NCAA Tournament Game Thread: (3) Lady Vols vs. (6) Michigan

[stlvolsfan]

Key and Saunders for sure and salary darby and Horston 30 percent

For what it’s worth, Tamari’s mom wrote into the Buck & 2 MC show and said she hates the portal and that it teaches kids they can run when times get tough. So if she leaves I’ll be SHOCKED! Emily actually has a shot at some significant playing time next year so that doesn’t seem as likely and I follow Horston’s mom on social media and they seem to really like Kellie and UT. So if any of the 3 leave I will be very surprised.

 

[Coach Jumper]

The difference is their players are Coachable and stand and listen to correction .. our girls walk with back to KJ as she corrects .. im really surprised she puts up with that ...

You just summed up my entire thought for this game,,,no holding of players accountable and no on-floor correction = no respect

 

[volnationnj]

Bueckers #1 in her class; Clark #4. That's why Kellie needs to win some recruiting battles for the elite players.

Agreed. We had 16 turnovers and only 5 assists against Michigan. You're not going to win many NCAA playoff games with those numbers.

 

[Volfan1000]

Michigan has Tennessee's number in the NCAA Tournaments.

 

[VOLINVONORE]

Maybe they will give her a voucher to make up for it in all of her games until she has time to recruit.

She did a poor job retaining talent, she did a poor job recruiting, and she did a poor job getting anything in the transfer portal.

UT is not hard to recruit to. Even Holly was able to do it.

If Holly had been a decent coach, she would have still been here. Instead, she left a team on a downward trend even when she recruited well at the beginning of her time as head coach. By that time. SC had taken over recruiting the best players, especially in the South.

 

[glv98]

You just summed up my entire thought for this game,,,no holding of players accountable and no on-floor correction = no respect

Yeah, so if only she'd yelled at them on camera more it would have all been different. So simple isn't it?

 

[JCP201]

The biggest issue with recent Lady Vol teams is that Holly recruited very good athleticism but not necessarily the best basketball IQ, discipline, fundamental skills and most importantly heart. Since they have been superior athletes most of their lives (we always hear how our team has the best talent), it has always come too easy for them, so the fire was not necessary for them to outplay their opponent. How many times have we seen our team get beat by a “lesser talented” team but had the desire to do whatever it took to win? We are still seeing the remnants of Holly’s recruiting and hopefully moving forward Kellie can improve the recruitment in some of these areas. Otherwise we will continue to see more of the same come tournament time.

Holly's teams had major talent but very selfish. You could definitely see a change in that with Kellie--maybe that is why we lost some of the superstars-- because she didn't tolerate me me me. Anyway, I was so disappointed that they lost, but as others have said we weren't even ranked at the beginning of this year and we all got our hopes up. They beat SC-- they almost beat Connecticut. That is why this stings so bad.

 

[djtee]

The difference is their players are Coachable and stand and listen to correction .. our girls walk with back to KJ as she corrects .. im really surprised she puts up with that ...

Are you in the team meetings or on the coaching staff or on the sideline ? So what are you really trying to say ? You and Coachjumper are really starting to piss off with your slick comments.

 

[Amb3096]

Holly's teams had major talent but very selfish. You could definitely see a change in that with Kellie--maybe that is why we lost some of the superstars-- because she didn't tolerate me me me. Anyway, I was so disappointed that they lost, but as others have said we weren't even ranked at the beginning of this year and we all got our hopes up. They beat SC-- they almost beat Connecticut. That is why this stings so bad.

Some revisionist history going on here. Diamond and Te'a, yes...pretty selfish. But there were loads more players that were consummate team players that suffered under Holly's coaching malpractice. Not including the recruits on the current team, but also Nared, Graves, Russell, Middleton, Reynolds, Carter, Jackson and I'm sure others that I missed.

The talent on the Holly-led teams was fine. The issue was the coaching. Kellie appears to have fixed the coaching part, but has not yet shored up the talent pipeline.

 

[Coffy73]

Okay, I'm a UConn fan, so many of you are predisposed to hate me. But I just feel compelled to speak up. I don't understand how so many people in here can be so down on this team. I can imagine the pain you felt when the program went downhill. I'll be honest, I would come in here and enjoy your bickering. Holly wasn't a coach and she looked even worse because she had to follow the coach who literally put women's college basketball on the map. There will never be another Pat Summitt and her untimely death was a genuine tragedy on so many levels. However, you have a new coach who is doing an AMAZING job turning your program around in a short amount of time. Plus she is young and energetic and brings excitement to your game. You're in the national conversation again. And she's just started. It sucks to lose and I honestly wish you went farther and we could have played you again. But you guys should be positive and happy about the future. Okay, now you can tell me to mind my own business and stay off of your board.

