Gun laws

#26
#26
UT IE 95 said:
We've debated the gun rights issue before. I wasn't intending to rehash that debate. I was only stating my stand for another poster.

I was only posting this to question why these random rampage killers never get killed - they alway puss out and commit suicide.
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That's the truth. Maybe it's because people aren't allowed to carry guns where most the these incidents occur? I don't know if that's true but it seems most of these things happen in place where guns aren't allowed.
 
#27
#27
MG1968 said:
you may not have intended a rehash of gun rights, but you opened things up with a stupid assertion that we need more gun laws and more accountability for LEGAL gun owners.
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Oh yeah? Well, it's a stupid assertion that we don't have better laws and more accountability for LEGAL gun owners.

Now we're even. As a legal gun owner myself, I respect your position and understand I won't change your mind.
 
#28
#28
UT IE 95 said:
We've debated the gun rights issue before. I wasn't intending to rehash that debate. I was only stating my stand for another poster.

I was only posting this to question why these random rampage killers never get killed - they alway puss out and commit suicide.
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Not all of them. A guy shot a brother and sister this week in College Station in the adjacent neighborhood to mine. He didnt shoot himself. I can guarantee you that had that happened on the street where we live, my neighbors are all "good ole boys" and he would not have had a chance to drive off. All of my neighbors are on the look out to protect eachother's families and belongings.
 
#30
#30
Trust me.. The next time a rampaging killer runs by me, I'll try to drop him. But, like most of my peers, I don't carry a gun when I'm going to the grocery.
 
#31
#31
tim said:
Trust me.. The next time a rampaging killer runs by me, I'll try to drop him. But, like most of my peers, I don't carry a gun when I'm going to the grocery.
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Why not? You're much more likely to need it there than stuffed under a pillow in case of a home invasion.
 
#32
#32
UT IE 95 said:
I can understand some business owners having a firearm - especially a convenience store or pawn shop in a high-crime area. I don't consider those places random targets. The exact reason I never frequent those establishments.

I'm wondering about these rampage killers we hear about every week it seems - running around schools, churches, and malls. How come none of them run into a legal gun tote-in' hombre with an itchy trigger finger?
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Probably because the number of people who have conceal carry permits are very few, the odds of these people coming across a guy like this are very low. Perhaps if there were less of a stigma on those who carry guns legally and responsibly their numbers might someday be equal to the scum that do this type of thing. I would think that the threat of being hit with criminal charges or being sued for protecting the lives of others keeps a lot of law abiding gun owners from getting involved in situations where they might have to take a life to protect someone elses they do not know.
 
#34
#34
UT IE 95 said:
I can understand some business owners having a firearm - especially a convenience store or pawn shop in a high-crime area. I don't consider those places random targets. The exact reason I never frequent those establishments.

I'm wondering about these rampage killers we hear about every week it seems - running around schools, churches, and malls. How come none of them run into a legal gun tote-in' hombre with an itchy trigger finger?
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It does happen, but memories can be short and to be brutally honest the majority of the media have little interest in people getting word to begin with. I'll throw some examples at you:

Security Guard: 'God Guided Me And Protected Me' - Denver News Story - KMGH Denver

Town tries to cope with school shooting

Appalachian School of Law Shootings

This one includes some interesting things about how events like the above are all but supressed.

Loaded Coverage: How the news media miss the mark on the gun issue. - Reason Magazine

And here's just a few more examples of people using guns in defense. You really need to understand this is happening ALL THE TIME but you aren't hearing about it and that's very much by design.

Bond Hill Apartment Resident Shoots, Kills Robber - :: Cincinnati news story :: LOCAL 12 WKRC-TV in Cincinnati

Opelika victim shoots robber in buttocks | Opelika-Auburn News

Police: Woman kills home invader; 2 men booked - AP - NOLA.com

WTVM.com and WTVM News Leader 9, Columbus, GA | Lilburn homeowner shoots, kills intruder at door

Woman fends off suspected burglar with gunshot | woman, barstow, burglar - News - Desert Dispatch

Yakima homicide justified - Mid-Columbia News | Tri-City Herald : Mid-Columbia news

Note that all of these have taken place in '09 already and are no doubt just the tip of the iceburg.
 
#35
#35
droski said:
me thinks the number of home invasions significantly outnumbers the number of rampage killing sprees.
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I should have clarified it as a violent home invasion where your life is threatened.

Either way - your probably right that your chance of getting popped off at home are higher than at the grocery store. Scary.
 
#37
#37
KB5252 said:
Probably because the number of people who have conceal carry permits are very few, the odds of these people coming across a guy like this are very low. Perhaps if there were less of a stigma on those who carry guns legally and responsibly their numbers might someday be equal to the scum that do this type of thing. I would think that the threat of being hit with criminal charges or being sued for protecting the lives of others keeps a lot of law abiding gun owners from getting involved in situations where they might have to take a life to protect someone elses they do not know.
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I have to agree with the bolded part above. I had a firearms permit here in Ga, and I finally just let it expire and quit carrying due to the hassle. I carried concealed where generally you really had to look to see I had a gun. The gun has never even left it's holster. Over the 8 years I carried I was stopped and hassled several times. I've even been shoved against the wall and searched twice by cops when someone saw the shape of the holster of caught a glimpse of the butt of the gun under my jacket and called 911 saying they thought someone was going to rob the store or some BS. All these incidents ended fine with apologies after I was finally able to give them my permit, but can you imagine what it is like to go through that in public?
That being said I don't fault the cops or 911 dispatchers (hell I'm a dispatcher). I know they have to treat every hysterical caller like it is the real thing, because the one time you don't, it will be. Just I wish the general public wasn't so damned quick to assume every gun carrier is a damn criminal or mass murderer and use common sense before calling in.
 
