Follow-up question to the global warming thread

#51
#51
therealUT said:
I guess I will take a stab at this. It really boils down to a fundamental argument of basic liberties. People (remember, corporations are people) should have the freedom to do as they please as long as they are not harming others. There is no proof (there are hypothesi, theories, etc.) that man has contributed in the least to global warming. The earth has warmed and cooled over billions of years...IT IS DYNAMIC! Any effect man has on this process is negligent at most.

Therefore, people should not be kept from pursuing the most cost effective means to their own personal happiness. If you believe in the cause, then don't buy from vendors who are not "environmentally friendly." If enough people believe in the cause, then the "environmentally friendly" vendors will drive the rest out of business.
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Agree 100%. Basis of free market society is customer demand will drive business.
 
#52
#52
therealUT said:
I guess I will take a stab at this. It really boils down to a fundamental argument of basic liberties. People (remember, corporations are people) should have the freedom to do as they please as long as they are not harming others. There is no proof (there are hypothesi, theories, etc.) that man has contributed in the least to global warming. The earth has warmed and cooled over billions of years...IT IS DYNAMIC! Any effect man has on this process is negligent at most.

Therefore, people should not be kept from pursuing the most cost effective means to their own personal happiness. If you believe in the cause, then don't buy from vendors who are not "environmentally friendly." If enough people believe in the cause, then the "environmentally friendly" vendors will drive the rest out of business.
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Do you really believe companies should be allowed to pollute as much as they please? So you don't believe in polution?

As for the earth cooling and heating...it has NEVER heated at this rapid of a rate, and it just happens to coincide with the rapid increase of carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere.

I don't think corporations should be allowed to do as they please. That is nearly (or may just be) an anarchy. Talk about leanin' right!!!!

Gravity is a theory. I don't think we need you to walk off a sky scraper to prove this, but is still a theory, just like global warming.
 
#54
#54
The Dude said:
Do you really believe companies should be allowed to pollute as much as they please? So you don't believe in polution?

As for the earth cooling and heating...it has NEVER heated at this rapid of a rate, and it just happens to coincide with the rapid increase of carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere.

I don't think corporations should be allowed to do as they please. That is nearly (or may just be) an anarchy. Talk about leanin' right!!!!

Gravity is a theory. I don't think we need you to walk off a sky scraper to prove this, but is still a theory, just like global warming.
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I could really care less about pollution.

Oh, and for future reference, gravity is a law and the Earth heated at a rate of less than 1 degree centigrade for about 15 years, yet has been cooling off for the past 5.
 
#55
#55
therealUT said:
I could really care less about pollution.

Oh, and for future reference, gravity is a law and the Earth heated at a rate of less than 1 degree centigrade for about 15 years, yet has been cooling off for the past 5.
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I thought about blasting you for saying you don't care about pollution, but hey, your better than the guy who says he does care but drives the Ford Excursion.

Gravitation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

No, it's theory.
 
#60
#60
The Dude said:
I thought about blasting you for saying you don't care about pollution, but hey, your better than the guy who says he does care but drives the Ford Excursion.

Gravitation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

No, it's theory.
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Gravity, not gravitation. I guess Newton's Laws are rather flimsy.

If you can come up with a formula, and through empirical data and countless experiments, prove that the formula works every time, then you can stake your claim to global warming. That is how a theory becomes law.
 
#61
#61
The Dude said:
Do you really believe companies should be allowed to pollute as much as they please? So you don't believe in polution?

As for the earth cooling and heating...it has NEVER heated at this rapid of a rate, and it just happens to coincide with the rapid increase of carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere.

I don't think corporations should be allowed to do as they please. That is nearly (or may just be) an anarchy. Talk about leanin' right!!!!

Gravity is a theory. I don't think we need you to walk off a sky scraper to prove this, but is still a theory, just like global warming.
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You totally missed RealUT's point. In a true free market economy if you care so much then don't buy from companies who pollute. This will change a companies enviromental policy and thus change the industry.

And the jury is still out on whether the global warming thing is driven ONLY by man. People tend to discount natural changes in the earth that have been going on for billions of years.
 