I'm a UConn fan as well and yeah, some on here can be brutal for even saying that, but I've been a fan of both programs since the mid-90s. I've liked the players that have come out of both programs. I like K Harper, a lot. I think sometimes, because of history, we expect a ton out of this program, and when it doesn't appear, a lot of flack is put on the coach. Never say never, I know, but when you see pictures of all those trophies in front of Summitt, well, that's never happening again; she was a legend for a reason! We might get close and even get another, who knows? It would be the same if Geno or Tara retires and leaves their programs.

 

[Orange Maniac]

Some people must have watched a different feed than I did since they seem to know what was said to the players and how they reacted to instruction. I didn't get that on my TV.

 

[UT Challenger]

Why we're on this 10 year rebuild The south Carolinas Uconns and the Stanford's are getting better

To be fair about it Geno and Tara where coaching in Pat's era and getting beaten most of the time by her. Staley has built a program at SC but it did not happen over night. I think she only beat Pat as a player and not a coach. Point being the older coaches are starting to turn their teams over to the young coaches. Tara and Geno will retire soon and their programs will be where we are now. Just look at ND. Not even in the tournament this year but they will be back. Ivy will be a good coach in time. CKH will get the Lady Vols back to a top 10 team. Just be patient. The foundation is being built.

 

[Franklin Pierce]

I am too, but some of these players aren't hers and as a coach you have to walk somewhat of a fine line in that situation. Push the wrong player the wrong way and you can lose the whole team.

And these days, the coach can be fired.

 

[NeedOrange]

The PG from Kentucky. Wynn is not a PG.

Even Wynn will probably need a season or two to be a real contributor.

Crystal Dangerfield was not a great point guard her first two years in college. That is normal for point guards. In the women's game a good point is more important than a good post. While wings and posts can work on their individual game within the team concept, the point must also learn how to lead a team. They must learn each players strength and weakness. They must know where and how each player wants the ball. They must understand the coaches philosophy and be intimate with every players role in each game plan. Then they have to develop an outside shot, be able to burst through a crease and be an 80% free throw shooter. Too many fans think all a point has to do is dribble without kicking the ball and pass to an open player. It is the toughest position on the floor and typically takes more than a year to develop the skills required to be a good college point let alone a great point.

 

[Orange Maniac]

This outcome of this game had little to do with coaching. Our go to players couldn't hit a bull in the arse with a bass fiddle. Simple as that.

 

[glv98]

Some revisionist history going on here. Diamond and Te'a, yes...pretty selfish. But there were loads more players that were consummate team players that suffered under Holly's coaching malpractice. Not including the recruits on the current team, but also Nared, Graves, Russell, Middleton, Reynolds, Carter, Jackson and I'm sure others that I missed.

The talent on the Holly-led teams was fine. The issue was the coaching. Kellie appears to have fixed the coaching part, but has not yet shored up the talent pipeline

Exactly. The Jamie Nared Trail of Tears is a long line of wasted careers, many of whom went on to play way better elsewhere.

Kellie indeed seems to be a better coach, but now is paying the price for Holly's misdeeds. She's in a dog chases tail position of needing elite recruits to get to the next level, but needing to get to the next level to attract elite recruits. She can only get by for so long with some good talent like Rae, some need to develop talent like Jordan H and Key, and some make do talent like Walker.

Meanwhile, offseason development needs to be off the charts this year. Rae must find her groove again to become elite, and Horston and Key, now halfway thru their careers, must become at least reliable contributors. All supporting cast and newbies must get better. Otherwise, next season without Re could be rough.

 

[Hallie]

Are you in the team meetings or on the coaching staff or on the sideline ? So what are you really trying to say ? You and Coachjumper are really starting to piss off with your slick comments.

Open.your eyes .. all u gotta do is observe.. ive watched players walk right past KJ and never slow down as she is trying to correct .. I watched Michigan girl come off court stop in front of her coach till she stopped talking and sit .. open your flippin eyes ..

 

[Hallie]

You just summed up my entire thought for this game,,,no holding of players accountable and no on-floor correction = no respect

Correct ....

 

[Bballnut1952]

To be fair about it Geno and Tara where coaching in Pat's era and getting beaten most of the time by her.

Maybe Tara, but Geno beat Pat most of the time.

