If Pat Summitt were the AD, would Holly still have a job?

#26
#26
EarlVolFan said:
Let’s imagine that Pat didn’t develop dementia and pass away, but decided to retire and take the AD job after one of the many openings. Assuming she gave Holly the chance to take her place as Head Coach of the Lady Vol Basketball Team, would she have let Holly go by now?

I say yes, she would have fired her maybe two years ago.
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Most interesting you have a good point.
 
#27
#27
madtownvol said:
Lordy, how many different threads do we need that all make the same point? Perhaps, someone should start a unifying thread entitled, "how many different ways can you say Holly should be fired?"
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If you don't like the threads on out dislike for Warlick as a coach, I'm pretty sure you have the choice not to read them
 
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#28
#28
madtownvol said:
We will never know for sure but I think the championship team with Parker, Hornbuckle, Anosiki, Bobbit, and Augustus would still be a championship contender. However, that was a super team, featuring one of the all-time greats in the women's game.

However, on most possessions, the LVs are not waiting for the shot clock to wind down. It does happen on some possessions for sure but, against KY, for example, they were trying to push pace. Even in their dismal opening quarter, they had wide open shots and some lay-ups and could not hit anything.

Everyone focuses on turnovers, but this team lives and dies with their shooting percentage; at one point against, KY, they were shooting 25% from the field and were under 50% at the line. They closed much better but in that "cold" period they were getting lots of makeable shots. They had the same problems last year; Jackson is (though I hope she breaks the pattern) starting the season shooting really well and steadily got worse over conference play. Much of the team followed the same pattern. To me, that says there is some problem in the system but I think it is more on the training side than the game management side.
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For a team that is supposed to live by their shooting percentage, they sure put up an awful lot of bad shots. Waiting to shoot the ball when they are completely under the backboard. Don't even jump when they are trying to shoot a put back, no they're flat footed. Is it the talent or is it poor coaching because they continue doing it and this is year 2 for the majority of this team.
 
#29
#29
EarlVolFan said:
Let’s imagine that Pat didn’t develop dementia and pass away, but decided to retire and take the AD job after one of the many openings. Assuming she gave Holly the chance to take her place as Head Coach of the Lady Vol Basketball Team, would she have let Holly go by now?

I say yes, she would have fired her maybe two years ago.
Click to expand...

This is an absolutely stupid thread.
 
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#30
#30
EarlVolFan said:
Let’s imagine that Pat didn’t develop dementia and pass away, but decided to retire and take the AD job after one of the many openings. Assuming she gave Holly the chance to take her place as Head Coach of the Lady Vol Basketball Team, would she have let Holly go by now?

I say yes, she would have fired her maybe two years ago.
Click to expand...

A very interesting viewpoint...From the eyes that "stare"

  • She wouldn't have sat idle, or quiet like other Ad's
  • She would better understand that football is the god around here in men's sports, but, basketball is the goddess of women's sport as well. Treat them with equal fervor.
  • She would most likely give help if not seek it for CHW
  • She would care about what "we" the LV BB fans, were feeling
  • She would have waited and judged the quality of work upon CHW's first or second season as a coach with her own staff and players.
  • She would be able to admit, there is a lack of vision in this org
  • She would have given Coach Jumper a summer-chance to show what he could do, if not for the simple sake that she shook his hand 23 years ago.
 
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#31
#31
allenfan1 said:
If you don't like the threads on out dislike for Warlick as a coach, I'm pretty sure you have the choice not to read them
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You know that logic cuts both ways; if ya don't like me pointing that we really don't need an endless array of NEW threads making the same point as existing ones, then I am pretty sure you have a choice not to read my comment.

But every new posters seems to believe that he/she has the one new angle on the coaching issue that will somehow precipitate a tidal wave of action. Hey, what if alien visitors came to earth and watched the LVs, would Holly have a job? (I bet nobody's thought of that; this will get Fulmer's attention for sure).

No, wait, what if Holly ....
 
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#32
#32
I wasn’t trying to join the chorus of voices speaking out about the state of the program in Holly’s tenure. I was just trying to make a point, from those of us who knew Pat. If making Holly her successor was her wish, would she be pleased with what has transpired with Lady Vol basketball since she gave up coaching the team?

There’s a legacy at stake here and I’m afraid that it’s being chipped away at, first by Dave Hart’s belligerence and now by Holly’s coaching malpractice. Average attendance has dropped by 5,000 since she took over the team - from 13,000 to 8,000. How much more does it need to drop before someone does something about it?

madtownvol said:
You know that logic cuts both ways; if ya don't like me pointing that we really don't need an endless array of NEW threads making the same point as existing ones, then I am pretty sure you have a choice not to read my comment.

But every new posters seems to believe that he/she has the one new angle on the issues that will somehow precipitate a title wave of action. Hey, what if alien visitors came to earth and watched the LVs, would Holly have a job? (I bet nobody's thought of that; this will get Fulmer's attention for sure).

No, wait, what if Holly ....
Click to expand...
 
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#33
#33
Coach Jumper said:
A very interesting viewpoint...From the eyes that "stare"

  • She wouldn't have sat idle, or quiet like other Ad's
  • She would better understand that football is the god around here in men's sports, but, basketball is the goddess of women's sport as well. Treat them with equal fervor.
  • She would most likely give help if not seek it for CHW
  • She would care about what "we" the LV BB fans, were feeling
  • She would have waited and judged the quality of work upon CHW's first or second season as a coach with her own staff and players.
  • She would be able to admit, there is a lack of vision in this org
  • She would have given Coach Jumper a summer-chance to show what he could do, if not for the simple sake that she shook his hand 23 years ago.
Click to expand...

