Did The Feds just admit to having a gun registry?

#26
#26
tim said:
The feds dont keep it. But its easily accessible to them. The news knew that Farrok's guns were a straw purchase within hours.
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Yes they contact the manufacturer to get to the distributor who tells them which dealer it went to then the dealer tells them who purchased it.
 
#30
#30
hog88 said:
Yes they contact the manufacturer to get to the distributor who tells them which dealer it went to then the dealer tells them who purchased it.
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That explains how they are able to trace a firearm that is in police custody and part of the evidence cache. They have the serial numbers. But if a gun was just purchased at random by a Jihadist or a normal citizen that doesn't break the law, how are they able to know what type of gun Jihadi John or John Q. Public bought if that information is supposed to be removed after a month? They may know that you applied for a purchase, but how do they get that level of detail unless they are actually keeping the information?
 
#32
#32
hog88 said:
If I had any interest in owning a gun I'd shop estate sales and such.
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If you but a gun at an auction it is suppose to go through the background check process.

A way is go to gun show , buy one outside the building from one of the guys walking around with guns.
 
#33
#33
hog88 said:
Not supposed to be electronically kept, the records sent to WV when a dealer goes out of business are only supposed to be kept on microfilm.

You aren't advocating or excusing the government violate the law are you?
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Im pointing things out hogg. The word scares people so there was a method created to be able too track things down. Its nothing different than finding a loophole in a tax law. The method is benign and not warehoused its spread out all over the US in gunshops. My question is how do they know where and who to ask?
 
#36
#36
Gramps said:
Depends on how old they are/when purchased. If such registry is kept they may be able to trace back to the original purchaser.
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Difficult. They would have to depend on interviewing backwards in hopes that everyone kept records.
 
#37
#37
tim said:
Im pointing things out hogg. The word scares people so there was a method created to be able too track things down. Its nothing different than finding a loophole in a tax law. The method is benign and not warehoused its spread out all over the US in gunshops. My question is how do they know where and who to ask?
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You see that folks...
weirdlook.gif


Just be clever enough to find a loophole and you can bypass all of these pesky laws and such.
 
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#38
#38
gramps said:
if you but a gun at an auction it is suppose to go through the background check process.

A way is go to gun show , buy one outside the building from one of the guys walking around with guns.
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whut?
 
#39
#39
Rasputin_Vol said:
You see that folks...
weirdlook.gif


Just be clever enough to find a loophole and you can bypass all of these pesky laws and such.
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The loop hole is interviewing people and calling manufacturers. Big time scheme there.
 
#43
#43
hog88 said:
Yes.
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Well there you go... the govt can "technically" say we don't keep records of sales, but then turn around and mandate that dealers and wholesalers keep the records.

They basically outsourced the collection of data and made these guys deal with the data gathering.

No different than the NSA claiming they don't have records of internet activity, but they can force ISPs to fork over info.
 
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#44
#44
Rasputin_Vol said:
Well there you go... the govt can "technically" say we don't keep records of sales, but then turn around and mandate that dealers and wholesalers keep the records.

They basically outsourced the collection of data and made these guys deal with the data gathering.

No different than the NSA claiming they don't have records of internet activity, but they can force ISPs to fork over info.
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Dealer to buyer paperwork is paper, not electronic. The paper stays with the dealer until they go out of business.
 
#46
#46
Rasputin_Vol said:
Well there you go... the govt can "technically" say we don't keep records of sales, but then turn around and mandate that dealers and wholesalers keep the records.

They basically outsourced the collection of data and made these guys deal with the data gathering.

No different than the NSA claiming they don't have records of internet activity, but they can force ISPs to fork over info.
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I think the difference is that the NSA is tapped into some ISPs and pulling the data directly. If they want to examine those records, they apply to the FISA court for a warrant. For those providers who've not granted such access, again a warrant request.

For tracing a firearm through the FFL, I assume a warrant is also required.

The 2ndA is not a prohibition on creating a registry. Doing so is currently against the law, however.
 
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#47
#47
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
Indeed. ATF form 4473 is de facto gun registration.
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I disagree; it is not a government database but FFL records which government can petition to trace in the event a gun is recovered in a crime. I don't have a problem with the arrangement.
 
#48
#48
NCFisher said:
I disagree; it is not a government database but FFL records which government can petition to trace in the event a gun is recovered in a crime. I don't have a problem with the arrangement.
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Because government hasn't ever abused databases before. Don't fool yourself, it is a database.The only point of having a list is to collect those items at some point in the future. Maybe not this administration, but later on down the road.
 
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#50
#50
You criticize the administration for not taking steps to prevent terrorism. You criticize the steps they take to prevent terrorism.

Got it.
 
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