Legitimate Question about Pat Summitt

[ladyvols1]

Pat needed to go. Having her stand there on the sidelines looking blankly into space was extremely distressing. There was no other decision to be made, regardless of who made it. You don't let people with Alzheimer's do things on "their terms," as their terms generally embarrass themselves and everyone else. The end of Pat's career was and is tragic. There was no good solution. The woman that is making a lawsuit out of all of this has major issues in my book.

Yes, she does. She has issues because she was fired due to loyalty to Pat Summitt, her age and the fact that she is a female. Pat Summitt supports Debbie Jennings and so do I.
:aggressive:

 

[tnlizard]

Volnation who start most post now are presently nothing more than a mass of conflicting impulses.:lolabove:

 

[vol66]

She has dementia. When my father-in-law first came down with dementia, he abruptly became convinced that his (70 year old) wife was carrying on affairs behind his back and that his children were trying to steal his money. Paranoia is a standard enough symptom that that's how his dementia was originally diagnosed.

There's no way to know what was said, or what Hart thought he was saying, but sadly it's very easy to see how Summitt might have walked out of a meeting with the AD feeling like she was being pushed out against her will.

It makes me very sad to see her signature at the bottom of an affidavit that was clearly crafted to embarrass UT and force a settlement in the lawsuit, by spelling out the initial "misunderstanding" in loving detail but then completely leaving out what the misunderstanding supposedly was. Lawyers can be detestable.

I assume, which I know is dangerous, that you mean because she has EOD that she might have not understood or misinterpreted that meeting.

My point is this, if I'm Dave Hart there is somebody else, like maybe Tyler and or someone from HR, or Cheek or somebody that is also there for the meeting. He should not have left anything to chance given the situation. Maybe there was a third party we don't know. Yes I realize that would be unusual, but it's an unusual situation.

Of course, it's all together possible this could have been avoided had he just waited until the Lady Vols had finished the tourney and allowed Coach to initiate the process. JMO

 

[vollygirl]

I'm not sure I would rather "coach" my last game and then find out after it was over, that it was my last game.

 

[Slydell]

I assume, which I know is dangerous, that you mean because she has EOD that she might have not understood or misinterpreted that meeting.

My point is this, if I'm Dave Hart there is somebody else, like maybe Tyler and or someone from HR, or Cheek or somebody that is also there for the meeting. He should not have left anything to chance given the situation. Maybe there was a third party we don't know. Yes I realize that would be unusual, but it's an unusual situation.

Of course, it's all together possible this could have been avoided had he just waited until the Lady Vols had finished the tourney and allowed Coach to initiate the process. JMO

There had to have been a third party there. In something this big, I can't believe otherwise.

 

[soda23]

I agree that it's a little premature and understand the premise of your post. Still...this is Pat Summitt and how in the world she could walk out of a meeting thinking she's now in a new role and misinterpret the discussion shouldn't happen. It is absurd that an AD would mess that up.

I think you are right on how UT will spin this, but they better be ready for how Jennings is going to spin it...

Not that it matters because this is already lose, lose for Hart, UT and Summitt.

If you had a parent or someone close to you that suffered with dementia , you would completely understand how that could happen

 

[Slydell]

Has not been established that she misinterpreted anything at this point.

 

[vol66]

If you had a parent or someone close to you that suffered with dementia , you would completely understand how that could happen

I did, my grandmother. She ended up living with me which was a blessing. Even after she needed 24 hour care and had to move to a nursing home and she didn't recognize me or anyone close to her and could no longer speak...I get it, I do.

This is not that. This appears, on it's surface, w/o the inside info, or being privy to the details, or Hart and UT making a statement... a huge bungle on Hart's part.

I haven't been a poster calling for a firing of this person or that. In fact, I've been in Hart's corner...I've changed my mind and I'll be willing to listen to what he has to say, but...it's hard to trust a guy that would lie about the logo crap and he did do that.

 

[Mav145]

I haven't followed this situation too closely but isn't she still involved with the Lady Vols? How can you still have a title and a office and be forced out?

 

[Chitownvol1129]

I haven't followed this situation too closely but isn't she still involved with the Lady Vols? How can you still have a title and a office and be forced out?

Forced out of being the coach, and into an honorary position, a good will position with absolutely no official power or duties. Big time difference. If you are not driving the bus, you are a passenger. Pat was told she is no longer driving the bus, go sit in the back and look pretty.

 

[Chitownvol1129]

You can make the argument that it would have effected recruiting negitively if Pat stayed. However, it could of gone the other way on recruiting too. Last team of the Best. One more glorious team. What is certain, is Pat built women's basketball, she has been the face of it, for many years the only honorable aspect of UT sports has been Pat. She is bigger than the actual sport of college basketball. She deserved to go out with honor and when she, her doctors, and her friends and family said now. If she wanted to coach one more year and tell everyone it would be her last, and not win 1 game, she deserved that right. And honestly, it would have been another feather in the Lady Vol cap as a class move, and a move of a champion atheletic department. It would of cost the University no money in revenue, we would of sold out every game here, and away. Recruits will still flock to TN and honestly, after that kind of sportsmanship, and honor, more so then they will now. It was a dumb move, by a man that doesn't understand honor or tradition.

 

[soda23]

Forced out of being the coach, and into an honorary position, a good will position with absolutely no official power or duties. Big time difference. If you are not driving the bus, you are a passenger. Pat was told she is no longer driving the bus, go sit in the back and look pretty.

Please , Pat wasn't driving the bus last year , she was sitting on the bench while Holly coached and it was anything but pretty .

 

[Arclight]

Please , Pat wasn't driving the bus last year , she was sitting on the bench while Holly coached and it was anything but pretty .

Correct!

