH
WR Hyatt, Bru, Squirrel (CJH) Tillman (Pruitt) CJH wins
TE Pruitt wins by default here though CJH gets an honorable mention for convincing Fant to stay on roster then doing the same with Warren the next year to share the ball.
OL Pruitt wins here by logic it takes time to develop Olinemen but again honorable mention getting Darnell wright to play RT.

So really the majority of guys that made major contributions on the offense of 2022 were CJH guys or guys it could be easily argued CJH elevated.
How about Defense? This is where the argument for Pruitt;s guys is strongest and there is almost no argument here to be had. Almost. I am pretty sure if you look at these boards from that year VERY few people were giving the defense credit for our record.. in fact most thought we won in spite of them. I disagree and it was mostly Pruitts guys but.. again there was some serious internal recruiting and finding guys going on that year. IIRC he had to recruit a lot of our current DL to keep them here that year and 2023... he brought in guys that contributed to the defense especially the secondary because it was ravaged by injuries so a lot of transfers and underclassmen played a lot of snaps.

All I am saying is trying to say because his best year was done in year 2 and he still had a lot of Pruitt's guys and the next year he didn't do as well is very disrespectful and lazy. There were a lot of factors in play. Namely we lost a lot that year and basically had an all-new offense 2023 at mostly every skill position. Continuity matters. Most of the guys that showed out in 2022 has 2 years in his system 2023 we were depending on a lot more underclassmen and first year (to the system) guys for major roles.

Given his track record over the past 3 years there is nothing I see about CJH to cause anyone to want to question if he can possibly be a great coach here. His floor is a really good coach.

 

[BeardedVol]

I am not part of that group. 2022 was accomplished with a lot of Pruitts players but a lot of them played in much different roles than they did under Pruitt. The Stars of that team were not guys that people had pegged as stars during Pruitt's days, especially the Offense. Harrison Bailey was 'Pruitt's' QB. Milton for sure, and I think also Hooker were CJH guys Jaylen Wright was CJH, Velus Jones and Javonta Payton were CJH. yes, Hyatt was here under Pruitt but CJH unlocked him. Some of those are 2021 guys but my point is a lot of the major contributors to those first 2 teams were portal guys CJH brought in and guys that had been buried on the bench under Pruitt. Math says in your first 1-2 years most of your team is gonna be made up of the last coaches guys unless you're Colorado. But who were the Stars of 2022?

QB Hooker/Milton... let's call it a push here? Pruitt returns and Harrison Bailey is our starter.
RB Jabari Small (Pruitt) Jaylen Wright Dylan Sampson (both CJH) clear win by CJH
WR Hyatt, Bru, Squirrel (CJH) Tillman (Pruitt) CJH wins
TE Pruitt wins by default here though CJH gets an honorable mention for convincing Fant to stay on roster then doing the same with Warren the next year to share the ball.
OL Pruitt wins here by logic it takes time to develop Olinemen but again honorable mention getting Darnell wright to play RT.

So really the majority of guys that made major contributions on the offense of 2022 were CJH guys or guys it could be easily argued CJH elevated.
How about Defense? This is where the argument for Pruitt;s guys is strongest and there is almost no argument here to be had. Almost. I am pretty sure if you look at these boards from that year VERY few people were giving the defense credit for our record.. in fact most thought we won in spite of them. I disagree and it was mostly Pruitts guys but.. again there was some serious internal recruiting and finding guys going on that year. IIRC he had to recruit a lot of our current DL to keep them here that year and 2023... he brought in guys that contributed to the defense especially the secondary because it was ravaged by injuries so a lot of transfers and underclassmen played a lot of snaps.

All I am saying is trying to say because his best year was done in year 2 and he still had a lot of Pruitt's guys and the next year he didn't do as well is very disrespectful and lazy. There were a lot of factors in play. Namely we lost a lot that year and basically had an all-new offense 2023 at mostly every skill position. Continuity matters. Most of the guys that showed out in 2022 has 2 years in his system 2023 we were depending on a lot more underclassmen and first year (to the system) guys for major roles.

