J.P. Prince

#76
#76
TennNC said:
Has Prince saluting EVER hurt the team? Has that specific act resulted in a basket for the other team?

Show me some tape to refute it, but as I see it, he actually does get back on defense. It's his intensity when he's in the stance that is lacking, and IMO, has nothing at all to do with how excited he gets to make a great play on the other end.
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that specific act is simply an indicator of a lack of focus or need for attention. Team oriented folks don't need individual attention. That comes from actual quality play.

Coaches that win end that garbage early. Whistle blows, you play ball. Clock stops, act as stupid as you want, just don't let me see it and don't let me find out about it if it impacts our team.
 
#77
#77
TennNC said:
UNLV lost another title b/c they underestimated Duke and specifically K's ability to put together a magnificent game plan. Not b/c they were expressive.

You can't change a tiger's stripes. Put the reigns on LJ, Anthony, Hunt, etc., and they wouldn't play to their potential.
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Don't be ridiculous. UNLV got beat because they didn't show up to play. They were all about their press clippings and not about killing Duke.

No gameplan on earth overcomes that kind of talent gap. If that UNLV team had clamped down defensively as they were capable of, Duke couldn't have scored 50.

K is my favorite coach in the land and I'm not even that absurd of a homer.
 
#78
#78
I know ppl can't stand him, but the man at least crashes the board. He is a good passer and drives hard to the basket and finishes well. Has improved his FT shooting and defensively he's alright. Also, a lot of players make dumb plays, but at least he hasn't had pulled a JaJuan on us yet. The team b-ball IQ isn't very high (besides Ty Smith).
 
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#79
#79
TennNC said:
Has Prince saluting EVER hurt the team? Has that specific act resulted in a basket for the other team?

Show me some tape to refute it, but as I see it, he actually does get back on defense. It's his intensity when he's in the stance that is lacking, and IMO, has nothing at all to do with how excited he gets to make a great play on the other end.
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I think he could be more productive. Against Vandy at home he took off downcourt on a 3 by his man and the long rebound came right back to the shooter who merely dribbled in for a short easy 2. Had he bodied up he would have had an easy rebound and with a good dribble move would have cleared the defender for an easy path to the dunk he was trying to get with the snowbird approach.

Yesterday one of his layins rattled around and he just stood beyond the endline and watched it rattle around. Then when it went in he spent several more seconds in place doing his self promotion thing. Enough time went by after the shot that he should have been past midcourt on defense by then.

I got more examples if you want them.
 
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#80
#80
BigPapaVol said:
Don't be ridiculous. UNLV got beat because they didn't show up to play. They were all about their press clippings and not about killing Duke.

No gameplan on earth overcomes that kind of talent gap. If that UNLV team had clamped down defensively as they were capable of, Duke couldn't have scored 50.
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All that said, were it not for the worst charging call in the history of the Final Four, Greg Anthony never fouls out and Vegas wins by 10.
 
#81
#81
ZZ13 said:
I got more examples if you want them.
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I'd certainly like more than 2. Also: to what end did that second one hurt the team in any shape or form?

But yes, please cite more examples, 2 doesn't seem all that significant.
 
#82
#82
lidderer said:
I'd certainly like more than 2. Also: to what end did that second one hurt the team in any shape or form?

But yes, please cite more examples, 2 doesn't seem all that significant.
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His own coach has said he can do more. In the post game after either UGa or Vandy (I'd have to check the tape to get the game right) Pearl said Prince can do anything he wants out there and chooses not to at times. Pearl went on to say that he's discussed that several times with Prince's father.

Do his actions, or lack of actions technically hurt the team? Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't directly. I simply believe he can do more if he focused on it. I think he wastes time on unnecessary "expression".

That said, my son loves him.
 
#83
#83
Part of the reason I like Prince is that I'm from Memphis, and so is he. The other main reason is that I think he's great. I see alot of his cousin's tendancies in him. I think that he has the highest ceiling of anybody on our team.
I also believe that people severely underestimate his defense. JP has played in 3 fewer games than the regular players, due to injury. In his fewer games, he still has the most steals of anybody, beating out Maze by 6. He's also 3rd on the team in assists and 4th in rebounds. He even has the highest FG% on the team.
In SEC play he still leads the team in FG%, but also assists, steals, blocks, and assist to turnover ratio.
 
#84
#84
crusse10 said:
Part of the reason I like Prince is that I'm from Memphis, and so is he. The other main reason is that I think he's great. I see alot of his cousin's tendancies in him. I think that he has the highest ceiling of anybody on our team.
I also believe that people severely underestimate his defense. JP has played in 3 fewer games than the regular players, due to injury. In his fewer games, he still has the most steals of anybody, beating out Maze by 6. He's also 3rd on the team in assists and 4th in rebounds. He even has the highest FG% on the team.
In SEC play he still leads the team in FG%, but also assists, steals, blocks, and assist to turnover ratio.
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He leads in FG% because he isn't allowed to shoot it outside of 5 feet...

I went to high school with JP. The guy has plenty of potential but he is far too cocky. His head will keep him from ever being great.
 
#85
#85
The saluting doesn't exactly hurt the team, except when he's too busy celebrating and showing off that he doesn't run the court to get on defense.

