New ESPN rankings for 2021

#179
#179
Per an article in the October issue of Sports Illustrated, Azzi Fudd, 5-11 G, St. John’s College HS (Washington, DC), is down to UCLA and UConn
 
#183
#183
xtpsrh08123 said:
Im speaking of Oregon beating Uconn by 17 , SC beating Uconn by 20 and Baylor Beating UCONN by 15 all last season . We just didn't get a tournament remember ?
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Remember those games and a lot more. Like the 2013 when #1 Baylor with Griner Beat UConn and Notre Dame beat UConn 3 times and lost to UConn in the semi-finals as UConn beat Louisville for another Championship. I understand exactly why you believe what you said so strongly. But those games have no bearing on the tournament. No matter how definitely you write it or how many times you say it, it is only an opinion and demonstrates your lack of understanding the tournament history.
 
#185
#185
NeedOrange said:
Remember those games and a lot more. Like the 2013 when #1 Baylor with Griner Beat UConn and Notre Dame beat UConn 3 times and lost to UConn in the semi-finals as UConn beat Louisville for another Championship. I understand exactly why you believe what you said so strongly. But those games have no bearing on the tournament. No matter how definitely you write it or how many times you say it, it is only an opinion and demonstrates your lack of understanding the tournament history.
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Some other examples are Baylor beating Texas A&M three times and losing to them in the Elite 8 in 2011 and UConn beating Notre Dame 3 times and losing to them in the Final 4 in 2012.
 
#186
#186
Terrells Bay88 said:
Some other examples are Baylor beating Texas A&M three times and losing to them in the Elite 8 in 2011 and UConn beating Notre Dame 3 times and losing to them in the Final 4 in 2012.
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In 2012 Notre Dame Beat UConn twice in the regular season but UConn beat ND in the Big East tournament. Notre Dame won again in the national semi-final matchup. In actuality Notre Dame beat UConn 3 times.
 
#187
#187
NeedOrange said:
Remember those games and a lot more. Like the 2013 when #1 Baylor with Griner Beat UConn and Notre Dame beat UConn 3 times and lost to UConn in the semi-finals as UConn beat Louisville for another Championship. I understand exactly why you believe what you said so strongly. But those games have no bearing on the tournament. No matter how definitely you write it or how many times you say it, it is only an opinion and demonstrates your lack of understanding the tournament history.
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UCONN won only bc Baylor got upset by Louisville plus they had Stewie . This most recent UCONN team had no such thing , not anybody even close. If your wanting to use that logic then i could say Tennessee would have won the tourney last year . Hell Quinnipiac was a shoe in for the final 4 as well right ? #RealityCheck
 
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#188
#188
xtpsrh08123 said:
UCONN won only bc Baylor got upset by Louisville plus they had Stewie . This most recent UCONN team had no such thing , not anybody even close. If your wanting to use that logic then i could say Tennessee would have won the tourney last year . Hell Quinnipiac was a shoe in for the final 4 as well right ? #RealityCheck
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#189
#189
#RealityCheck is UConn will still be in the same conversation for several years to come... Can Ladyvols say that. #Haterswillalwayshate
 
#190
#190
stlvolsfan said:
Period Pooh!
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We have to remember that KJH did wonders with no stars at MoState and saved a sinking program. That is one reason I am not up in arms with rankings and stars. Pre KJH we had a lot of 5 stars and was always recruiting a top ten class but could not produce top ten results. Talent is a good thing but no matter how many stars your recruits have if they can’t prove it on the court, you have net zero.
 
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#191
#191
teacherdean said:
We have to remember that KJH did wonders with no stars at MoState and saved a sinking program. That is one reason I am not up in arms with rankings and stars. Pre KJH we had a lot of 5 stars and was always recruiting a top ten class but could not produce top ten results. Talent is a good thing but no matter how many stars your recruits have if they can’t prove it on the court, you have net zero.
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This! /\
 
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#192
#192
teacherdean said:
We have to remember that KJH did wonders with no stars at MoState and saved a sinking program. That is one reason I am not up in arms with rankings and stars. Pre KJH we had a lot of 5 stars and was always recruiting a top ten class but could not produce top ten results. Talent is a good thing but no matter how many stars your recruits have if they can’t prove it on the court, you have net zero.
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I'm not really up in arms about the stars question either, although I still contend they matter quite a bit once you reach the regional finals or the final four. Then the stars really seem to kick in. A lot of top athletes start showing up in the last few rounds of the tournament, and as I've said before winning teams tend to have at least two top 10-ish players on their rosters. I don't think that's all coincidence. It's easy to make waves in the first four rounds, and then the lack of parity rears its head and the last few rounds are brutal. There's a reason scores are more lopsided in the women's tournament, as compared to the men's. The coaching can get an occasional Missouri State or Minnesota to the Elite Eight/Final Four but then the real games start. Then you need coaching _and_ comparable talent. I certainly hope Tennessee is moving in that direction. But there's a ways to travel.
 
