Gov. Bredesen assaults freedom, liberty - wants to ban smoking in public

#1
Volitics

Volitics

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#1
According to an article published in The Tennessean and an editorial published in Nashville's The City Paper Gov. Bredesen wants to ban smoking in work places and in restaurants.

Smoking ban has chance - Nashville, Tennessee - Friday, 01/26/07 - Tennessean.com
The City Paper - Smart, Fast, Free

I voted for Bredesen in the most recent election. He waited until after the election before wanting to assault tobacco.

Business owners are perfectly capable of making the decision of whether to allow smoking on their own property - they don't need the government making the decision for them.

My opinion of Bredesen is starting to change. The guy is starting to act like a jerk. If I had known he would try to erode our liberties and freedoms I would not have voted for him this last time.
 
#2
#2
I don't have a problem with people smoking in their homes, their cars, or in private businesses where it's permitted.

Public areas outside of those businesses is a little different though. I've never been a smoker, other than a cigar every year or so, and the smell of cigarette smoke is nasty. Cigarette butts strewn about parking lots, sidewalks, and roadsides is further evidence of a pretty nasty habit.

I know that not all smokers are smelly litterbugs, my own parents smoked all during my childhood. I seem to have turned out ok, despite all the dire consequences of "second hand smoke".

All that said, it's my right to not patronize a business that permits smoking. Conversely, smokers need to be a little more courteous to the non-smokers around them and understand that if it's a business' decision to ban smoking, it's not because the world is out to get them.
 
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#3
Perhaps I should have been more specific. Bredesen wants to ban smoking in ALL places of business (including private offices) and ALL restaurants.

The only question is are we going to stand idly by and let Bredesen take away the freedoms and liberties for which so many Americans have fought and died.
 
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Volitics said:
Perhaps I should have been more specific. Bredesen wants to ban smoking in ALL places of business (including private offices) and ALL restaurants.

The only question is are we going to stand idly by and let Bredesen take away the freedoms and liberties for which so many Americans have fought and died.
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I'm not sure American soldiers have been on the battlefield at any point in American History saying, "Guys I'm really glad we are out here fighting and dieing so my kid's kids can smoke cigarettes at Mc Donalds killing themselves and others with second-hand smoke".

Banning smoking in public places isn't infringing on anyone's freedoms or rights. I can have sex with my wife, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can take a crap in the morning, or a piss in the evening, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can pleasure myself if I so choose, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can walk around naked in my own house, but I am banned from doing it in public.

All banning smoking is doing, is being considerate to those that don't smoke and helping improve the quality of life for those around them.
 
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#5
Plenty of states have already taken this step. Sooner or later it WILL happen in TN. Only a matter of time at this point.
 
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BlountVol said:
I'm not sure American soldiers have been on the battlefield at any point in American History saying, "Guys I'm really glad we are out here fighting and dieing so my kid's kids can smoke cigarettes at Mc Donalds killing themselves and others with second-hand smoke".

Banning smoking in public places isn't infringing on anyone's freedoms or rights. I can have sex with my wife, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can take a crap in the morning, or a piss in the evening, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can pleasure myself if I so choose, but I'm banned from doing it in public. I can walk around naked in my own house, but I am banned from doing it in public.

All banning smoking is doing, is being considerate to those that don't smoke and helping improve the quality of life for those around them.
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Please read the articles from the above links before you make comments. A private business office is not a public place.

If all you can do is talk vulgar go somewhere else.
 
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VolunteerHillbilly said:
Plenty of states have already taken this step. Sooner or later it WILL happen in TN. Only a matter of time at this point.
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I'm quite fond of the Massachusetts (well, Boston and surrounding areas I know...not sure about the other parts) ban on smoking...but, I am a non-smoker..so the ability to go eat/drink anywhere without coming out smelling like smoke is a great thing to me.
 
#8
#8
Ahhh...yes. Telling private business what they can and cannot do on their property. So much for property rights huh? Now I KNOW people fought and died for THAT right!
 
#9
#9
Agreed, this is absurd. I do not smoke, hate to be around smoking, but telling private businesses what to do, I do not like.
 
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allvol123 said:
Agreed, this is absurd. I do not smoke, hate to be around smoking, but telling private businesses what to do, I do not like.
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Do you mean private offices or businesses? I think the discussion prior to this (it seems) has been divided into private offices with no public dealing and other businesses that do deal with the public (e.g., restaurants). I know that some people are against any of it. I find it (personally) nice for restaurants, bars, etc.
 
#11
#11
I've never smoked a cigarette in my life, but I don't like when the government starts telling private business owners how to run their business. It should be the independent business owner's choice whether or not to allow smoking in their establishments. "Big Brother" needs to stay out of it.
 
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Volitics said:
Perhaps I should have been more specific. Bredesen wants to ban smoking in ALL places of business (including private offices) and ALL restaurants.

The only question is are we going to stand idly by and let Bredesen take away the freedoms and liberties for which so many Americans have fought and died.
Click to expand...