Given his track record over the past 3 years there is nothing I see about CJH to cause anyone to want to question if he can possibly be a great coach here. His floor is a really good coach.

This is the post I was responding to:

I think what is more impressive about Heupel is when he got here the roster was really bad. After Pruitt was fired a lot of talent left. Coach had to do a ton of work just to build back a roster.

The reality of the roster being filled with Pruitt's recruits, and the record that they delivered, refutes this idea that Heupel some sort of monolithic task to complete, just to field a team.

Top contributions were still Pruitt's recruits on both sides of the ball.



It doesn't detract from the results of the 2022 season, but there's no reason to try to mythologize the reality of the roster, and the available talent that Heupel had at the time.

Until Heupel manages to produces an equal or better season with his own recruits, this will still be his best season, and and the majority of the production was with players he didn't recruit.

2024+ will be Heupel's chance to show what can be done with teams of his own creation.

 

[pimo1]

This is the post I was responding to:



The reality of the roster being filled with Pruitt's recruits, and the record that they delivered, refutes this idea that Heupel some sort of monolithic task to complete, just to field a team.

Top contributions were still Pruitt's recruits on both sides of the ball.
View attachment 643769
View attachment 643770

It doesn't detract from the results of the 2022 season, but there's no reason to try to mythologize the reality of the roster, and the available talent that Heupel had at the time.

Until Heupel manages to produces an equal or better season with his own recruits, this will still be his best season, and and the majority of the production was with players he didn't recruit.

2024+ will be Heupel's chance to show what can be done with teams of his own creation.

As I pointed out in my post and your charts even more clearly point out... the yellow highlights are not as big a deal as one might think.

Hooker being a Pruitt guy is kind of a stretch... Yes, he came in under Pruitt but not to be the guy. CJH believed in Milton and Hooker over Pruitts guy. Jaylin Hyatt was buried on the dept chart under Pruitt and by his own words the reason he hit that next level in 2022 was a CJH portal addition, Velus Jones. Seeing him gave him the roadmap. Tillman (injuries) and Keyton were the 3rd and 4th leading WR's. Fant returned because of CJH and again what did he do before CJH? In 3 years with Pruitt he produced less in total than he did with either of his individual 2 years with CJH.

Its not like he inherited a bunch of all SEC guys from Pruitt and just rolled with them. Almost all these Pruitt guys had their best seasons under CJH by far. They were all utilized to their fullest extent and put into positions to succeed. Bro, I am sure another of those coaches want credit for Juwan Mitchell. Just saying and Banks who is definitely a Pruitt guy and a guy I liked as a player may be the biggest reason we didn't make the playoffs. In fact had he not had his . tantrum Hendon likely does not tear his ACL and wins the Heisman. So yeah he did it all in spite of Pruitts guys because a ton of them were headcases. I went there.

 

[BeardedVol]

As I pointed out in my post and your charts even more clearly point out... the yellow highlights are not as big a deal as one might think.

Hooker being a Pruitt guy is kind of a stretch... Yes, he came in under Pruitt but not to be the guy. CJH believed in Milton and Hooker over Pruitts guy. Jaylin Hyatt was buried on the dept chart under Pruitt and by his own words the reason he hit that next level in 2022 was a CJH portal addition, Velus Jones. Seeing him gave him the roadmap. Tillman (injuries) and Keyton were the 3rd and 4th leading WR's. Fant returned because of CJH and again what did he do before CJH? In 3 years with Pruitt he produced less in total than he did with either of his individual 2 years with CJH.

Its not like he inherited a bunch of all SEC guys from Pruitt and just rolled with them. Almost all these Pruitt guys had their best seasons under CJH by far. They were all utilized to their fullest extent and put into positions to succeed. Bro, I am sure another of those coaches want credit for Juwan Mitchell. Just saying and Banks who is definitely a Pruitt guy and a guy I liked as a player may be the biggest reason we didn't make the playoffs. In fact had he not had his . tantrum Hendon likely does not tear his ACL and wins the Heisman. So yeah he did it all in spite of Pruitts guys because a ton of them were headcases. I went there.

