Lou's article

#76
#76
T_Vol376 said:
To be fair... you weren’t there and didn’t see what went on. I know there are two sides to every story, but some seem quick to say “it was in Lou’s head.” She may have had some insecurities, but she also may have been slighted.
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Before people start coming down on Lou like she transferred or something, I think the fact that she is a foreign student can't be ignored. There's a lot of stuff that we take for granted in communication with other Americans that others find unusual. Even the "what kind of player are you" question...maybe those who are familiar with the American way of interviewing might know that's basically the "what are your strengths and weaknesses?", and there's a big difference in how one would answer "what kind of player are you" vs. "what kind of player do you see yourself as?"

Like I said in my first post about this, I think it was just bad bi-directional communication and the relationship between player/coaching never solidified. No villains here, so it's too bad that people here are starting to rain down on Lou.
 
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#77
#77
Amb3096 said:
Before people start coming down on Lou like she transferred or something, I think the fact that she is a foreign student can't be ignored. There's a lot of stuff that we take for granted in communication with other Americans that others find unusual. Even the "what kind of player are you" question...maybe those who are familiar with the American way of interviewing might know that's basically the "what are your strengths and weaknesses?", and there's a big difference in how one would answer "what kind of player are you" vs. "what kind of player do you see yourself as?"

Like I said in my first post about this, I think it was just bad bi-directional communication and the relationship between player/coaching never solidified. No villains here, so it's too bad that people here are starting to rain down on Lou.
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Agree - don’t care for how some are putting this all on Lou. Could have been a misunderstanding like you said - and the fact Lou is not American very well could play into it.
 
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#78
#78
T_Vol376 said:
Agree - don’t care for now some are putting this all on Lou. Could have been a misunderstanding like you said - and the fact is is not American very well could play into it.
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To be fair. The words came out of her mouth. Could have very easily avoided saying anything negative. Not like it’s accomplishing anything at this point. Loved watching Lou play and she is a LVFL. But when the words roll out of your mouth, you alone are responsible for them.
 
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#80
#80
VolBall09 said:
To be fair. The words came out of her mouth. Could have very easily avoided saying anything negative. Not like it’s accomplishing anything at this point. Loved watching Lou play and she is a LVFL. But when the words roll out of your mouth, you alone are responsible for them.
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I guess she can say what she wants. Some are perceiving that her feelings are all on her without any reason. That may or may not be the case. We weren’t there.
 
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#81
#81
This one sure grew wings!

A very close relative (with a security clearance) went to his bank and transferred some money from some job-connected financial institution (those of you in finances could better explain such entities) into his bank account. Turns out that the sponsoring institution had apparently kited, or even written a bad check. Next day he arrived at the gate and was literally taken into custody “until the matter could be resolved.” There was about a forty-eight hour wait (time off) until the proper authorities could assure that, yes, the funds were available on their end and that he truly did not attempt to deposit bad money. So, a “minor misunderstanding.”

I was once “let go” from a job ...well, ‘cept nobody bothered to tell me until I arrived at work on Monday to meet the man who had replaced me over the weekend. Days later (I had to cool off) I confronted my (former) boss and listened to the lamest story ever. It was a job I hadn’t asked for, nor very much wanted, but I was still upset about the “handling” of things. Oh well.

Has this been poorly handled? If so, we don’t know by whom, and we would normally chalk it up to yet another misunderstanding. Of course, there was a burgeoning pandemic, lotsa folks scattering near and far. But, did our beloved Lou Brown actually leave with no more than a text? Could our beloved Coach Kellie really not find sufficient time to humbly thank the departing player?

One source could be Kamera Harris. Did she leave under similar circumstances? If so, did our coach contact her with at least a video chat? Even my grandsons can do those.

I wish the boss/resource officer/whomever could have pulled the relative to the side and explained that there was some confusion ...”go home until we can get to the bottom of this.” But, rather, there were “officials” on site. A very unnecessary, and humiliating turn of events.

I never felt that Coach Kellie threw in the towel on this most-extraordinary 2019-‘20 season. If so, Lou Brown would have seen only token playing time. And as mentioned, ready or not, Emily would have likely played much more.

We know Coach Kellie’s motto: “I don’t do drama.” Lou doesn’t appear self-piteous, but surely she’s hurt. The inescapable fact is that Lou and Kellie, and likely, Kamera should get together and straighten this out. Or (geographic and pandemic restrictions considered) just pick up the phone and deal with it. I don’t think a call to the ex-player would be much of a stoop, nor would it violate the No Drama clause.

And, no good can come from ignoring it.
 
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#84
#84
Amb3096 said:
This. It's out there, and combined with Massengill's "I gave her a chance", this is not a good look for recruiting. Kellie needs to nip this in the bud and do some damage control.
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It’s crazy because we see the other lady vols and their mothers praise Kellie and her coaching staff. It’s not a good look I agree but if prospective recruits talk to somebody Jordan or Tamari what would they think? Hopefully they hear good things.

