McCollough Assault Case not Done

#26
#26
VFL-82-JP said:
I'm no lawyer, but pretty sure witnesses don't come into play in a grand jury hearing. Just the prosecutor, explaining why it is worth the court's time to consider the case.


The phrase is a ham sandwich. That most grand juries will indict a ham sandwich if the prosecutor asks them to. Originally penned by Tom Wolfe in the book, Bonfire of the Vanities.
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You're correct on ham sandwich. I'm old and used to carry one in a paper bag to school, so I guess my brain made that association.
 
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#27
#27
VolArmy74 said:
You're correct on ham sandwich. I'm old and used to carry one in a paper bag to school, so I guess my brain made that association.
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I was just thinking, as I typed my response, that ham sandwiches often reside in paper bags, so maybe the paper bag got indicted as an accomplice, lol.
 
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#30
#30
VolMarine1371 said:
Why? Being indicted is far from being convicted. Do you know the difference between the two? Even if an indictment does come, it is not a conviction and still deserves to be treated as innocent till proven guilty.
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But he won't - if they indict him, he is likely to be kicked off the team, or suspended at the very least. The criminal system will take months to arrive at the same conclusion the university did already. Meanwhile, the team is deprived of a great player and his life is basically destroyed during that time and who knows how long till it gets right again. I mean do I have to actually invoke the AJ Johnson comparison here or are you familiar with it already?
 
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#31
#31
VFL-82-JP said:
I'm no lawyer, but pretty sure witnesses don't come into play in a grand jury hearing. Just the prosecutor, explaining why it is worth the court's time to consider the case.


The phrase is a ham sandwich. That most grand juries will indict a ham sandwich if the prosecutor asks them to. Originally penned by Tom Wolfe in the book, Bonfire of the Vanities.
Click to expand...
You had me at “I’m no lawyer…”.
 
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#33
#33
joevol33 said:
Idk. I have a good friend here who is a cop, and he does training in Athens often. He told me recently that the cops down there act like it's a badge of honor to get to arrest a football player. I wonder if Knoxville is like that? It just shocked me, cause you'd figure the home team would get away with a lot by the local pd. I'm sure it's different every where though.
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It is much different in Alabama.
 
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#36
#36
Gandalf said:
But he won't - if they indict him, he is likely to be kicked off the team, or suspended at the very least. The criminal system will take months to arrive at the same conclusion the university did already. Meanwhile, the team is deprived of a great player and his life is basically destroyed during that time and who knows how long till it gets right again. I mean do I have to actually invoke the AJ Johnson comparison here or are you familiar with it already?
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Knox county should be so lucky that the GJ see through the weak case and not only refuse to bring a true bill, but as a result scrutinize every case brought by this DA so that they know not to bring that junk back around.
I've considered this situation and gone through the roles being reversed and have come to the conclusion that I would have supported the officer arresting JM if he'd been the one staggering with a vodka bottle accusing someone else of pushing him down the stairs.
 
#37
#37
Almost 100% of Grand Jury cases are indicted it’s a joke. I was on Grand Jury for 3 months, once a week . Heard 103 case indicted all but one. At the end of our service the judge came in and chastised us for not indicting that one. It’s basically a money thing. They come up read the charge and show of hands to or not indict. They might as well say you get arrested you’re indicted but this way it makes it look legal.
 
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#39
#39
Ok, let's walk through this, and let me know if I am missing something.

Victim (alleged)

States he was drinking
States he left apartment he was staying at to retrieve more alcohol
States he returned to the wrong building
States he knocked on the door
States he entered the wrong address
States he immediately left and was walking away
States he was punched in the face
States he fell "backward" down stairs after being punched in face
Gives statement to police while still drinking

Witnesses (three total, not intoxicated)

Visibly intoxicated man enters/trespasses into apartment
Intoxicated man is told to leave
Man leaves apartment, then re-enters and is argumentative
McCollough punches victim (alleged) in the face


A few points here, beyond the fact that he was drinking, not only going to the wrong apartment, but went to the wrong building. If you look at this area, how intoxicated do you have to be to "return" to the wrong building? He knew how to return to his car, but not the right building?

If he was punched in face, which seems to be agreed on, that would infer that victim (alleged) was facing McCollough rather than trying to leave. He also states he fell "backwards" down the stairs, yet there are no injuries to his back or the back of his head. This means, regardless of where this occurred, rather than trying to leave "immediately", he was facing McCollough.

Drinking person says one thing, three non-drinking people say another.