01/16/95 #2 UConn 77, #1 UT 66 Storrs, Conn.
04/02/95 #1 UConn 70, #3 UT 64 Minneapolis, Minn.
01/06/96 #2 UConn 59, #4 UT 53 Knoxville, Tenn.
03/29/96 #4 UT 88, #2 UConn 83 (OT) Charlotte, N.C.
01/05/97 #1 UConn 72, #8 UT 57 Hartford, Conn.
03/24/97 #10 UT 91, #1 UConn 81 Iowa City, Iowa
01/03/98 #1 UT 84, #3 UConn 69 Knoxville, Tenn.
01/10/99 #2 UT 92, #1 UConn 81 Storrs, Conn.
01/08/00 #1 UConn 74, #2 UT 67 Knoxville, Tenn.
02/02/00 #4 UT 72, #1 UConn 71 Storrs, Conn.
04/02/00 #1 UConn 71, #2 UT 52 Philadelphia, Pa.
12/30/00 #1 UConn 81, #2 UT 76 Hartford, Conn.
02/01/01 #3 UT 92, #2 UConn 88 Knoxville, Tenn.
01/05/02 #1 UConn 86, #2 UT 72 Knoxville, Tenn.
03/29/02 #1 UConn 79, #6 UT 56 San Antonio, Texas
01/04/03 #3 UConn 63, #5 UT 62 (OT) Hartford, Conn.
04/08/03 #1 UConn 73, #5 UT 68 Atlanta, Ga.
02/05/04 #4 UConn 81, #1 UT 67 Knoxville, Tenn.
04/06/04 #6 UConn 70, #2 UT 61 New Orleans, La.
01/08/05 #10 UT 68, #15 UConn 67 Hartford, Conn.
01/07/06 #1 UT 89, #7 UConn 80 Knoxville, Tenn.
01/06/07 #4 UT 70, #5 UConn 64 Hartford, Conn.

13-9.

 

[Hallie]

I am too, but some of these players aren't hers and as a coach you have to walk somewhat of a fine line in that situation. Push the wrong player the wrong way and you can lose the whole team.

But you still have to be in control of team .. KJ will have to learn that ... if she wants to stay

 

[Nute Gunray]

The Lady Vols lost this game because their two best offensive players scored 23 points and Michigan's two best offensive players scored 42 points. Is this discrepancy a player problem or a coaching problem or a combination of the two? The LVs had 16 TOs compared to Michigan's 13 TOs, so TOs do not explain the loss. I am beginning to have anxious moments for Kellie's tenure at UT despite the UConn poster's comments that Kellie has turned the program around. The LV fans want Kellie to accomplish at the same level that Dawn has accomplished at SC. This is a heavy burden for Kellie but it is what it is. Let's hope that she can turn the program around in another 3 or 4 years. I believe she can do so even though I have some doubts.

 

[SGMVols]

Michigan has Tennessee's number in the NCAA Tournaments.

The stints of both Bruce Pearl and Cuonzo Martin at UT ended with losses to Michigan in the tournament...

 

[Col_Cathcart]

I'm a UConn fan as well and yeah, some on here can be brutal for even saying that, but I've been a fan of both programs since the mid-90s. I've liked the players that have come out of both programs. I like K Harper, a lot. I think sometimes, because of history, we expect a ton out of this program, and when it doesn't appear, a lot of flack is put on the coach. Never say never, I know, but when you see pictures of all those trophies in front of Summitt, well, that's never happening again; she was a legend for a reason! We might get close and even get another, who knows? It would be the same if Geno or Tara retires and leaves their programs.

I agree with you, but you deserve every bit of grief you get for rooting for UConn.

 

[SGMVols]

The Lady Vols lost this game because their two best offensive players scored 23 points and Michigan's two best offensive players scored 42 points. Is this discrepancy a player problem or a coaching problem or a combination of the two? The LVs had 16 TOs compared to Michigan's 13 TOs, so TOs do not explain the loss. I am beginning to have anxious moments for Kellie's tenure at UT despite the UConn poster's comments that Kellie has turned the program around. The LV fans want Kellie to accomplish at the same level that Dawn has accomplished at SC. This is a heavy burden for Kellie but it is what it is. Let's hope that she can turn the program around in another 3 or 4 years. I believe she can do so even though I have some doubts.

As long as we keep getting bounced in the first two rounds of the tournament it’s frankly ludicrous for anyone to suggest anything has been turned around.

Pat only had one team in her entire career that DIDN’T make the Sweet 16.

Just making the tournament is not sufficient. Every LV team has done that.

 

[Amb3096]

Crystal Dangerfield was not a great point guard her first two years in college. That is normal for point guards. In the women's game a good point is more important than a good post. While wings and posts can work on their individual game within the team concept, the point must also learn how to lead a team. They must learn each players strength and weakness. They must know where and how each player wants the ball. They must understand the coaches philosophy and be intimate with every players role in each game plan. Then they have to develop an outside shot, be able to burst through a crease and be an 80% free throw shooter. Too many fans think all a point has to do is dribble without kicking the ball and pass to an open player. It is the toughest position on the floor and typically takes more than a year to develop the skills required to be a good college point let alone a great point.

I agree with you. That's why I say a freshmen isn't coming in to fix the PG issues immediately unless Bueckers or Clark plan on redoing their freshman year in Knoxville. They will need a few years of seasoning first.