The discussion was about talent available to Heupel when he arrived, not "why" players left or returned.

If you think that without the contribution of the players highlighted there, we still have the success of the 2022 season, you're flat wrong. Pruitt couldn't do much with the talent he brought to Tennessee, but he did bring some talent to Tennessee.

Hooker, no matter how much you want to believe otherwise, was a "Pruitt guy", even to the point that Heupel started Milton, "his guy" over him. Choosing to stay when Pruitt was fired, doesn't change who's staff recruited him.

You don't go 6-2 in the SEC with wins over Alabama and Florida without a significant amount of talent, there's no need to try to make demonstrably false claims about Heupel showing up to coach at Tennessee and there being no talent on the roster. The 2022 season and the roster proves that was not the case.

Heupel's coaching ability can stand on its own without trying to build a mythology around him.

 

[temptn]

White said. "I mean, we’re in Year 2 of our five-year strategic plan

.
We actually have a plan? That's different than the past.

 

[temptn]

Has to beat FL & Bama this year

Or else what?

 

[pimo1]

The discussion was about talent available to Heupel when he arrived, not "why" players left or returned.

If you think that without the contribution of the players highlighted there, we still have the success of the 2022 season, you're flat wrong. Pruitt couldn't do much with the talent he brought to Tennessee, but he did bring some talent to Tennessee.

Hooker, no matter how much you want to believe otherwise, was a "Pruitt guy", even to the point that Heupel started Milton, "his guy" over him. Choosing to stay when Pruitt was fired, doesn't change who's staff recruited him.

You don't go 6-2 in the SEC with wins over Alabama and Florida without a significant amount of talent, there's no need to try to make demonstrably false claims about Heupel showing up to coach at Tennessee and there being no talent on the roster. The 2022 season and the roster proves that was not the case.

Heupel's coaching ability can stand on its own without trying to build a mythology around him.

There is no mythology... he didn't come in and go 6-2 year one.. he did it year 2. He went 7-6 year 1 with even more of Pruitts guys...after Pruitt went 3-7 the year before. He did a great job turning a bad program around. UT always has and always will have talent on its rosters but in those lost years between Fulmer and CJH we went from being a 2-2.5 deep team to a 1.5 deep team. The main issue was culture not talent. We had a lot of headcases, primadonnas and legendary walkons. Think about this between 2010 and 2020 UT had walkons making major contributions on a regular basis. Back in the 90's and early 2000's no one talked about PWO's grey shirts or blueshirts. It was not just CJH it was the whole AD changing that changed things. It was a package a program.

 

[Freak]

This is the post I was responding to:



The reality of the roster being filled with Pruitt's recruits, and the record that they delivered, refutes this idea that Heupel some sort of monolithic task to complete, just to field a team.

Top contributions were still Pruitt's recruits on both sides of the ball.
View attachment 643769
View attachment 643770

It doesn't detract from the results of the 2022 season, but there's no reason to try to mythologize the reality of the roster, and the available talent that Heupel had at the time.

Until Heupel manages to produces an equal or better season with his own recruits, this will still be his best season, and and the majority of the production was with players he didn't recruit.

2024+ will be Heupel's chance to show what can be done with teams of his own creation.

I'm still trying to figure out what it is that bothers you about his comment. Saying Heupel had a ton of work to do to build back the roster doesn't seem that controversial of a statement.

We lost like 33 guys to the portal (I looked this up again and 33/34 seems to be the final number), not factoring in guys who left for other reasons or recruiting decommitments. We played that first year with around 60 scholarship players. I seem to recall that number dropping into the low 50s if you consider guys who were out with injuries.