Massengill was the perplexing one. We saw her grow and succeed in Kellie’s system so the departure does look puzzling and not a good look. But then we see all her friends go to Kentucky and let’s be honest maybe they just wanted to reunite and a plan may have been in the works to play together. I don’t know and it’s weird she left the coaching staff with positive reviews.

Lou’s comments make me upset don’t get me wrong and I hope all the coaches take note and make it right.

This could totally be used against Kellie in recruiting but if coaches like Matthew Mitchell and other coaches bounced back from some of their botches I’m certain Kellie can bounce back from this 😃
 
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#85
#85
Wow, there are so many different aspects that can be addressed about this article, I just hope that this is not even remotely the case with our current coaching staff. It is said that perception is reality, but Coach Harper deserves to be heard and deserves the benefit of the doubt. As someone who has taken over from a previous coach were nothing that existed before you got there has your hand print on it, is enough to give the most experienced coaches fits for life. But here is what I learned. 1. When you take the job, you take the athletes, the staff, the fans, the good, the bad, and the idk's, they all belong to you the instant you take over. Nothing is no longer the previous coach's this or that, that luxury belongs to the fans and commentators, people will only accept a new coach saying that for so long. 2. No matter who or what plan you bring into your new situation, you will have to adjust it in some way if you want to be successful in the now and in the future. when I say successful in the now, I am not talking about wins and loses on the court, I am talking about winning the minds, hearts, and relationships of your new and soon to be current players. Players already know a new coach will be different, what they want to know is does this new coach care about their role, career, and commitment to the program. Players will accept a change in their role if it comes from a truthful and caring place. How a new coach interacts and coaches their new players will tell the youngers and future players what to expect. An unhappy or bitter athlete who turns their attention to a coaching staff or a program can do damage on the recruiting rounds. 3. Never coach your new team like the previous coaches team or like the new team that is not quite yours. Coach the team like your team 5 years into the future, in other words, get in their faces, let them know you see the good, and the bad, let them know you hold them to a new and higher standard both on and off the court. Let me be absolutely clear, none of this is a knock at our present coaching staff, this is just what l have learned from my experience. And yes, you can be tough on athletes in 2020 and still care about those very same athletes, just go back two coaches ago for greatest example ever, CPS;);)
 
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#86
#86
Amb3096 said:
This. It's out there, and combined with Massengill's "I gave her a chance", this is not a good look for recruiting. Kellie needs to nip this in the bud and do some damage control.
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And I know some disagree, but I would still argue at the very least the optics of losing out on the sister of one of your players are not good...
 
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#87
#87
VA_VOLFAN said:
It’s crazy because we see the other lady vols and their mothers praise Kellie and her coaching staff. It’s not a good look I agree but if prospective recruits talk to somebody Jordan or Tamari what would they think? Hopefully they hear good things.

Massengill was the perplexing one. We saw her grow and succeed in Kellie’s system so the departure does look puzzling and not a good look. But then we see all her friends go to Kentucky and let’s be honest maybe they just wanted to reunite and a plan may have been in the works to play together. I don’t know and it’s weird she left the coaching staff with positive reviews.

Lou’s comments make me upset don’t get me wrong and I hope all the coaches take note and make it right.

This could totally be used against Kellie in recruiting but if coaches like Matthew Mitchell and other coaches bounced back from some of their botches I’m certain Kellie can bounce back from this 😃
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Truthfully, Jazmine and Lou aired their grievances rather diplomatically. They say they respected the coaching staff and all, but it's not hard to read between the lines and see that they weren't happy. Jaz is a perfect example. She could have easily just said, "I wanted to play with my friends", but she included the line about the coaching change and giving Kellie a chance...yet still deciding to leave.

It's kind of like reading restaurant or product reviews. I skip the 5 star ones and go straight to the 1 star ones to see what people are unhappy about and see if I can relate to it. A couple of bad reviews can be very damaging, so that's why I think they need to be addressed. I have no doubt that Kellie can bounce back from this bad press, but she has to acknowledge it. Matt went straight to pointing both thumbs at himself as the cause of the turmoil and took full ownership right away. Kellie IMO needs to address it soon, whether that means talking to Lou or doing an interview acknowledging what could have been done differently and vowing to learn from this and improve.
 
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#88
#88
Amb3096 said:
Truthfully, Jazmine and Lou aired their grievances rather diplomatically. They say they respected the coaching staff and all, but it's not hard to read between the lines and see that they weren't happy. Jaz is a perfect example. She could have easily just said, "I wanted to play with my friends", but she included the line about the coaching change and giving Kellie a chance...yet still deciding to leave.

