Hedge Fund Manager Talks of Fear on Obama's Chrysler Cramdown

#27
#27
rjd970 said:
Always?

I would say greed can be good.
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Greed is right.

Greed works.

Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Greed, in all of its forms -- greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge -- has marked the upward surge of mankind.

And greed -- you mark my words -- will not only save Volnation, but that other malfunctioning corporation called the USA.
 
#28
#28
droski said:
Greed is right.

Greed works.

Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Greed, in all of its forms -- greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge -- has marked the upward surge of mankind.

And greed -- you mark my words -- will not only save Volnation, but that other malfunctioning corporation called the USA.
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But its one of the seven deadly sins.
 
#30
#30
droski said:
Greed is right.

Greed works.

Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Greed, in all of its forms -- greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge -- has marked the upward surge of mankind.

And greed -- you mark my words -- will not only save Volnation, but that other malfunctioning corporation called the USA.
Click to expand...

True. But look at the context of which Gekko was talking.

I am simply saying greed does not always have good consequences or drive righteous ambitions.
 
#31
#31
rjd970 said:
True. But look at the context of which Gekko was talking.

I am simply saying greed does not always have good consequences or drive righteous ambitions.
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But he saves me money on my car insurance!
 
#34
#34
rjd970 said:
True. But look at the context of which Gekko was talking.

I am simply saying greed does not always have good consequences or drive righteous ambitions.
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and I'm saying that greed as a descriptor for corporations or capitalism is as hackneyed as humanly possible and generally off the mark.
 
#37
#37
rjd970 said:
I agree, but what do you mean "generally off the mark"?
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I don't view the corporate world as greedy. As you know, many of those we would call greedy are simply enabled by institutional money flexing its muscle. That institutional money very often represents granny's 401k or your union shill's embezzlement / retirement account or some insurance company fighting for spread to pay its annuities, etc. etc.

This collective corporate greed we like to blame is simply not the case. Business success an end it itself in our society and often accrues to the masses.
 
#38
#38
The thing that's nuts is that many of the "evil investors" are investing people's retirement funds including those of pensions and even some union pensions. Asking them to sacrifice is not only a problem from a fiduciary responsibility standpoint, it is the government picking winners and losers. I had heard that one of the creditors (at least one) for GM handles some of the pension for school teachers in Michigan. BO is cramming down the pension of one union in favor of another union (UAW).
 
#39
#39
Like Droski has said, it is amazing that there has not been more media coverage of this. The Obama administration has been accused of threatening the secured creditors and violating the constitution.


Creditors to Chrysler describe negotiations with the company and the Obama administration as "a farce," saying the administration was bent on forcing their hands using hardball tactics and threats.

The sources, who represent creditors to Chrysler, say were taken aback by the hardball tactics that the Obama administration employed to cajole them into acquiescing to plans to restructure Chrysler. One person said described the administration as the most shocking “end justifies the means” group they have ever encountered. Another characterized Obama was “the most dangerous smooth talker on the planet- and I knew Kissinger.” Both were voters for Obama in the last election.

One participant in negotiations said that the administration’s tactic was to present what one described as a “madman theory of the presidency” in which the President is someone to be feared because he was willing to do anything to get his way. The person said this threat was taken very seriously by his firm.

White House Accused Of Chrysler Threats

Looks like we have a mob boss as president and no one cares. The mainstream media should at least be covering the accusations.
 
#40
#40
vols4sure said:
Like Droski has said, it is amazing that there has not been more media coverage of this. The Obama administration has been accused of threatening the secured creditors and violating the constitution.


Creditors to Chrysler describe negotiations with the company and the Obama administration as "a farce," saying the administration was bent on forcing their hands using hardball tactics and threats.

The sources, who represent creditors to Chrysler, say were taken aback by the hardball tactics that the Obama administration employed to cajole them into acquiescing to plans to restructure Chrysler. One person said described the administration as the most shocking “end justifies the means” group they have ever encountered. Another characterized Obama was “the most dangerous smooth talker on the planet- and I knew Kissinger.” Both were voters for Obama in the last election.