Of course a lot of the guys still around were Pruitt's, if that's the point you're trying to make. I think that's to be expected. The roster wasn't "empty." And there were some talented guys left behind that Heupel and company did a good job of developing. But I'm not sure how that changes the fact that, well, there was a ton of work to do to rebuild the roster. Not to mention having to deal with the NCAA allegations and self imposed penalties in the process.

Heupel needs to do it with his own players, sure, we agree. Time will tell. But that first year roster was decimated, not matter how you slice it.

 

[BeardedVol]

I'm still trying to figure out what it is that bothers you about his comment. Saying Heupel had a ton of work to do to build back the roster doesn't seem that controversial of a statement.

We lost like 33 guys to the portal (I looked this up again and 33/34 seems to be the final number), not factoring in guys who left for other reasons or recruiting decommitments. We played that first year with around 60 scholarship players. I seem to recall that number dropping into the low 50s if you consider guys who were out with injuries.

Of course a lot of the guys still around were Pruitt's, if that's the point you're trying to make. I think that's to be expected. The roster wasn't "empty." And there were some talented guys left behind that Heupel and company did a good job of developing. But I'm not sure how that changes the fact that, well, there was a ton of work to do to rebuild the roster. Not to mention having to deal with the NCAA allegations and self imposed penalties in the process.

Heupel needs to do it with his own players, sure, we agree. Time will tell. But that first year roster was decimated, not matter how you slice it.

Who said Heupel didn't have work to do when he showed up?

I didn't. Any coach following Pruitt was going to have their work cut out for them.

I refuted the statement that he walked into an empty cupboard in terms of talent. I think he would have liked more depth, who wouldn't but the 2022 record is evidence, that there was enough talent left on the roster, to produce the best overall season at UT since 2015, and the best conference record since 2007.

There's no need to try to create a false narrative around what Heupel walked into when he took the job, and what he accomplished with a roster full of players that he didn't recruit.

 

[JohnWardForever]

Then I guess CJH isn’t Christian enough for you either as we all remember the GIF of him questioning the official with “you’ve got to be ****ing kidding me”.

Doesn't matter what I think, I'm quite sure Jesus Christ didn't approve. Hopefully Josh got forgiveness. There is no middle ground on cursing.

 

[volfanhill]

Who said Heupel didn't have work to do when he showed up?

I didn't. Any coach following Pruitt was going to have their work cut out for them.

I refuted the statement that he walked into an empty cupboard in terms of talent. I think he would have liked more depth, who wouldn't but the 2022 record is evidence, that there was enough talent left on the roster, to produce the best overall season at UT since 2015, and the best conference record since 2007.

There's no need to try to create a false narrative around what Heupel walked into when he took the job, and what he accomplished with a roster full of players that he didn't recruit.

You aren't giving him credit for maximizing that talent to achieve in 2022. You are making a strange argument. CJH inherited a broken program. Won big time. That's all that matters.

 

[BeardedVol]

You aren't giving him credit for maximizing that talent to achieve in 2022. You are making a strange argument. CJH inherited a broken program. Won big time. That's all that matters.

I did in fact a few posts up in the discussion.

Pruitt notoriously wasted talent here, again, evidenced by what Heupel did with the majority-Pruitt-recruited roster in 2022.

 

[Freak]

Who said Heupel didn't have work to do when he showed up?

I didn't. Any coach following Pruitt was going to have their work cut out for them.

Nowhere in my post did I suggest you said that.

I refuted the statement that he walked into an empty cupboard in terms of talent.

Who in this thread made that statement?

I think he would have liked more depth, who wouldn't but the 2022 record is evidence, that there was enough talent left on the roster, to produce the best overall season at UT since 2015, and the best conference record since 2007.

There's no need to try to create a false narrative around what Heupel walked into when he took the job, and what he accomplished with a roster full of players that he didn't recruit.

You think he would have liked more than 50-60 guys on the roster? Ya don't say! Seriously, that's a brutal number.