I understood the specifics, forgive me if I rambled a bit.

when Sundquist wanted to institute a state income tax, a grass roots rebellion of sorts took place and effectively killed the legislation. It's possible a similar effort could be waged in this case.
 
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TennTradition said:
Do you mean private offices or businesses? I think the discussion prior to this (it seems) has been divided into private offices with no public dealing and other businesses that do deal with the public (e.g., restaurants). I know that some people are against any of it. I find it (personally) nice for restaurants, bars, etc.
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I mean private anything. A customer can choose to to use or not use a business place, depending on if they like how it is being run. I think the government needs to stay out of it.
 
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allvol123 said:
I mean private anything. A customer can choose to to use or not use a business place, depending on if they like how it is being run. I think the government needs to stay out of it.
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I think that the basis for prior legislation has been "when public health is a concern." For example, the state board of health can inspect restaurants to ensure that they are following proper sanitation procedures - they tell them how to prepare food, how to store it, etc. They are telling them how to run their business because it is a matter of public health. I think that is the same rationale that is used to prevent businesses with public dealings from allowing customers to smoke cigarettes.

I know that anytime the government steps in and tells a business owner how to run their business that a lot of people get very upset and that rights are infringed upon. But, it seems that the courts will allow it when public health is the concern.

I'm sensitive to the debate - I hear it all the time in Boston from businees owners who don't like the idea, but have to do it anyway.
 
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#15
how did our republic survive all those dark years when smoking in public was permitted?

"public health" is a straw dog argument since nobody is forced to patronize a business where smoking is permitted. Nor are employees forced to work in such businesses.
 
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MG1968 said:
how did our republic survive all those dark years when smoking in public was permitted?

"public health" is a straw dog argument since nobody is forced to patronize a business where smoking is permitted. Nor are employees forced to work in such businesses.
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Nope...that is why you see a lot of people angry about this issue. But, at times the government will recognize that if most establishments (lets say restaurants) allow smoking..that this is an entire group of workers who have an additional workplace hazard that may not be necessary. All I am saying is that I think that is how the laws have been able to be passed and not overturned by the courts.
 
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CSpindizzy said:
Ahhh...yes. Telling private business what they can and cannot do on their property. So much for property rights huh? Now I KNOW people fought and died for THAT right!
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allvol123 said:
Agreed, this is absurd. I do not smoke, hate to be around smoking, but telling private businesses what to do, I do not like.
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Prettyboy said:
I've never smoked a cigarette in my life, but I don't like when the government starts telling private business owners how to run their business. It should be the independent business owner's choice whether or not to allow smoking in their establishments. "Big Brother" needs to stay out of it.
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MG1968 said:
how did our republic survive all those dark years when smoking in public was permitted?

"public health" is a straw dog argument since nobody is forced to patronize a business where smoking is permitted. Nor are employees forced to work in such businesses.
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I assume that all of you are cool with private business that wants to open a methadone clinic next door to your house? Or a halfway house for child molesters accross the streets from your kids schools? or how about a 'Build-A-Bomb' shop similar to the Build-A-Bear complete with atomic warheads? Face it, government regulates private business now. That's the reason you can feel confident that hamburger meat you buy at the grocery isn't tainted with Mad Cow disease and that new plasm screen you got isn't giving off high doses of radiation that will give you brain cancer. What I understand is that there are two groups of people who are against this legislation. First, are selfish smokers don't care if they kill the rest of us with their poisonous emissions. Second, are the small time bar and greasy spoon owners who are operating so close to the margins that they cannot sustain the lost revenue from a 3-6 month dip in sales. Everywhere that this has happened, including FL and GA, the net result is that restaurant sales improve and that is part of the reason that the TN Restaurant Association supports the ban. I hate to hurt anyone's feelings but if you are a smoker then you are not engaging in some passive activity that only hurts you. You are poisoning the atmosphere of all those around you. At best you are air polluters, at worst you are murderers.

State restaurant association supports smoking ban - Nashville, Tennessee - Thursday, 02/08/07 - Tennessean.com
 
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VolunteerHillbilly said:
What I understand is that there are two groups of people who are against this legislation. First, are selfish smokers don't care if they kill the rest of us with their poisonous emissions. Second, are the small time bar and greasy spoon owners who are operating so close to the margins that they cannot sustain the lost revenue from a 3-6 month dip in sales. Everywhere that this has happened, including FL and GA, the net result is that restaurant sales improve and that is part of the reason that the TN Restaurant Association supports the ban. I hate to hurt anyone's feelings but if you are a smoker then you are not engaging in some passive activity that only hurts you. You are poisoning the atmosphere of all those around you. At best you are air polluters, at worst you are murderers.
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:clapping: :good!: Right on the money! :thumbsup: :yes:
 
#19
#19
Ummm...comparing child molesters who actively seek out children to abuse and those who like to go to a business that allows smoking and eating are a little far in comparison. No one forces you to eat at a dining establishment that allows smoking. The actions that go on there do not threaten you or your children nor do they affetc your lives in any way. If a group of smokers wish to eat at a business that allows them to smoke, who are you to tell them what to do?