It's kind of like reading restaurant or product reviews. I skip the 5 star ones and go straight to the 1 star ones to see what people are unhappy about and see if I can relate to it. A couple of bad reviews can be very damaging, so that's why I think they need to be addressed. I have no doubt that Kellie can bounce back from this bad press, but she has to acknowledge it. Matt went straight to pointing both thumbs at himself as the cause of the turmoil and took full ownership right away. Kellie IMO needs to address it soon, whether that means talking to Lou or doing an interview acknowledging what could have been done differently and vowing to learn from this and improve.
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In no way is Kellie obligated to respond to any of this. That is asinine. All this really tells me is that she has a strong personality, which is a good thing. When you inherit a team there are bound to be players who do not adapt to your style. Trying to drag them along is senseless. There are 10 other young ladies who have given her exponentially more positive feedback than the two negative comments we know about. When she left Mo State there was one player trashing her while the entire rest of the team defended her. Again, that just tells me she has a strong personality and doesn’t put up with BS. Some people can’t handle that. Too sensitive.

Good strong leaders will hurt some feelings. That’s the way it goes. Never heard anything about Holly until EW because she coddled the hell out of players. They loved her even as they continued to decline and lose more and more.

There were PLENTY of players that Pat rubbed the wrong way. Some are still vocal about how much they disliked like her. She never responded to a single one of them that I can recall. Because she was above that. People that had a problem with her simply couldn’t meet her expectations. She wasn’t about to lower the bar though. Wouldn’t expect that from Coach Harper either. You can rise to the occasion or head on down the trail.
 
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#89
#89
Amb3096 said:
Truthfully, Jazmine and Lou aired their grievances rather diplomatically. They say they respected the coaching staff and all, but it's not hard to read between the lines and see that they weren't happy. Jaz is a perfect example. She could have easily just said, "I wanted to play with my friends", but she included the line about the coaching change and giving Kellie a chance...yet still deciding to leave.

It's kind of like reading restaurant or product reviews. I skip the 5 star ones and go straight to the 1 star ones to see what people are unhappy about and see if I can relate to it. A couple of bad reviews can be very damaging, so that's why I think they need to be addressed. I have no doubt that Kellie can bounce back from this bad press, but she has to acknowledge it. Matt went straight to pointing both thumbs at himself as the cause of the turmoil and took full ownership right away. Kellie IMO needs to address it soon, whether that means talking to Lou or doing an interview acknowledging what could have been done differently and vowing to learn from this and improve.
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I’ve also seen it go the other way where athletes put it all out there... they don’t hold back. I def need Kellie to handle this and maybe she does it privately and I’m ok with that too. When it comes to Mitchell he had to apologize publicly he lost all his assistants and something like 8 transfers. To his credit he took full responsibility but as bold and brash as he was I am sure that was hard to do but also a job saving move because it wasn’t just the players that bailed but the coaches too.
 
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#90
#90
VolBall09 said:
I no way is Kellie obligated to respond to any of this. That is asinine. All this really tells me is that she has a strong personality, which is a good thing. When you inherit a team there are bound to be players who do not adapt to your style. Trying to drag them along is senseless. There are 10 other young ladies who have given her exponentially more positive feedback than the two negative comments we know about. When she left Mo State there was one player trashing her while the entire rest of the team defended her. Again, that just tells me she has a strong personality and doesn’t put up with BS. Some people can’t handle that. Too sensitive.

Good strong leaders will hurt some feelings. That’s the way it goes. Never heard anything about Holly until EW because she coddled the hell out of players. They loved her even as they continued to decline and lose more and more.

There were PLENTY of players that Pat rubbed the wrong way. Some are still vocal about how much they disliked like her. She never responded to a single one of them that I can recall. Because she was above that. People that had a problem with her simply couldn’t meet her expectations. She wasn’t about to lower the bar though. Wouldn’t expect that from Coach Harper either. You can rise to the occasion are head on down the trail.
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Except Kellie isn't Pat. To be blunt, she doesn't have the body of work to fall back on. Players lined up to play for Pat, in spite of her reputation as a hard ass, because she was a winner. Kellie doesn't have that luxury as a relatively unknown and unproven coach...and she's not exactly killing it on the recruiting trails. Sure, she can ignore this whole thing, but I still think it would be unwise of her to do so.
 
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#92
#92
I don't know if we've acknowledged it here or not, but in addition to saying that she had "the upmost [sic] respect" for the coaches and calling her teammates some of the finest athletes she's encountered, Lou did end her comments on a positive, optimistic note by saying, "Big things are in store for the Lady Vol program."
 
