Mexico Drug Wars still not our problem?

[jamesd1628]

James, legalizing drugs to prevent further violence created from "drug wars" is a terrible idea. You'll spend the same if not more on trying to rehabilitate the addicted population. That is a total crock of crap solution to this problem imo.

Fighting the drug problem in America starts with raising your kids right. You hit the nail on the head there.

The Government does not "raise you" unless you or your parents suck at it enough.

and splitting hairs between "lesser" drugs and "more harmful drugs" is a bad idea too. I can hear an argument all day about weed being the same as booze so on and so forth...whatever. If its harmful, which they all are, it should have the same rules applied to it.

That's why we call them "Illegal Drugs".

By this line of reasoning, we should outlaw alcohol, cigs, caffeine, high-fat foods, sweets, etc., etc.

 

[jamesd1628]

Has anyone else thought about how if we were to legalize these drugs, then there would be no difference? What company is going to manufacture and sell cocaine, meth, heroine, etc etc, knowing full well the destructive nature of such things?? The drug cartels are still going to keep producing them and fighting for control over areas.

The only affect that that would have is the availability of said drugs.

Legalizing all drugs is dumb. Marijauna? Fine, it's already readily available and the effects aren't as detrimental.

I don't think you understand the nature of the drug wars, to say nothing of the basic laws of supply of demand.

 

[TXA&M07]

You are old enough to be more rational than this. I cant understand how we got into a debate over legalizing drugs to avoid spending money keeping them out. Apparently our political, social, and moral standards differ.

It's unfortunate that a person as old as you are can't find the value in living a clean, drug free life, coinsidering all the contributions that your generations gave to us. Thanks so much for the shrooms, perscription pill misuse, new ways to use herion and cocain, and hair band music.

Legalizing drugs is not a good idea. You were dead on when you commented that parents need to man up. You should have stopped there.

 

[babercr1]

Bottom line, I just don't believe that the government should be acting as our parent. They are horrible at it in all respects, be it social programs or outlawing drugs.

Most people are not self disciplined enough to patrol their own actions. You may be, but I've seen more than my fair share of people who don't.

 

[TXA&M07]

and ps, the government is NOT out to get you.

 

[VOLatile]

I don't think you understand the nature of the drug wars, to say nothing of the basic laws of supply of demand.

No, I understand what you're saying. It's just that I don't believe that legalizing will have any effect on supply and demand. These guys will just be able to do deals out on the street in midday rather than in an alleyway or in their house.

A company that would produce these drugs would not make it very far before they come under intense scrutiny for doing so. Who in their right minds would do it anyways?

 

[jamesd1628]

and ps, the government is NOT out to get you.

Maybe, maybe not, but one thing is for sure: they sure as hell are incompetent.

 

[jamesd1628]

You are old enough to be more rational than this. I cant understand how we got into a debate over legalizing drugs to avoid spending money keeping them out. Apparently our political, social, and moral standards differ.

It's unfortunate that a person as old as you are can't find the value in living a clean, drug free life, coinsidering all the contributions that your generations gave to us. Thanks so much for the shrooms, perscription pill misuse, new ways to use herion and cocain, and hair band music.

Legalizing drugs is not a good idea. You were dead on when you commented that parents need to man up. You should have stopped there.

Why would you draw the conclusion that, because I think it should be legal, I think it's okay to do these drugs? I think I've made it pretty clear that I don't think these drugs, in and of themselves, are a good thing. Parents have to teach their kids not to do them. There should be programs to publicize how dangerous they are. But making them illegal does not solve the problem, it only makes it worse.

 

[utvolpj]

Legalizing drugs is not a good idea. You were dead on when you commented that parents need to man up. You should have stopped there.

drugs are already legal. The only debate left is which ones we choose to allow and which ones we demonize. A person using drugs is not an indication of bad parenting. There are some very good benefits from drugs like MJ that people want to ignore because the gov't told them drugs are bad, mmmkay.

 

[jamesd1628]

No, I understand what you're saying. It's just that I don't believe that legalizing will have any effect on supply and demand. These guys will just be able to do deals out on the street in midday rather than in an alleyway or in their house.