It seems the ones who support this legislation are ones who are trying to envoke some moral and/or personal crusade to force their own previous mistakes or personal choices on othert people. If those businesses are concerned over margins, what do you care?

It seems as if you VH like to force your will upon others. How is a business who allows smokers in it murderers? I guess you would be one to sue gun manufacturers for the ultimate loss of life they might cause as well? Guns used by individuals on private property for their own enjoyment such as hunting or firing ranges vs. the ones in the streets?

There is no conclusive proof over the loss or gain of revenue. And revenue gain or loss is not the issue. Telling businesses what they can or cannot do with something that is legal is the issue.

I hate to hurt your feelings but if they are smokers and enter a smoking friendly establishment, they are engaging in a legal activity that infringes on no one's rights. If you don't like smoke, stay away from it. If you don't like smoke filled businesses go somewhere else. No one forced you to drag your family in that private establishment and breathe in the air. This is as insane as those restricting the air waves. If you don't like what's on TV...turn it off. Tipper....
 
#21
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CSpindizzy said:
Ummm...comparing child molesters who actively seek out children to abuse and those who like to go to a business that allows smoking and eating are a little far in comparison. No one forces you to eat at a dining establishment that allows smoking. The actions that go on there do not threaten you or your children nor do they affetc your lives in any way. If a group of smokers wish to eat at a business that allows them to smoke, who are you to tell them what to do?

It seems the ones who support this legislation are ones who are trying to envoke some moral and/or personal crusade to force their own previous mistakes or personal choices on othert people. If those businesses are concerned over margins, what do you care?

It seems as if you VH like to force your will upon others. How is a business who allows smokers in it murderers? I guess you would be one to sue gun manufacturers for the ultimate loss of life they might cause as well? Guns used by individuals on private property for their own enjoyment such as hunting or firing ranges vs. the ones in the streets?

There is no conclusive proof over the loss or gain of revenue. And revenue gain or loss is not the issue. Telling businesses what they can or cannot do with something that is legal is the issue.

I hate to hurt your feelings but if they are smokers and enter a smoking friendly establishment, they are engaging in a legal activity that infringes on no one's rights. If you don't like smoke, stay away from it. If you don't like smoke filled businesses go somewhere else. No one forced you to drag your family in that private establishment and breathe in the air. This is as insane as those restricting the air waves. If you don't like what's on TV...turn it off. Tipper....
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Extremely well put !!! :thumbsup:
 
#22
#22
And by the way, I am not a business owner or a smoker. I have no stake in this...well besides being a property owner.
 
#23
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CSpindizzy said:
I hate to hurt your feelings but if they are smokers and enter a smoking friendly establishment, they are engaging in a legal activity that infringes on no one's rights. If you don't like smoke, stay away from it. If you don't like smoke filled businesses go somewhere else. No one forced you to drag your family in that private establishment and breathe in the air. This is as insane as those restricting the air waves. If you don't like what's on TV...turn it off. Tipper....
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By what you are saying, child molesters who have done their time and want to live next to a kiddie care should be free to live where they choose since living where you want to live is not a crime so long as you can pay for it. Right? Smoking does infringe on the rights of people who inhale the second hand smoke, and since public accomodations (restuarants, hotels and transporation facilities) are to be open to all people according to the Civil Rights Act of 1964, it occurs to me that the ones who are killing people with their cancer-causing fumes should be the ones to step back. If any group of people want to have their own private club that is not open to the general public, and allow smoking therein then I could care less. But if an business is open to all comers then this is a public health issue and the business is just going to have to del with it. I really don't care a whole lot about this subject but I can tell you that this bill will pass this year or next.
 
#24
#24
Again, you're comparing someone who has a history of fondling children to someone who smokes a dried out leaf. I fail to see the comparison. One is legal and the other is not.

How does smoking infringe on your rights when you step on the property of a smoke-friendly business? I'm sure their food does wonders for your health as well. Step into a Waffle House and eat a few times. Tell me the government should start doing what NYC is calling for and regulating fat? I mean obesity is an epidemic as well. Shall the nanny-state start holding our hands and telling us how we should live healthy lives and making anything 'unhealthy' illegal?

Again, don't like the smoke? Go whine on someone else's private property. But don't tell me I cannot have a smoke friendly business. Don't tell me I cannot allow an action that is perfectly legal to take place on my property. If smoking is so evil, just ban tobacco. Stop subsidizing it. Stop taxing it. Make it illegal.
 
#25
#25
As I said on the taxing topic, I find it amusing that something deemed so evil by the government is kept legal ONLY for the purposes of taxing it. It's evil to smoke but please continue to buy cigarettes so we can rack up the tax revenues.....it'll kill you but by all means please smoke so we can expand government spending.
 
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