Edward Snowden: American Hero

#1,377
#1,377
volprof said:
So why is selling light bulbs so much easier and less dangerous than selling alcohol on the black market? By your definition, both are being regulated and managed by the government. What explains the difference?

I'll go ahead and help. The difference is that alcohol actually wasn't being regulated by the government; it was simply illegal. There's a difference there. Once it was actually regulated by the government, like today, the murdering stops.
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Just like heroin is simply illegal. Just like crack is simply illegal. You're making my argument for me. Light bulb regulation doesn't compare to alcohol prohibition. Crack prohibition does.

Look, I'm not claiming that governments are perfect. It is likely that in many cases governments can be (and are) more dangerous than states of anarchy or weak governance. However, while that may ebb and flow, I think the state of anarchy and/or weak governance is one of perpetual violence and chaos.

You obviously trust others more than I do, and you are to be commended for that. You're far less the cynic than I am. I just don't trust the masses though, and I never will. They'll beat your ass half senseless and leave you for dead over something as dumb as an insult at least as much as any government or regime ever will.
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I trust that people respond to incentives. Government officials are invariably faced with bad incentives...much moreso than the general public, which is why I don't trust people in government. Believe me, I'm totally a cynic. You are saying "I don't trust people, so let's elect them to positions of power over us." which makes no sense to me.
 
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#1,379
#1,379
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
"It is true that there can be no absolute guarantee that a purely market society would not fall prey to organized criminality.

Damned right there is no guarantee against it. It would most assuredly happen. And that would be much worse than what we have today.


But this concept is far more workable than the truly Utopian idea of a strictly limited government, an idea that has never worked historically. And understandably so, for the State’s built-in monopoly of aggression and inherent absence of free- market checks has enabled it to burst easily any bonds that well- meaning people have tried to place upon it. Finally, the worst that could possibly happen would be for the State to be reestab- lished. And since the State is what we have now, any experimen- tation with a stateless society would have nothing to lose and everything to gain."

The above is from Murray Rothbard's Power and Market. While there is certainly no blueprint as to how things might work, we can read and learn about possibilities.
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And having learned about the possibilities, we can discard the notion of anarchy as completely unworkable, unless of course, you are one the most aggressive and richest entities. Then it might work for you, for a while.
 
#1,380
#1,380
Danl said:
And having learned about the possibilities, we can discard the notion of anarchy as completely unworkable, unless of course, you are one the most aggressive and richest entities. Then it might work for you, for a while.
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How? With no power structure in place what is there to acquire? And, if you're worried about a monopolist state, we already have that, so....
 
#1,382
#1,382
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
How? With no power structure in place what is there to acquire? And, if you're worried about a monopolist state, we already have that, so....
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I'm sure Danl will come in with another response, but I've explained it before that people just don't change. I used the seven deadly sins as an example of the toll human nature will take on any organized society.

You have to change human nature in order for An-Cap to work. For any government to work really.
 
#1,383
#1,383
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
How?

How what?

With no power structure in place what is there to acquire?

How would there not be power structures? If there weren't structures there would be in about 23 nanoseconds.

There would be everything to acquire:land, water, power, currency, all the usual stuff.


And, if you're worried about a monopolist state, we already have that, so....
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If you think our current government is the worst of all possibilities, you're insane.
 
#1,387
#1,387
I'm under no illusions that America is ready for anarchy right now this minute. If that happens, a lot of people would die, as too many people are dependent upon the government for survival.

I think a over a period of 20-30 years we could decentralize the federal government and move to a more local level. Move from the state, then to the county and so on, and so forth. Until the government dissolves. Over this time, there will have to be major cuts in entitlement programs. It would be a major step, will it work? Who knows.

As I said earlier, libertarians/anarchist/voluntaryist don't have all the answers. We'd like to stop robbing and killing each other and then we can see where that leads.
 
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#1,389
#1,389
DEFENDTHISHOUSE said:
I'm under no illusions that America is ready for anarchy right now this minute. If that happens, a lot of people would die, as too many people are dependent upon the government for survival.

I think a over a period of 20-30 years we could decentralize the federal government and move to a more local level. Move from the state, then to the county and so on, and so forth. Until the government dissolves. Over this time, there will have to be major cuts in entitlement programs. It would be a major step, will it work? Who knows.

As I said earlier, libertarians/anarchist/voluntaryist don't have all the answers. We'd like to stop robbing and killing each other and then we can see where that leads.
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Do you seriously believe that any of that is remotely possible?
 
#1,395
#1,395
n_huffhines said:
Just like heroin is simply illegal. Just like crack is simply illegal. You're making my argument for me. Light bulb regulation doesn't compare to alcohol prohibition. Crack prohibition does.



I trust that people respond to incentives. Government officials are invariably faced with bad incentives...much moreso than the general public, which is why I don't trust people in government. Believe me, I'm totally a cynic. You are saying "I don't trust people, so let's elect them to positions of power over us." which makes no sense to me.
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All predicated on the firm belief that the Non Agression Principle will actually be observed by a sufficient number of the population who will back free market police forces headed by warlor... uh civic minded individuals and so blissful utopia will be obtained.

BS. Warlords and Mad Max. Have your family's bug out bags ready for when the **** hits the fan and you have to be ready to kill to make it to your bolt hole.

I have zero confidence in the good will of enough people that the NGA will obtain to allow a life in any fashion approaching what you have described throughout your postings.

Looking at the world, how can you believe the NGA has a snowballs chance on a hot tin roof?
 
#1,396
#1,396
Not good at all... So wait, he brings up execution and death when describing Snowden, yet doesn't go anywhere near that sort of rhetoric when it involves Hillary?

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1ABLhi2PnA[/youtube]
 
#1,397
#1,397
Yep, telling the American people that the government is spying on everything you do makes you a traitor, and worthy of a death sentence. Seriously? **** those guys.

Snowden's real crime is he offended the state and the state will make him pay. It's what they do...
 
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