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#93
#93
Decker Moss said:
Unfortunately, intended or not, it looks like this may be sprouting some legs on Twitter.
Australian Basketball
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Only seeing a handful of comments and none directly referencing UT. One person said, "Sent a player to an elite program and they returned a player with no confidence." Given that Lou went to Wash. State for first 3 years and indicated that her playing days are over and her future focus is getting knee back to 100% and coaching, their description doesn't seem applicable to Lou.

That and the fact that Lou was a starter and had senior stats matching her previous career numbers...even while playing with a significant, hampering injury.

Unless the poster is talking about Jessie...the only Aussie "sent to" Tennessee...just don't see the connection.

Interesting that the Boneyard had some negative comments aimed at Holly.
 
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#95
#95
Amb3096 said:
Truthfully, Jazmine and Lou aired their grievances rather diplomatically. They say they respected the coaching staff and all, but it's not hard to read between the lines and see that they weren't happy. Jaz is a perfect example. She could have easily just said, "I wanted to play with my friends", but she included the line about the coaching change and giving Kellie a chance...yet still deciding to leave.

It's kind of like reading restaurant or product reviews. I skip the 5 star ones and go straight to the 1 star ones to see what people are unhappy about and see if I can relate to it. A couple of bad reviews can be very damaging, so that's why I think they need to be addressed. I have no doubt that Kellie can bounce back from this bad press, but she has to acknowledge it. Matt went straight to pointing both thumbs at himself as the cause of the turmoil and took full ownership right away. Kellie IMO needs to address it soon, whether that means talking to Lou or doing an interview acknowledging what could have been done differently and vowing to learn from this and improve.
Click to expand...
I would like to know where Jazmine said that is their a link to an article.
 
#96
#96
VolBall09 said:
In no way is Kellie obligated to respond to any of this. That is asinine. All this really tells me is that she has a strong personality, which is a good thing. When you inherit a team there are bound to be players who do not adapt to your style. Trying to drag them along is senseless. There are 10 other young ladies who have given her exponentially more positive feedback than the two negative comments we know about. When she left Mo State there was one player trashing her while the entire rest of the team defended her. Again, that just tells me she has a strong personality and doesn’t put up with BS. Some people can’t handle that. Too sensitive.

Good strong leaders will hurt some feelings. That’s the way it goes. Never heard anything about Holly until EW because she coddled the hell out of players. They loved her even as they continued to decline and lose more and more.

There were PLENTY of players that Pat rubbed the wrong way. Some are still vocal about how much they disliked like her. She never responded to a single one of them that I can recall. Because she was above that. People that had a problem with her simply couldn’t meet her expectations. She wasn’t about to lower the bar though. Wouldn’t expect that from Coach Harper either. You can rise to the occasion or head on down the trail.
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I never knew that were they disappointed because she left them?
 
#97
#97
LadyVols_WBK said:
I would like to know where Jazmine said that is their a link to an article.
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Search for the thread in Volnation where Jaz announced she was entering the transfer portal. Someone posted the link to the article there, and there was a pretty lengthy discussion about Jaz' statement.
 
#98
#98
Amb3096 said:
Except Kellie isn't Pat. To be blunt, she doesn't have the body of work to fall back on. Players lined up to play for Pat, in spite of her reputation as a hard ass, because she was a winner. Kellie doesn't have that luxury as a relatively unknown and unproven coach...and she's not exactly killing it on the recruiting trails. Sure, she can ignore this whole thing, but I still think it would be unwise of her to do so.
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I KNOW it would be unprofessional and immature for her to respond. Especially in any sort of public manner. Might it be a good idea for her to reach out to Lou personally? Yes.

Should she go post on Twitter about it? God no. That’s a huge issue these days. Rather than dealing with things one on one people jump to some public forum and try to post their side of the story first. Often before they even understand the context of their own problem. An individual’s personal feelings are not the entire story, both parties are entitled to their own version of events. Kellie feeding into this is a bad look and sets a poor example for her players.


I have a strong feeling you haven’t read Pat’s books. I would challenge you to do so. Might learn something.
 
#99
#99
VolBall09 said:
I KNOW it would be unprofessional and immature for her to respond. Especially in any sort of public manner. Might it be a good idea for her to reach out to Lou personally? Yes.

Should she go post on Twitter about it? God no. That’s a huge issue these days. Rather than dealing with things one on one people jump to some public forum and try to post their side of the story first. Often before they even understand the context of their own problem. An individual’s personal feelings are not the entire story, both parties are entitled to their own version of events. Kellie feeding into this is a bad look and sets a poor example for her players.


I have a strong feeling you haven’t read Pat’s books. I would challenge you to do so. Might learn something.
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Kellie. Is. Not. On. The. Same. Level. As. Pat.

I don't know why you don't get what works for someone of Pat's caliber wouldn't work for someone of Kellie's caliber. Kellie doesn't even need to even get into a pissing match. Just acknowledging her concerns wouldn't take much of an effort, whether in person or a quick tweet.
 
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