Messing with Texas textbooks

#26
#26
milohimself said:
Thomas Who?
Thomas Jefferson, the Founding Father considered by many to be the author of the Declaration of Independence , is also credited with coining the phrase “separation of church and state.” According to The New York Times, that coinage didn’t make him very popular with the conservative members of the board. They removed Jefferson from a list of great Enlightenment philosophers — including John Locke, Thomas Hobbes, Voltaire, Charles de Montesquieu and Jean Jacques Rousseau — who inspired political revolutions from the 1700s to today. They also removed the word “Enlightenment” and added Thomas Aquinas and John Calvin. After much criticism, they added Jefferson back, but left out “Enlightenment” resulting in a standard very different from the original.
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Ironically, they could actually use Locke, Hobbes, and Rousseau to declare that the Enlightenment Philosophers who had a great influence on our founding also believed in a deity (granted, there concept of the deity would be unrecognizable to most Christians today).
 
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#28
#28
milohimself said:
Oh, this again.
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No, I'm not going there. The facts speak for themselves. My aunt and uncle are both microbiologists. Degrees from UT...neither of them believe they came from a rock. Christianity and science can coexist. Just a matter of where your faith lies. I've seen enough of mankind to never put my faith in the conclusions drawn by men..based on huge leaps of scientific faith for which there is no evidence. I put my faith instead in a God I've never seen but answers my prayers and works miracles in all our lives. This issue has been beat to death here. To each his own.
 
#29
#29
marcusluvsvols said:
No, I'm not going there. The facts speak for themselves. My aunt and uncle are both microbiologists. Degrees from UT...neither of them believe they came from a rock. Christianity and science can coexist. Just a matter of where your faith lies. I've seen enough of mankind to never put my faith in the conclusions drawn by men..based on huge leaps of scientific faith for which there is no evidence. I put my faith instead in a God I've never seen but answers my prayers and works miracles in all our lives. This issue has been beat to death here. To each his own.
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Ironic post is ironic.

My aunt and uncle are gods, and neither of them believe in that some bearded carpenter walked on water (of course, Socrates walked on air...but, there is no connection between the divinely inspired books of the Bible and the works of Plato...)
 
#30
#30
therealUT said:
Ironic post is ironic.

My aunt and uncle are gods, and neither of them believe in that some bearded carpenter walked on water (of course, Socrates walked on air...but, there is no connection between the divinely inspired books of the Bible and the works of Plato...)
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The sad thing is that attempt at sarcasm is no further from reality than the halfbaked bs you take from others and pass off as original thought here. I have read your attempts at looking intelligent over and over ad nauseum. Just because you've read every book your moonbat socialist philosophy professor told you to and can quote their thoughts verbatim doesn't make you intelligent, or right.
 
#32
#32
marcusluvsvols said:
The sad thing is that attempt at sarcasm is no further from reality than the halfbaked bs you take from others and pass off as original thought here. I have read your attempts at looking intelligent over and over ad nauseum. Just because you've read every book your moonbat socialist philosophy professor told you to and can quote their thoughts verbatim doesn't make you intelligent, or right.
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Ironic post is ironic.
 
#34
#34
marcusluvsvols said:
The sad thing is that attempt at sarcasm is no further from reality than the halfbaked bs you take from others and pass off as original thought here. I have read your attempts at looking intelligent over and over ad nauseum. Just because you've read every book your moonbat socialist philosophy professor told you to and can quote their thoughts verbatim doesn't make you intelligent, or right.
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There you go Trut.
You are not intelligent or right.
You just have a very good memory to quote
those moonbat socialist verbatim.
 
#36
#36
marcusluvsvols said:
The sad thing is that attempt at sarcasm is no further from reality than the halfbaked bs you take from others and pass off as original thought here. I have read your attempts at looking intelligent over and over ad nauseum. Just because you've read every book your moonbat socialist philosophy professor told you to and can quote their thoughts verbatim doesn't make you intelligent, or right.
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For chits and giggles, what makes you right?
 
#38
#38
So because trut doesn't believe exactly as you believe, his professors were moonbats and socialists and he is too? Interesting.
 
#39
#39
DynamiteMcGhee said:
So because trut doesn't believe exactly as you believe, his professors were moonbats and socialists and he is too? Interesting.
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It is interesting that I have never once had professor even point to the reference that Plato makes with regard to Socrates walking on air. Definitely none have ever attempted to draw a conclusion between that passage and the Gospels. I read the Apology, and I highlighted the passage because it struck me as significant.
 
#40
#40
therealUT said:
It is interesting that I have never once had professor even point to the reference that Plato makes with regard to Socrates walking on air. Definitely none have ever attempted to draw a conclusion between that passage and the Gospels. I read the Apology, and I highlighted the passage because it struck me as significant.
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Wasn't Socrates denying this claim, saying it was a character of Aristophanes who said he could walk on air in a comedy?
 
#41
#41
VOLinFL_ said:
Wasn't Socrates denying this claim, saying it was a character of Aristophanes who said he could walk on air in a comedy?
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Socrates neither denies it nor confirms it. He simply says that there are others who are claiming that he is divine. Which, once more, sounds much like Jesus.