I must be missing something. Why does a district attorney and a judge feel that 16 people, called to grand jury duty, spend their time making a recommendation to prosecute a case like this? If it were to go to trial, it would take 12 jurors to unanimously conclude that McCollough is guilty of felony assault. Is there a single person on this board that believes, if sitting in a jury, you would vote to convict McCollough of even simple assault? Are there 12 people on this board that would?
 
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#41
#41
At the 7-8 minute mark dude starts describing his dental damage. Tank should look into a future boxing career because apparently he has a Tyson or Foreman single knockout type punch. 🤦‍♀️
 
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#42
#42
sechamp2012 said:
Almost 100% of Grand Jury cases are indicted it’s a joke. I was on Grand Jury for 3 months, once a week . Heard 103 case indicted all but one. At the end of our service the judge came in and chastised us for not indicting that one. It’s basically a money thing. They come up read the charge and show of hands to or not indict. They might as well say you get arrested you’re indicted but this way it makes it look legal.
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Then the Grand Jury you were on did not operate properly, or even according to the law (regardless of what State you are in). Based on reading through this thread, there is a general lack of understanding as to exactly how a Grand Jury is supposed to work. Really like to see one of our resident attorneys chime in with a quick lesson on Grand Jury 101.

Yes, it's a one-sided affair, and it hinges on an impartial DA. I've seen "rubber stamp" GJ's, and ones that operated as they are designed to. Like most aspects of the Criminal Justice system, when it works right it's a thing of beauty, and when it doesn't it's frustrating to deal with.

Grand Jury here is absolutely the right call. Now let's hope the DA / ADA lays out the facts, and let's the Grand Jury do it's job. Personally, I think they are hoping for a No Bill, so they can say they took it to the GJ, and the people spoke. But we'll see.

Let Justice be served, and Go Vols.
 
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#44
#44
GreyWolf1129 said:
Then the Grand Jury you were on did not operate properly, or even according to the law (regardless of what State you are in). Based on reading through this thread, there is a general lack of understanding as to exactly how a Grand Jury is supposed to work. Really like to see one of our resident attorneys chime in with a quick lesson on Grand Jury 101.

Yes, it's a one-sided affair, and it hinges on an impartial DA. I've seen "rubber stamp" GJ's, and ones that operated as they are designed to. Like most aspects of the Criminal Justice system, when it works right it's a thing of beauty, and when it doesn't it's frustrating to deal with.

Grand Jury here is absolutely the right call. Now let's hope the DA / ADA lays out the facts, and let's the Grand Jury do it's job. Personally, I think they are hoping for a No Bill, so they can say they took it to the GJ, and the people spoke. But we'll see.

Let Justice be served, and Go Vols.
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Well I left after my service very frustrated because it is a one sided thing. It was basically us coming in for a day every Monday for 3 months hearing a cop present his case and then the fore lady or whatever her title was saying show of hands to indict and then those who oppose. This was the only time I served Grand Jury and to me I lost a little faith in the system. I had always thought the Grand Jury , I guess the word Grand in my mind had stood out to me as a kid but I was very disappointed, my only time to serve. I have been on other jury trials a couple times they were more even handed in my opinion.
 
#45
#45
sechamp2012 said:
Well I left after my service very frustrated because it is a one sided thing. It was basically us coming in for a day every Monday for 3 months hearing a cop present his case and then the fore lady or whatever her title was saying show of hands to indict and then those who oppose. This was the only time I served Grand Jury and to me I lost a little faith in the system. I had always thought the Grand Jury , I guess the word Grand in my mind had stood out to me as a kid but I was very disappointed, my only time to serve. I have been on other jury trials a couple times they were more even handed in my opinion.
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Yeah, it happens. We've both seen it, it seems. Sorry you got a bad taste in your mouth over it. When it works the way it's designed to, it works,

Almost 30 years on the TBL. This year is my last. Be nice to go back to just being "Joe Citizen" again. I'm tired.

Go Vols.
 
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#46
#46
After listening to that hearing, the Judge should give punting lessons because he kicked that can hard.
 
#48
#48
McIntosh assaulted McCullough on a wheel route. Can we put him under investigation when we have the rematch?
 
#49
#49
VolMarine1371 said:
Why? Being indicted is far from being convicted. Do you know the difference between the two? Even if an indictment does come, it is not a conviction and still deserves to be treated as innocent till proven guilty.
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I agree wholeheartedly. I just think once he’s charged he will no longer be with the team. Heupel’s given him a lot of consideration up to this point. If he’s innocent i’m sure he would let him back on the team. I will be more than happy to be wrong about this by the way, but Heup has a pretty good track record for booting people in trouble with the law. If he gets indicted I assume there will be a hearing or trial and I don’t think he will be a member of the team during that process.
 
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