The saluting and crap isn't needed while the game is going on. If it goes to a commercial break or a time out or somemthing, then go for it, do whatever. But while the game is going on=no.
 
#86
#86
And like clockwork, thread gets an inevitable bump again after an incredible performance. Doubtless we can find something else to jibe him for and negate all this great play....how about that wry smile of his?

That wry smile of his is costly.
 
#87
#87
I didn't like his 14 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 steals..
 
#89
#89
lidderer said:
they were costly, each one of them
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Me next!! He turned the ball over on a BONEHEAD play while we were up by 20 with 4 minutes to play last night, Pearl should bench him for the rest of the tourney to send a message to him and the rest of the team, what a joke!
 
#90
#90
OWB said:
I didn't like his 14 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 steals..
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And I think his early steal and breakaway layin set the tone for the game. If JP can rebound like that and have that overall game, then we can be successful.
 
#91
#91
lidderer said:
And like clockwork, thread gets an inevitable bump again after an incredible performance. Doubtless we can find something else to jibe him for and negate all this great play....how about that wry smile of his?

That wry smile of his is costly.
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You can bump it every time he has a good performance if you want to. He is still inconsistent, and you questioned his consistency in your first post. Hell, if he was consistent the thread wouldn't need to be bumped.

Yes he had a good performance. Does he still have what I have seen described as "cherry picking runouts?" Yes, tons. Is he out of position multiple times every game allowing for much easier offensive rebounds from the opposing team. Yes, last night that was glaring on more than one occasion. Does he still insist on taking jump shots even though he, and everyone else in the gym knows that it's every bit as good as a turnover? Yep, that too.

Point being, he may have good performances, but in the end he is still not a smart basketball player.
 
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#92
#92
OWB said:
I didn't like his 14 points, 10 rebounds, 5 assists and 3 steals..
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exactly my point ,,,,, put him down but very few players are great all the time, I don't see him in the NBA, but I like him on our team.
 
#93
#93
Oldblood said:
And I think his early steal and breakaway layin set the tone for the game. If JP can rebound like that and have that overall game, then we can be successful.
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As long as he stops the cherry picking I'll agree. It's going to be hard to continue to rebound like that when he is standing at half-court or beyond when the opposition still has possession.
 
#94
#94
Tampavolz said:
exactly my point ,,,,, put him down but very few players are great all the time, I don't see him in the NBA, but I like him on our team.
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None of his critics expect him to be great all the time. Decent all the time with fewer mistakes is all I am looking for. Consistency is a wonderful thing.
 
#95
#95
emainvol said:
None of his critics expect him to be great all the time. Decent all the time with fewer mistakes is all I am looking for. Consistency is a wonderful thing.
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I can live with inconsistency if he'll hustle and stop all the look at me garbage. It's one of the reasons he and Chism underperform so often.
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#96
#96
emainvol said:
You can bump it every time he has a good performance if you want to. He is still inconsistent, and you questioned his consistency in your first post. Hell, if he was consistent the thread wouldn't need to be bumped.

Yes he had a good performance. Does he still have what I have seen described as "cherry picking runouts?" Yes, tons. Is he out of position multiple times every game allowing for much easier offensive rebounds from the opposing team. Yes, last night that was glaring on more than one occasion. Does he still insist on taking jump shots even though he, and everyone else in the gym knows that it's every bit as good as a turnover? Yep, that too.

Point being, he may have good performances, but in the end he is still not a smart basketball player.
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I'm not sure I even disagree with much of this--like you said, I mentioned that in the first post--but his production has been steady enough for me to be impressed with him overall, and he certainly stands as our 3rd best player right now--which may reflect poorly on our team overall, but that is all we're discussing here: his worth on our team overall.

We disagree on this 'cherry picking' thing in terms of its importance, as I tend to believe the net worth of those easily made baskets essentially cancel out the negativity. I know BPV chides him for his put-backs, but I don't understand how that's a bad thing.

Thread was started because like every 2nd mention of Prince was about how awful he is, and how people wanted him benched, and yadda yadda. That's a patently ridiculous claim given the rest of our roster. Thread aims to refute that.

Consistency is somewhat of an issue, but it's really been no different than the rest of our squad(we can do a player-by-player examination of this if you'd like, but I think we both know what we'd find).
 
#97
#97
lidderer said:
Consistency is somewhat of an issue, but it's really been no different than the rest of our squad(we can do a player-by-player examination of this if you'd like, but I think we both know what we'd find).
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I am not arguing that there are many consistent players on the team. However, Prince's faults just seem much more glaring. That probably has a lot to do with the fact that when he does screw up (and no one can really argue that it doesn't happen at least once or twice every game) it is something incredibly stupid. Seriously, like something you would see a middle school bench player do.
 
#98
#98
lidderer said:
And like clockwork, thread gets an inevitable bump again after an incredible performance. Doubtless we can find something else to jibe him for and negate all this great play....how about that wry smile of his?

That wry smile of his is costly.
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Bump
 
#100
#100
although i'll be honest, when the guy gets 9 points, and 6 assists and 1 steal, and 6 TOs, and it's generally acknowledged that it's his worst game, well I'll take that in a heartbeat given the frequency of the good.
 
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