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#193
#193
teacherdean said:
We have to remember that KJH did wonders with no stars at MoState and saved a sinking program. That is one reason I am not up in arms with rankings and stars. Pre KJH we had a lot of 5 stars and was always recruiting a top ten class but could not produce top ten results. Talent is a good thing but no matter how many stars your recruits have if they can’t prove it on the court, you have net zero.
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Sigh.......again?

It was ONE season that she got them to the Sweet Sixteen. One other season at Mo. State that she got them to the NCAA tournament they lost in the first round. In 3 of the other 4 seasons at Mo. State she got the the WNIT three times, losing twice in the first round and once in the second round.

And Mo. State wasn't a sinking program.

The prior coach had three consecutive 20+ game seasons, going 22-11, 24-11 and 24-9 before slipping to 14-17 her last season before being let go and Harper being hired.

Last, she can't win in the SEC without highly ranked players. Her haul so far is good but not great. She needs some Top 10-15 recruits to come to Knoxville. Hopefully that will happen in 2022.

I have hopes for Coach Harper to do a good job at Tennessee. She doesn't need the fan base overstating her accomplishments. It just sets her up for a fall.
 
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#194
#194
Voltopia said:
I'm not really up in arms about the stars question either, although I still contend they matter quite a bit once you reach the regional finals or the final four. Then the stars really seem to kick in. A lot of top athletes start showing up in the last few rounds of the tournament, and as I've said before winning teams tend to have at least two top 10-ish players on their rosters. I don't think that's all coincidence. It's easy to make waves in the first four rounds, and then the lack of parity rears its head and the last few rounds are brutal. There's a reason scores are more lopsided in the women's tournament, as compared to the men's. The coaching can get an occasional Missouri State or Minnesota to the Elite Eight/Final Four but then the real games start. Then you need coaching _and_ comparable talent. I certainly hope Tennessee is moving in that direction. But there's a ways to travel.
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I have seen Striplin (2 games) and Puckett play and have very good knowledge of Wynn and Miles....We are going towards the right direction, Striplin has a good footwork down low and has good midrange...Puckett can go off shooting (both have high BB IQ's ....Wynn is an incredible athlete who can play the game and Miles fills a need (mighty-mite speed guard)....preceding them is Darby, another lights out shooter who has a good mental toughness...Salary has Meme-like speed and athleticism....Most of these players show the mental toughness to handle SEC play...two I am not certain about at this writing, but we will see.

The two future players (I know have been contacted) are both very high IQ players for their ages and both have extremely good work-ethic.

As you point out, and as a coach, I am 100% in agreement, for the car to win the race it has to have the right driver! I backed Coach K from the gitgo and will give her year one to acclimate to the SEC world, as it is vastly different from the Missouri Valley conference.

But year 2 and moving forward, I give no "gimme's
 
#195
#195
teacherdean said:
We have to remember that KJH did wonders with no stars at MoState and saved a sinking program. That is one reason I am not up in arms with rankings and stars. Pre KJH we had a lot of 5 stars and was always recruiting a top ten class but could not produce top ten results. Talent is a good thing but no matter how many stars your recruits have if they can’t prove it on the court, you have net zero.
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I don't look at this as relevant assessment of their star-worth for two reasons
  1. Who coached them, CHW
  2. How they are representing and growing now in the WNBA
 
#196
#196
xtpsrh08123 said:
UCONN won only bc Baylor got upset by Louisville plus they had Stewie . This most recent UCONN team had no such thing , not anybody even close. If your wanting to use that logic then i could say Tennessee would have won the tourney last year . Hell Quinnipiac was a shoe in for the final 4 as well right ? #RealityCheck
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There you go making up your own parameters. Why don't we just call the ncaa and explain to them there is no sense playing the games because you know who is going to win. How about letting me in on the 2021 winner so I can lay down some real money in Vegas?
 