Having read the Gospels countless times, and having read Plato's many dialogues, I am quite open to the theory that much of the Gospel is merely Plato's philosophy personified with a splash of Judaic custom.

Let us take up the case from its beginning. What is the accusation from which arose the slander in which Meletus trusted when he wrote out the charge against me? What did they say when they slandered me? I must, as if they were my actual prosecutors, read the affidavit they would have sworn. It goes something like this: Socrates is guilty of wrongdoing in that he busies himself studying things in the sky and below the earth; he makes the worse into the stronger argument, and he teaches these same things to others. You have seen this yourselves in a comedy of Aristophanes, a Socrates swinging about there, saying he was walking on air, and talking a lot of other nonsense about things of which I know nothing at all. I do not speak in contempt of such knowledge, if someone is wise in these things - lest Meletus bring more cases against me - but, gentlemen, I have no part in it, and on this point I call upon the majority of you as witnesses. I think it right that all those of you who have heard me conversing, and many of you have, should tell each other if anyone of you have ever heard me discussing such subjects to any extent at all. From this you will learn that the other things said about me by the majority are of the same kind.

Apologia, 19b-e
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Compare Socrates's questioning of his accusers and of what he is accused of with Jesus's questioning of his accusers and of what he is accused of. Their approach is eerily similar (refuse to outright deny the charges while asking for the individuals who are actually making the charges to specifically state them; e.g. "Are you the Son of God? -- You say that I am.")
 
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#42
#42
therealUT said:
Socrates neither denies it nor confirms it. He simply says that there are others who are claiming that he is divine. Which, once more, sounds much like Jesus.

Having read the Gospels countless times, and having read Plato's many dialogues, I am quite open to the theory that much of the Gospel is merely Plato's philosophy personified with a splash of Judaic custom.
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Holy spirit is front and center

Greece heavily influenced jewish culture
 
#43
#43
OrangeEmpire said:
Holy spirit is front and center

Greece heavily influenced jewish culture
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Indeed, there were gymnasia and academies in the center of Jerusalem prior to the Maccabean revolt. After that, one would have had to go to Egypt to be taught the Greek classics; interesting, since Mary and Joseph flee to Egypt and the next time Jesus is spoken of, in the Gospels, occurs when he is twelve and returns to Jerusalem to the Temple. That is, of course, if Jesus was an historical figure; however, it is reasonable to believe that Saul would have been very much exposed to Greek thought since he was born in Turkey. It is also worth noting that there is no evidence in favor of the Gospels being originally written in any language other than Greek. Understandably, these individuals then would have a familiar grasp on Greek philosophy.
 
#44
#44
DynamiteMcGhee said:
So because trut doesn't believe exactly as you believe, his professors were moonbats and socialists and he is too? Interesting.
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TRUT is smart. We all know that.

But let's not go so far as to say he's not a moonbat.

We all know TRUT's end will come in handcuffs, long beard mug shot, and something really, really unusual that lands him in the national spotlight.

Love the guy but when he goes out he's going out in a blaze of glory.
 
#45
#45
therealUT said:
Indeed, there were gymnasia and academies in the center of Jerusalem prior to the Maccabean revolt. After that, one would have had to go to Egypt to be taught the Greek classics; interesting, since Mary and Joseph flee to Egypt and the next time Jesus is spoken of, in the Gospels, occurs when he is twelve and returns to Jerusalem to the Temple. That is, of course, if Jesus was an historical figure; however, it is reasonable to believe that Saul would have been very much exposed to Greek thought since he was born in Turkey. It is also worth noting that there is no evidence in favor of the Gospels being originally written in any language other than Greek. Understandably, these individuals then would have a familiar grasp on Greek philosophy.
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Spot on, stuff I grapple with constantly.

The greek influence on the ark of the covenant.
 
#46
#46
NEOCON said:
TRUT is smart. We all know that.

But let's not go so far as to say he's not a moonbat.

We all know TRUT's end will come in handcuffs, long beard mug shot, and something really, really unusual that lands him in the national spotlight.

Love the guy but when he goes out he's going out in a blaze of glory.
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Negative ghostrider..........though I may be with him.
 
#47
#47
NEOCON said:
TRUT is smart. We all know that.

But let's not go so far as to say he's not a moonbat.

We all know TRUT's end will come in handcuffs, long beard mug shot, and something really, really unusual that lands him in the national spotlight.

Love the guy but when he goes out he's going out in a blaze of glory.
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I already have the long beard...

478356_10100816773930459_1602484263_o.jpg
 
#50
#50
therealUT said:
Socrates neither denies it nor confirms it. He simply says that there are others who are claiming that he is divine. Which, once more, sounds much like Jesus.
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I wouldn't say that. He called such allegations "nonsense".

therealUT said:
Having read the Gospels countless times, and having read Plato's many dialogues, I am quite open to the theory that much of the Gospel is merely Plato's philosophy personified with a splash of Judaic custom.
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I have always thought the story of Socrates (Apology, Crito, Phaedo) was eerily similar to the story of Jesus. Although the story of Jesus might have sentiments of Socrates, I find it most similar to an ancient Indian diety. His name escapes me at the moment.
 
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