#63
#63
utvolpj said:
French scientist reverses stance on GW

Allegre's second thoughts

Some interesting new stuff coming out soon.

Greenhouse effect is a myth, say scientists | the Daily Mail

The Great Global Warming Swindle from Channel4.com
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I would like to read more of Allegre's quotes. The article seemed to make a lot of statements not attributed to him and the ones that were attributed to him were not entirely damning. However, it was a pretty good article. I would like to read about Allegre's findings.

The second article, on the other hand, was not good at all. First, the title is "Greenhouse effect is a myth, say scientists." I assure you, no scientists are saying the greenhouse effect is a myth. Some scientists are saying that global warming is not caused by increasing greenhouse gas concentrations. The title of the article is a HUGE misnomer..without the greenhouse effect, we would all freeze to death. Also, the article alludes to the surge in CO2 concentrations after world war 2 but a decrease in temperatures. When these CO2 emissions surged, so too did aerosol emissions, such as Sulfur from coal plants. We know that aerosols contribute a net cooling effect...and we have seen temperatures rise since aerosol emissions have been abated. While I'm not sure if this was the only reason for cooling..for example..for the same (but inverse) reasons that solar activity can cause warming, it can cause cooling...I do know that scientists attribute much of that cooling period to the increasing aersol concentrations which are short lived..and now much lower as emissions have subsided.

That second article was really bad I thought. But...good first article. Thanks for both.
 
#64
#64
Believe what you may. Both sides can line up enough "credible" scientists to state facts backing up either side. Both sides will keep on trying to convince the 90% of the world who doesn't care to actually believe their viewpoint.
 
#65
#65
global-cooling.jpg
 
#66
#66
I read in the newspaper this morning that the U.S. was thinking about putting the Polar Bear on the endangered species list. apparentle their ice habitate appears to be melting!

I've come up with a solution..........dye their fur black......and release them in the Smokies!! With all the idiot tourists feeding the native bears and the cheap motels leaving their trash bins unsecured in Gatlinburg, they would have plenty to eat. Also black hair coloring apparently is in abundance in the State (look at the ladies coming out of the many trailor parks). If the bears needed teeth then you would have a problem!!!!
 
#67
#67
Continuing a trend of posting "hopefully" useful resources, I thought you might like to take a glance at this. It is congressional testimony (last week) from one of the profs teaching my climate change class...at least I get to read his actual opinions here without having to figure out when he is playing devil's advocate!

Hearing Archives :Committee on Ways & Means :: U.S. House of Representatives :

Other testimony from the same day can be found here:

Hearing Archives :Committee on Ways & Means :: U.S. House of Representatives :

The economics and policy of dealing with climate change (man-made or not) and some of the science (is man making it or not and what can we predict) are discussed. The first link (from Professor Prinn) pertains primarily to the science.
 
#68
#68
Well it has to be official now that Sports Illustrated has given it a cover. You know what the old SI cover jinx does for a story. Morons.
 
#70
#70
TennTradition said:
Continuing a trend of posting "hopefully" useful resources, I thought you might like to take a glance at this. It is congressional testimony (last week) from one of the profs teaching my climate change class...at least I get to read his actual opinions here without having to figure out when he is playing devil's advocate!

Hearing Archives :Committee on Ways & Means :: U.S. House of Representatives :

Other testimony from the same day can be found here:

Hearing Archives :Committee on Ways & Means :: U.S. House of Representatives :

The economics and policy of dealing with climate change (man-made or not) and some of the science (is man making it or not and what can we predict) are discussed. The first link (from Professor Prinn) pertains primarily to the science.
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Haven't read these yet (will). However, as a professor I will say I respect the genuine effort you are showing to get the most out of this class. :salute: Many students miss this opportunity.
 
#74
#74
volinbham said:
Haven't read these yet (will). However, as a professor I will say I respect the genuine effort you are showing to get the most out of this class. :salute: Many students miss this opportunity.
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well shucks...thanks :blush2:

no, all kidding aside, it's nice to have the opportunity to learn for learning's sake .... especially after having worked for several years before heading back for graduate school
 
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