A company that would produce these drugs would not make it very far before they come under intense scrutiny for doing so. Who in their right minds would do it anyways?

I think what you could expect is the same type of thing that happened when abortions were legalized. The back-room abortions stopped. Those who perform legal abortions are subject to criticism from some camps, but there are people who perform them. And I can assure you that some company would be happy to make these drugs and sell them.

As to your point about who in their right minds would do these drugs anyway, the answer is probably nobody. That's why making these drugs illegal serves no real purpose. Those people who are out of their minds enough to do these drugs will find them and take them no matter how illegal it is.

 

[TXA&M07]

Why would you draw the conclusion that, because I think it should be legal, I think it's okay to do these drugs? I think I've made it pretty clear that I don't think these drugs, in and of themselves, are a good thing. Parents have to teach their kids not to do them. There should be programs to publicize how dangerous they are. But making them illegal does not solve the problem, it only makes it worse.

Yeah, cause they do such a great job being a guiding light for these kids nowadays.

Ever heard of DARE? I believe that program has been around a bit.

Look man, you cant convince me that legalizing all those hard core drugs is going to be a good idea. It has far to many holes in it to float.

and as for PJ, I get that weed helps out some medical issues. I'm not knocking medicinal use, but this guy James is talking about turning them all out in the open and saying rock on, yall have a great time. Our kids and a lot of our parents are already ignorant enough. Lets not lower the national IQ because we dont want to fight a fight we should be morally obligated to do based on our value for human kind.

 

[truefan]

Do the words National Guard mean anything to anyone is Washington? I understand that things are getting worse in Texas and Arizona, but when I walk down the road where I work on Conyers, Ga. and I see MS-13 spray painted on the sides of trees and buildings here, border control is affecting everyone in some way, shape, form.

I dont think this would be a mission for the SPEC OP community since they are certainly needed else where. I would be led to believe that since they are called the "NATIONAL GUARD" that they would be the most ideal candidate to a mission to guard our borders since it's obvious the Border Patrol needs some help.

The National Guard has been busy in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is another case where it is extremely clear the toll it has taken on our reserve troops in Iraq. Most of my friends from the National Guard have been on at least two tours in the Middle East.

 

[jamesd1628]

Yeah, cause they do such a great job being a guiding light for these kids nowadays.

Ever heard of DARE? I believe that program has been around a bit.

Look man, you cant convince me that legalizing all those hard core drugs is going to be a good idea. It has far to many holes in it to float.

and as for PJ, I get that weed helps out some medical issues. I'm not knocking medicinal use, but this guy James is talking about turning them all out in the open and saying rock on, yall have a great time. Our kids and a lot of our parents are already ignorant enough. Lets not lower the national IQ because we dont want to fight a fight we should be morally obligated to do based on our value for human kind.

You can't legislate based on morality. It simply doesn't work. People have different morals, beliefs, standards, etc. That is why America was born in the first place. Many people think drinking is immoral. They tried to outlaw it in the 20s. It didn't work. And it's not working with the war on drugs either.

I’m not saying these drugs are good things. Obviously, they are not. What I’m saying is that the government’s attempt to parent, in the form of the war on drugs, is not effective and causes more harm than good.

The bottom line on this and pretty much all other political issues is freedom. Every person should be free to do whatever he or she wants, to the extent that his or her actions do not infringe upon the rights of someone else.

 

[TXA&M07]

You can't legislate based on morality. It simply doesn't work. People have different morals, beliefs, standards, etc. That is why America was born in the first place. Many people think drinking is immoral. They tried to outlaw it in the 20s. It didn't work. And it's not working with the war on drugs either.

I’m not saying these drugs are good things. Obviously, they are not. What I’m saying is that the government’s attempt to parent, in the form of the war on drugs, is not effective and causes more harm than good.

The bottom line on this and pretty much all other political issues is freedom. Every person should be free to do whatever he or she wants, to the extent that his or her actions do not infringe upon the rights of someone else.

I think that sounds good, but you are leaving a lot open for interpretation.