One participant in negotiations said that the administration’s tactic was to present what one described as a “madman theory of the presidency” in which the President is someone to be feared because he was willing to do anything to get his way. The person said this threat was taken very seriously by his firm.

White House Accused Of Chrysler Threats

Looks like we have a mob boss as president and no one cares. The mainstream media should at least be covering the accusations.
Click to expand...

Isn't that the "Chicago Way"?
 
#41
#41
Interesting interview on the Kudlow report with a lawyer representing the bondholders about Obama's "gangster government."

"Gangster Government" An Interview with Tom Lauria - Money and Politics Blog - CNBC.com

KUDLOW: How about this irony — I’ve got to ask you this Tom. According to the White House, “we must save the American auto industry.” But we are giving Chrysler away to an Italian car company. Do you find that ironic? Or bizarre?

LAURIA: I think it’s both. And I don’t think it has much to do with the truth.

KUDLOW: Right. What is the truth? What is the truth? Was the UAW bailed out? Is that the truth?

LAURIA: Well if you look at the numbers in terms of the dollars that the government has put into Chrysler, and you look at the dollars that are being paid out to labor-related interests — including the pension, VEBA, other benefit programs, etcetera — it’s interesting that the two amounts roughly match up. About $10 billion going in, and $10 billion going out. It seems like Chrysler is just a vehicle for the government to pay its labor friends.

KUDLOW: Is this redistribution from bondholders to union health trusts? Is that what’s going on?

LAURIA: That’s it. That’s it.
 
#42
#42
I don't think there is any doubt that we are paying unions as an interim point in the too slow death spiral of the company.
 
#43
#43
More -

KUDLOW: I mean they’re using bailout nation and TARP as their lever. That’s what they’ve done from day one. And when I read Neil Barofsky — he’s the special inspector general for TARP — and I looked around, I mean to some extent this whole TARP process has degenerated into corruption. You have a thought on that? You’re describing corruption! We are corrupting the Constitution and contract law.

LAURIA: Well I’d like somebody to point out to all of us what statutory scheme the government is acting under when it takes control of an auto manufacturer, as has happened here. TARP applies to financial institutions, and Chrysler is not a financial institution. I think we all know that. And Chrysler is not with any other regulatory scheme of the government that allows it to effectively take over the corporate governance of the company. But that has effectively happened here...
 
#44
#44
BigPapaVol said:
I don't view the corporate world as greedy. As you know, many of those we would call greedy are simply enabled by institutional money flexing its muscle. That institutional money very often represents granny's 401k or your union shill's embezzlement / retirement account or some insurance company fighting for spread to pay its annuities, etc. etc.

This collective corporate greed we like to blame is simply not the case. Business success an end it itself in our society and often accrues to the masses.
Click to expand...

I agree 100% with this.
 
#45
#45
BigPapaVol said:
I don't think there is any doubt that we are paying unions as an interim point in the too slow death spiral of the company.
Click to expand...

I know everyone realizes this that is following the situation. I just like seeing anytime this situation is actually covered.
 
#46
#46
vols4sure said:
I know everyone realizes this that is following the situation. I just like seeing anytime this situation is actually covered.
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this is the biggest story out there, but no one is talking about it. anyone saying obama doesn't get a free pass from the media clearly doesnt' know crap.
 
#47
#47
droski said:
this is the biggest story out there, but no one is talking about it. anyone saying obama doesn't get a free pass from the media clearly doesnt' know crap.
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oh yah, Obama can do no wrong according to the media. i mean he could eat a live kitten on public TV, and kick a midget and it will be the best thing since sliced bread
 
#48
#48
Administration officials reply that the Chrysler crisis required bold action. While Chrysler's suppliers, dealers and unionized workers are critical to its survival -- and so is Fiat, which will contribute high-efficiency engines and foreign distribution -- the creditors were expendable.

"You don't need banks and bondholders to make cars," said one administration official.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124199948894005017.html

:hmm:

I guess financing is no longer needed in the car industry. How dumb are these people.
 
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