When will the hillbilly UT Admin start hiring real competitive coaches. The football coach is a sub-trainee. The women's bball coach is about exciting as a loaf of days old bread.

Time to clean house and come out of '60s. Pay the $ and get some talent. We continue to sink......

 

[soda23]

I did, my grandmother. She ended up living with me which was a blessing. Even after she needed 24 hour care and had to move to a nursing home and she didn't recognize me or anyone close to her and could no longer speak...I get it, I do.

This is not that. This appears, on it's surface, w/o the inside info, or being privy to the details, or Hart and UT making a statement... a huge bungle on Hart's part.

I haven't been a poster calling for a firing of this person or that. In fact, I've been in Hart's corner...I've changed my mind and I'll be willing to listen to what he has to say, but...it's hard to trust a guy that would lie about the logo crap and he did do that.

Then you of all people should know this could easily happen

Still...this is Pat Summitt and how in the world she could walk out of a meeting thinking she's now in a new role and misinterpret the discussion shouldn't happen. It is absurd that an AD would mess that up.

Maybe the AD didn't mess it up

 

[vol66]

Then you of all people should know this could easily happen

Still...this is Pat Summitt and how in the world she could walk out of a meeting thinking she's now in a new role and misinterpret the discussion shouldn't happen. It is absurd that an AD would mess that up.

Maybe the AD didn't mess it up

If there was not a third party in the room for the first meeting, then yes the AD messed up. I haven't stated that Pat's condition might not cause her to misinterpret something, not that I really believe it. Maybe there was a third party and UT will play the card later. If not...


Some people here think Jennings is using Pat and her condition for her advantage in reaching a settlement. That could be correct.

It could also be that Hart is doing the same. That it happened as Pat said it did and when confronted by Jennings, Hart called CPS to another meeting and told her she misinterpreted what he said, using her condition against her. That could be correct.

The truth is it really doesn't matter because UT can't win in this now. If they use Pat's condition against her or worse, put her on the stand and have their lawyers humiliate her, they will lose in the court of public opinion which will matter more than giving into Jenning's demands.

Notice nowhere am I calling for anybodys head here. Hart was in a tough position as is Warlick. Because of Summitt's status and her condition I think it's fair to say it was an unprecedented situation and I would hope the AD and the Admin. would have been sensitive to it. Maybe they were, I certainly don't know.

 

[zydane47]

So I've noticed that everyone keeps saying that Pat Summitt should have been able to go out on her own terms. If we are to assume she would retire at the end of the year wouldn't Dave Hart had been aware of this? Why would he then "force" her out? That makes no sense at all for him to do that.

Also here's something I've not seen mentioned, how do we know if Tyler didn't go to Hart asking him maybe nudge his mom towards retirement. For all we know Pat might have been leaning towards coming back and isn't it possible Tyler might have wanted her to rest and relax with her condition?

 

[soda23]

So I've noticed that everyone keeps saying that Pat Summitt should have been able to go out on her own terms. If we are to assume she would retire at the end of the year wouldn't Dave Hart had been aware of this? Why would he then "force" her out? That makes no sense at all for him to do that.

Also here's something I've not seen mentioned, how do we know if Tyler didn't go to Hart asking him maybe nudge his mom towards retirement. For all we know Pat might have been leaning towards coming back and isn't it possible Tyler might have wanted her to rest and relax with her condition?

You know that could very possily be true . I can definatly see Pat not being able to how bad her condition really is and that retirement would be the best scenario for all involved . I can also see Tyleer talking to Hart and just not being able to get through to Pat or just not being able to tell her . Lord knows I have had a difficult time with my own mother in both strugling on how to tell her things and what to tell her.

 

[Voluble2]

AND...if he fabricated e-mails after Jennings "retired"...well, that would be a big no-no.

I must have missed that allegation in the suit that Jennings filed. She claimed they denied her access to her e-mails which is standard practice in a termination. UT then reinstated limited access to her computer so she could send some pictures of a player to some news outlet that UT had agreed to supply with the pictures. UT took the step of making sure her e-mail folders were not available on her computer when that occurred. All of that is just textbook termination procedure and is not in the least suspicious.

It would be highly unusual for an organization like UT to not have a central e-mail server that would keep copies of all correspondence created by its employees. If Jennings had an .edu e-mail address then I would assume there are copies of everything on the server and it has all been documented. If she was keeping work e-mails on another account and they were solely on her work computer then I am certain that would be a policy infraction on her part if UT is competently run in this regard.

If Hart attempted to fabricate e-mails then he will be caught and punished. I have read the correspondence from all parties and judging by the number of grammatical errors alone I would say none of them are up to fabricating even the text of an e-mail let alone accessing the server and creating the timestamps etc... Just the number of people it would require to do something like that would make it inconceivable and if anyone made a half-assed attempt it would be readily apparent.

If Hart can pull all of that off then he is frickin' James Bond and he will have a hacked copy of Saban's playbook ready for the Bama game.

 

[vol66]

I must have missed that allegation in the suit that Jennings filed.

Well, I either read it or heard it, definitely can't prove it. She (Jennings) says there are e-mails she never recieved and /or that were deleted. I wish it would go away.

JMO/GBO!

 

[vol66]

Voluble2, the allegation is on page 37, paragraph 202 of the amended complaint. The e-mail has an April----2012 date and Jennings says she'd never seen the e-mail before it was released to the public by UT.

Just didn't want folks thinking I made it up out of thin air. GBO!

 

[LVfan8]

Legitimate Question and please don't attack me for asking the question.

If Pat Summitt was forced out of actually being the head coach of the Lady Vols by Dave Hart and/or the University, do you agree or disagree with the move considering that Pat Summitt was diagnosed with Alzheimer's/Dementia?

Please explain your rationale.[