 

[TXA&M07]

and to add again, my orginal comment was that this issue in Mexico will become an issue for us in the near future due to our lack luster involvment. That being said, wouldnt legalizing those hard core drugs in the U.S. only promote the importation of said drugs to a substantial degree.

The equation makes sense, but only from a perspective that does not value much more than economic gain (based primarily on the assumption that these drugs were to be taxed).

No concern for the over all well being of the Nation and its people are being presented, and I know, I know. You already said that the Government should have less say so in what we choose to do......bla bla blaaaa.

Give me a society that can maintain it's on stability and I'll say we tear down all the rules off the wall and have cake and punch! It aint gonna happen so we might start resigning ourselves to the fact that laws are made to protect us.

And lastly, back to my orginal issue before we got off topic, I see the next President dealing with this crisis very slowly.

 

[CovVol]

The National guards hands will be tied not unlike the Vietnam conflict. Remind me how that fighting a limited war thing turned out in Vietnam again?

And remind me how the tying of the military's hands in Vietnam is any different than the tying of the military's hands in Iraq? The situation's are similar indeed... so this would be no new leaf for the NG to turn over. In any case, the use of the SPEC OP community... I dont want to say it would be a waste guarding the borders, but it would be close since they are needed elsewhere. Quite simply put... they arent trained simply in unconventional warfare... they have a much higher level of training that the government would not waste roving Texas or Arizona hunting Jackals and smugglers.

The National Guard has been busy in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is another case where it is extremely clear the toll it has taken on our reserve troops in Iraq. Most of my friends from the National Guard have been on at least two tours in the Middle East.

They are indeed, but as the title of said organization would indicate, they are not guarding the nation. They are guarding someone else's nation.

 

[CovVol]

and to add again, my orginal comment was that this issue in Mexico will become an issue for us in the near future due to our lack luster involvment. That being said, wouldnt legalizing those hard core drugs in the U.S. only promote the importation of said drugs to a substantial degree.

The equation makes sense, but only from a perspective that does not value much more than economic gain (based primarily on the assumption that these drugs were to be taxed).

No concern for the over all well being of the Nation and its people are being presented, and I know, I know. You already said that the Government should have less say so in what we choose to do......bla bla blaaaa.

Give me a society that can maintain it's on stability and I'll say we tear down all the rules off the wall and have cake and punch! It aint gonna happen so we might start resigning ourselves to the fact that laws are made to protect us.

And lastly, back to my orginal issue before we got off topic, I see the next President dealing with this crisis very slowly.

You should check this book out:

Encounter Books » Mexifornia: A State of Becoming


and the follow up essay:

Mexifornia, Five Years Later by Victor Davis Hanson, City Journal Winter 2007

Very good read. The book is written based on the author's experience living in California his entire life and the central issue is illegal immigration, but parallels can be drawn... policing the border better being one of them... and Texas shares a border with Mexico as does California.

 

[g8terh8ter_eric]

If anyone thinks that Mexico cares anything about us other than the money is fooling themselves.

 

[SWIL]

Do the words National Guard mean anything to anyone is Washington? I understand that things are getting worse in Texas and Arizona, but when I walk down the road where I work on Conyers, Ga. and I see MS-13 spray painted on the sides of trees and buildings here, border control is affecting everyone in some way, shape, form.

I dont think this would be a mission for the SPEC OP community since they are certainly needed else where. I would be led to believe that since they are called the "NATIONAL GUARD" that they would be the most ideal candidate to a mission to guard our borders since it's obvious the Border Patrol needs some help.

I live in Norcross. MS-13 is everywhere around here. I probably live among a few of them.

 

[CovVol]

I live in Norcross. MS-13 is everywhere around here. I probably live among a few of them.

True story... a good friend of mine is a police officer for the North Charleston (S.C.) PD tells me stories all the time about those dudes down there. They cant even go into certain neighborhoods without backup on a call.... dont matter what it's for. Sad but true. I guess they're sorta like Chuck Norris... they just sneak in under the radar and before you know it, they are amoungst you everywhere you go.