Who is it that's creating the false narrative? You're arguing a point no one is making. Building back a roster doesn't mean he inherited zero talent and had to fill all 85 scholarship players. He inherited talent, most of it with little experience, that he developed, but definitely talent. That second season doesn't turn out the way it did without Hyatt, Hooker, and others (which I think you acknowledged). But when a coach has to fill 25 empty scholarships, in addition to the graduating seniors and guys leaving for other reasons, that's a huge roster rebuild.

 

[Wezcoast]

So you'll be ok with 2-10 against AL, FA and GA thru 4 years?

Being ok with it doesn't matter any more than whether I like it or not. I'm trying to have reasonable expectations vs a still very loaded roster in Alabama and more so Georgia. I'll be upset if we lose to Florida at home this year. We should be able to handle them with better qb and secondary play . I'd be pissed . I'm not gonna jump on the fire Heupel train if we lose competitive games vs the former two. Probably all but a couple teams in the country would be dogs to both of them .

 

[KnoxToTheBoro93]

This is the post I was responding to:



The reality of the roster being filled with Pruitt's recruits, and the record that they delivered, refutes this idea that Heupel some sort of monolithic task to complete, just to field a team.

Top contributions were still Pruitt's recruits on both sides of the ball.
View attachment 643769
View attachment 643770

It doesn't detract from the results of the 2022 season, but there's no reason to try to mythologize the reality of the roster, and the available talent that Heupel had at the time.

Until Heupel manages to produces an equal or better season with his own recruits, this will still be his best season, and and the majority of the production was with players he didn't recruit.

2024+ will be Heupel's chance to show what can be done with teams of his own creation.

The same players that was 3-7 the year before he got here ? Don’t underestimate what heup has done… I’d say there isn’t 10 coaches In the nation that could’ve done what he has in the same time span… I do get what you are saying but Heups stamp and culture is all over that 2022 team any coach that takes over a new program will have to get the best out of the previous staffs players it’s unfair to hold that against heup
In all reality… Pruitt took over the program in much better shape than heup and did Nothing but complain about what he didn’t have… Heup is the real deal and isn’t a complacent coach his is innovative and constantly looking to improve so I am not worried about him proving anything else listen to him speak and see the type of players he has brought in already i am fully confident in him and this staff but I do think this team will be his best yet for multiple reasons…

 

[coffeevol]

I recall that T held the record for completions in a row for a while. However, the passes were rarely over 12 yards. Conservative for sure.

Who remembers which game that was? (Not me)

Here we go: Jesus invented the spread offense....

Are you saying Jesus Christ couldn't hit a curve ball?

 

[OrangeTsar]

We

The discussion was about talent available to Heupel when he arrived, not "why" players left or returned.

If you think that without the contribution of the players highlighted there, we still have the success of the 2022 season, you're flat wrong. Pruitt couldn't do much with the talent he brought to Tennessee, but he did bring some talent to Tennessee.

Hooker, no matter how much you want to believe otherwise, was a "Pruitt guy", even to the point that Heupel started Milton, "his guy" over him. Choosing to stay when Pruitt was fired, doesn't change who's staff recruited him.

You don't go 6-2 in the SEC with wins over Alabama and Florida without a significant amount of talent, there's no need to try to make demonstrably false claims about Heupel showing up to coach at Tennessee and there being no talent on the roster. The 2022 season and the roster proves that was not the case.

Heupel's coaching ability can stand on its own without trying to build a mythology around him.

We had talent after Pruitt but it was very thin. We were very lucky in 2022 to not suffer major injuries (at least until Hooker went down). A couple of key injuries early in that season and we would have been an 8 and 4 level team.
One thing I am excited about in 2024 is that we are finally stacking talent in better depth than we have had in a very long time.

 

[volbound1700]

I think the key is just the "goodwill" and "unity" that Heupel has brought along with the success. The Vol fanbase is united for the first time. We have had some hiccups (like UF last year) but we are in a great spot as a program for the first time since at least the early 2000s.

 

[MountainDooley]

Uh oh, it's May and the Must Wins are already out.

They are all “must win” games here on VN.