#38
#38
A Central Connecticut State University professor is under fire for reporting a student to police after he gave a class presentation on why concealed carry should be permitted on campus.

The student lives 20 miles off campus and maintains his gun collection in a locked safe. Police checked him out and decided no action was needed. Great moments in education, indeed.
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Gun Facts - Your Guide to Debunking Gun Control Myths

Myth: Private ownership of guns is not effective in preventing crime

Fact: Every year, people in the United States use a gun to defend themselves against criminals an estimated 2,500,000 times – more than 6,500 people a day, or once every 13 seconds. 112 - Of these instances, 15.6% of the people using a firearm defensively stated that they "almost certainly" saved their lives by doing so.

Fact: Firearms are used 60 times more often to protect lives than to take lives.

Fact: In 83.5% (2,087,500) of these successful gun defenses, the attacker either threatened or used force first, proving that guns are very well suited for self-defense.

Fact: Of the 2,500,000 times citizens use guns to defend themselves, 92% merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers.

Fact: Less than 8% of the time does a citizen wound his or her attacker, and in less than one in a thousand instances is the attacker killed.

Fact: For every accidental death, suicide, or homicide with a firearm, 10 lives are saved through defensive use.

114 Fact: When using guns in self-defense:

• 83% of robbery victims were not injured.
• 88% of assault victims were not hurt.
• 76% of all self-defense use of guns never involve firing a single shot.

Fact: After the implementation of Canada's 1977 gun controls prohibiting handgun possession for protection, the “breaking and entering” crime rate rose 25%, surpassing the American rate.

Myth: Only police should have guns

Fact: “...most criminals are more worried about meeting an armed victim than they are about running into the police.

Fact: 11% of police shootings kill an innocent person - about 2% of shootings by citizens kill an innocent person.

Fact: Police have trouble keeping their own guns. Hundreds of firearms are missing from the FBI and 449 of them have been involved in crimes. 118

Fact: People who saw the helplessness of the L.A. Police Department during the 1992 King Riots or the looting and violence in New Orleans after hurricane Katrina know that citizens need guns to defend themselves.

Myth: You are more likely to be injured or killed using a gun for self-defense

Fact: You are far more likely to survive a violent assault if you defend yourself with a gun. In episodes where a robbery victim was injured, the injury/defense rates were:119
• Resisting with a gun 6%
• Did nothing at all 25%
• Resisted with a knife 40%
• Non-violent resistance 45%
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In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control.
From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.

China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated. (similar to the 1,000,000 who died in Rwanda in the 1990s.)

Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million ‘educated’ people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century after being deprived of their gun rights: 56 million.
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1. DonÂ’t pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, heÂ’ll just kill you..

2. If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.

3. I carry a gun cause a cop is too heavy.

4. When seconds count, the cops are just minutes away.

5. A reporter did a human-interest piece on the Texas Rangers. The reporter recognized the Colt Model 1911 the Ranger was carrying and asked him ‘Why do you carry a 45?’ The Ranger responded, ‘Because they don’t make a 46.’

6. The old sheriff was attending an awards dinner when a lady commented on his wearing his sidearm. ‘Sheriff, I see you have your pistol. Are you expecting trouble?’ ‘No Ma’am. If I were expecting trouble, I would have brought my shotgun.’

7. Beware the man who only has one gun. HE PROBABLY KNOWS HOW TO USE IT!!!
 
#40
#40
UT IE 95 said:
I should have clarified it as a violent home invasion where your life is threatened.

Either way - your probably right that your chance of getting popped off at home are higher than at the grocery store. Scary.
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Not really that scary. I think most murder victims are killed by someone they know. You go the target's house to find him, not Food Lion.
 
#41
#41
UT IE 95 said:
I should have clarified it as a violent home invasion where your life is threatened.

Either way - your probably right that your chance of getting popped off at home are higher than at the grocery store. Scary.
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I would consider any invasion of my home life threatening and will act accordingly.
 
#45
#45
 
#46
#46
Is there a site that is linking to all these gun defense stories? I am just wondering how you guys are finding them.
 
#48
#48
The Administration is Not Dealing Straight With Us on Mexico's Gun Problem

excepts:

All this flies in the face of news articles published by the U.S. media in the last week or two.

Mexico's gun problems are a direct result of gun runners buying "assault weapons" in the U.S. and taking them into Mexico to arm drug cartels, says the U.S. media and government.

Drug cartels buying semi-auto AR15 or AK rifles from U.S. gun dealers is viewed as a joke by Mexico's drug cartel, most Mexicans, and unfortunately by the Mexican government.

The only people fooled by all the political rhetoric are Americans listening to the likes of Attorney General Eric Holder and other anti-gun politicians.

Everyone knows it.

Everyone in Mexico knows it.

Every law enforcement official in the U.S. knows it,

and everyone in our government knows it.

And anyone who has worked for any length of time within border cities and lived in the local community knows it.

This is taking a Mexican problem, blaming the U.S. by turning it into a crisis in order further an agenda, and Eric Holder and President Obama know it and they are taking advantage of it.

The next time you see a news report of illegal full-auto weapons and grenades being found here in the U.S., you know where they came from.

It wasn't from a gun store in Tucson or Phoenix. The administration is right that gun trafficking along the U.S./Mexico border is a problem.

Not only do we have drugs and illegal aliens coming in our southern border, but we also have military arms and explosives coming into our country illegally as well.

That's the issue and the Obama administration is being disingenuous in its argument.
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