#197
#197
Coach Jumper said:
I have seen Striplin (2 games) and Puckett play and have very good knowledge of Wynn and Miles....We are going towards the right direction, Striplin has a good footwork down low and has good midrange...Puckett can go off shooting (both have high BB IQ's ....Wynn is an incredible athlete who can play the game and Miles fills a need (mighty-mite speed guard)....preceding them is Darby, another lights out shooter who has a good mental toughness...Salary has Meme-like speed and athleticism....Most of these players show the mental toughness to handle SEC play...two I am not certain about at this writing, but we will see.

The two future players (I know have been contacted) are both very high IQ players for their ages and both have extremely good work-ethic.

As you point out, and as a coach, I am 100% in agreement, for the car to win the race it has to have the right driver! I backed Coach K from the gitgo and will give her year one to acclimate to the SEC world, as it is vastly different from the Missouri Valley conference.

But year 2 and moving forward, I give no "gimme's
Click to expand...
Agree KJH is certainly moving the needle in the right direction. 99.99% of the time top players want to play with similar or better level players. It is tough to get a top 10 player enthused about playing with a team of 40's and high 30's. But a high 20 can come if they buy into the coach. Once you get high 20's then its low twenties and beyond.

I don't buy into the two year time frame for two reasons.
First,it takes 3 to 4 years of relationship building to get the to recruits. KJH recruiting impact in the top players is in year 2 of that 3 to 4 year span. She is recruiting the top high school 8th graders and freshmen. (most top players commit before there senior season of high school.) So I would double your time frame or eve add another year.
Second, in year one coaching she is trying to turn around a culture and build a winning attitude. She is also coaching out the bad habits of the prior coach which is much more difficult than coaching good habits into a freshman.

Also in my opinion it was important to hire a legacy coach to maintain the Lady Vol aura. A coach from outside the system would have signaled a change that could have relegated the Lady Vols to just another program. Just my thoughts.
 
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#198
#198
Year two is less about numbers or standards for me and more about growth in the org...
  • Players truly buying in to the vision, playing with full energy, full focus and commitment
  • Improvement in coaching strategies,, directly associated with the higher level of athletes, competition and conference standards
  • A definite advancement in player skills and "game"
  • A public feeling of non-doubt about who is in control of the direction/players/staff,,,and done so without creating a "Napoleon Dictatorship " like CHW tried to do (by dismantling staff because they actually had a thought and being able to keep players through adversity,, without losing them to other programs
 
#199
#199
Bballnut1952 said:
Sigh.......again?

It was ONE season that she got them to the Sweet Sixteen. One other season at Mo. State that she got them to the NCAA tournament they lost in the first round. In 3 of the other 4 seasons at Mo. State she got the the WNIT three times, losing twice in the first round and once in the second round.

And Mo. State wasn't a sinking program.

The prior coach had three consecutive 20+ game seasons, going 22-11, 24-11 and 24-9 before slipping to 14-17 her last season before being let go and Harper being hired.

Last, she can't win in the SEC without highly ranked players. Her haul so far is good but not great. She needs some Top 10-15 recruits to come to Knoxville. Hopefully that will happen in 2022.

I have hopes for Coach Harper to do a good job at Tennessee. She doesn't need the fan base overstating her accomplishments. It just sets her up for a fall.
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You and Voltopia have it right. Good luck with thinking you are regularly making final fours or winning the SEC without some top talent and I don’t mean top 40. No coach is that good and KJH had some run at NCState. How did that go? I’m pulling for her but she and perhaps as importantly, her staff, have to step up the recruiting level.
 
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#200
#200
Coach Jumper said:
Year two is less about numbers or standards for me and more about growth in the org...
  • Players truly buying in to the vision, playing with full energy, full focus and commitment
  • Improvement in coaching strategies,, directly associated with the higher level of athletes, competition and conference standards
  • A definite advancement in player skills and "game"
  • A public feeling of non-doubt about who is in control of the direction/players/staff,,,and done so without creating a "Napoleon Dictatorship " like CHW tried to do (by dismantling staff because they actually had a thought and being able to keep players through adversity,, without losing them to other programs
Click to expand...


This would be fine if it began with bringing in the raw talent to benefit.
 
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