Mind Reading is certainly a valuable skill to possess.
 
#34
#34
EarlVolFan said:
I wasn’t trying to join the chorus of voices speaking out about the state of the program in Holly’s tenure. I was just trying to make a point, from those of us who knew Pat. If making Holly her successor was her wish, would she be pleased with what has transpired with Lady Vol basketball since she gave up coaching the team?

There’s a legacy at stake here and I’m afraid that it’s being chipped away at, first by Dave Hart’s belligerence and now by Holly’s coaching malpractice. Average attendance has dropped by 5,000 since she took over the team - from 13,000 to 8,000. How much more does it need to drop before someone does something about it?
Click to expand...

A couple of things. Pat Summitt's legacy is her legacy. Have you ever heard anyone say, "Hey, john Wooden wasn't so great cause UCLA stopped winnnig NCs after he retired?" So bringing Pat Summitt into the equation, and trying to guess what she might have thought, strikes me as being a bit much. Pat is unfortunately no longer with us and that sadly is that.

But we all know that attendance has declined; that the LVs have not been back to a final four since CP3 graduated (over a decade ago); that the LVs are not the national contenders that they once were; So, what new information have you provided?
 
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#36
#36
Grudenhaslanded said:
If pat were still coach, her results would be the same as Holly’s. Pat benefited from lack of competion.
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That is an unnessary dis to Pat to a question which will never be answered. Pat did what it took to win, she was simply ahead of her times in the recruiting game. Holly recruits well, except for the donut recruiting season, Pat knew what to do with her recruits, Holly appears to be clueless.
 
#37
#37
Wooden didn’t pick his successor, I believe. He also wasn’t the only person to have coached UCLA before he retired.

They’re playing on a court with her name on it. It’s time to honor the legacy that she left by playing the brand of basketball that she would have been proud of.

madtownvol said:
A couple of things. Pat Summitt's legacy is her legacy. Have you ever heard anyone say, "Hey, john Wooden wasn't so great cause UCLA stopped winnnig NCs after he retired?" So bringing Pat Summitt into the equation, and trying to guess what she might have thought, strikes me as being a bit much. Pat is unfortunately no longer with us and that sadly is that.

But we all know that attendance has declined; that the LVs have not been back to a final four since CP3 graduated (over a decade ago); that the LVs are not the national contenders that they once were; So, what new information have you provided?
Click to expand...
 
#39
#39
savannahfan said:
Just a thought, does Holly recruit wel,l or does "The LadyVols" recruit itself? If this is true, at some point this will fade away, but for now, I think it still carries real importance with some of these girls. Now add a firebrand good coach, preferably a woman, then I think we will see the "teams of old".
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You actually rite about recruit.
 
#41
#41
I think it's more about the program and the direction it's headed. Time to stop the slide. That being said I am just a fan and choose too suffer thru each and every game I can attend or watch. Hope change is coming but will be there regardless.
 
#45
#45
Coach Jumper said:
A very interesting viewpoint...From the eyes that "stare"

  • She wouldn't have sat idle, or quiet like other Ad's
  • She would better understand that football is the god around here in men's sports, but, basketball is the goddess of women's sport as well. Treat them with equal fervor.
  • She would most likely give help if not seek it for CHW
  • She would care about what "we" the LV BB fans, were feeling
  • She would have waited and judged the quality of work upon CHW's first or second season as a coach with her own staff and players.
  • She would be able to admit, there is a lack of vision in this org
  • She would have given Coach Jumper a summer-chance to show what he could do, if not for the simple sake that she shook his hand 23 years ago.
Click to expand...
Well, 6 out of 7 is still pretty good.
 
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#46
#46
VOLPAT said:
Pat Summitt played a very tough schedule throughout her career. I will have to respectfully disagree with your assumption. She had the competition but was just a better coach.
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This needs to be repeated. There is too much history that Pat made to let THE LADY VOLS slip into obscurity. Why was the fan base so upset losing " Lady Vols?" It wasn't because they don't care if they win or lose!
 
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#47
#47
allenfan1 said:
If you don't like the threads on out dislike for Warlick as a coach, I'm pretty sure you have the choice not to read them
Click to expand...

Stop it...

1urgep.jpg
 
#48
#48
EarlVolFan said:
Wooden didn’t pick his successor, I believe. He also wasn’t the only person to have coached UCLA before he retired.

They’re playing on a court with her name on it. It’s time to honor the legacy that she left by playing the brand of basketball that she would have been proud of.
Click to expand...


So? As long as 8 championship banners are hanging in the rafters, Pat Summitt's legacy will be just fine. Was her legacy diminished by losing in the first round of the NCAA play-offs to Ball State or not making the Final Four in her last 5 years as Head coach. Not one bit; her legacy was set by a remarkable career that included more than just winning. Any fan of the program wants to see the team playing better and being an NC contender again. But, linking this to CPS's legacy is just silly, particularly when you consider what her main cause was toward the end of her life. Her legacy is bigger than basketball.
 
#49
#49
From a reliable source:

"Pat was basically fired and Hart chose Holly, not Pat. Pat asked for another year so that she could coach with her son, as a graduate assistant, but Hart said no. Pat was completely supportive of Holly, but in actuality, Hart made the choice, not Pat. It is revisionist history to think that Pat had any say so in her successor. Hart told Pat that she could be the emeritus coach and Pat felt that with her illness, she could not "demand" anything."

So all the people who say Pat Summitt wanted Holly to replace her, be informed.

Pat was fired and Hart was the one who made the decision. What was Pat to do? Stab her friend in the back? No way.
 
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#50
#50
Wow. Would love to know those names. I had thought for years that Holly was chosen by Pat. Why divulge this information now? Why not earlier?
 
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