Obama Supports Ground Zero Mosque

#26
#26
If there is no legal reason to stop them, they shouldn't be stopped. If people are mad about this, maybe they should build a gay bar one one side and a pork only diner on the other, because there doesn't seem to be any real reason why it shouldn't be allowed to happen. It's not like they're building this on the rubble of the World Trade Center.
 
#27
#27
If a satanic cult meets both of the above criteria to build a temple to worship the lord of hell then nobody can tell them no either. Doesn't mean it isn't in extremely bad taste to do so, or that the discussion should end on the role civil liberties play in the arena of public opinion. I will agree though, anybody arguing against this on legal grounds is in for a losing battle.

I see the point you're making (which seems to be the rational consensus), but why Satanism?
 
#28
#28
I understand where you guys are coming from, but I just don't see how this is such a big deal.
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What about the political statement being made??




There are exactly two relevant questions involving this issue.

1. Can the mosque proponents afford the real estate for the proposed site?
2. Would placing a mosque there be permitted by New York City zoning ordinances?

If the answer to both is yes, end of discussion.

Not so.

Other considerations:

1. The mosque proponents don't own half the property, it is under lease to them. This neccesssitates a review by a New York state commission, plus the New York city zoning commission may want to revisit their ruling because the ownership issue was misrepresented to them in the original application.

2. What are the sources of the funding?? If all or even part of the funding is coming from known terrorist organizations, that would or should put the kibash on the whole project.

3. Political considerations, are these proponents making a political statement?? What if they were going to call it the Muhammed Atta cultural center?? Would any such political statement come into play??

Personally I think your shallow analysis is myopic to say the least.

Will nationwide public outrage come into play??
 
#29
#29
Please, someone fill me in on the beliefs of Islam as they pertain to women. Then tell me if a President should throw his support behind any entity who shares the same view.
 
#30
#30
When people cannot distinguish between the terrorists and a religion of 1.5 billion other people such that we give up on our most important political philosophies, the terrorists have won.

Let me ask an honest question, and please think about it.

Every time there is a bombing in Jerusalem and a busload of Israelis are killed, or when western journalists are beheaded, or when violent protests over cartoons are raging...where are all these other 1.5 billion voices of reason condemning such actions? Contrary to what you may think, many of the actions that Islamic terrorists do are overtly supported by Koranic text. Terrorism and Islam are closely linked, anyone who says otherwise simply isn't being honest about the evidence.

That being said, not all Muslims are terrorists, but if they wanted to be they could find all the justification they want. So yes, sometimes it is very difficult to distinguish the two. And I find it hard to believe any of those 1.5 billion moderate mythical voices of reason you refer to should want to build a mosque there anyway.
 
#31
#31
Well ya, if you want to be rational about it...

In reality it is irrational to think we are not at war with political/economic/cultural/religious islam.

"But what if religion acts like a conquering army?" - Jihad Watch

The US better reconcile between Freedom of Religion and Islam as a conquering army soon. The two cannot co-exist for long.




If a satanic cult meets both of the above criteria to build a temple to worship the lord of hell then nobody can tell them no either. Doesn't mean it isn't in extremely bad taste to do so, or that the discussion should end on the role civil liberties play in the arena of public opinion. I will agree though, anybody arguing against this on legal grounds is in for a losing battle.

I'm not comparing Islam to satan worship, I'm just trying to make a point. It is a slap in the face to the victims of 911 to have a symbol of the underlying offending ideology so close to the scene of the crime. It's also worth asking why a Muslim group would even want one there in the first place. Aside from the bad taste, they are about to pay for high dollar real estate, only to set themselves up for vandalism and ridicule. Personally, it makes me wonder what their agenda really is here.

Islam is a satanic cult.

Muhammed himself thought he was being possessed by the devil during his seizures but his wife convinced him that he was being talked to by angels.

I find it hard to comprehend that anyone would wonder what their agenda really is, they have stated their agenda, on American soil no less, as well as in foreign capitals, for at least eighty years.

The first Islamic missionaries from abroad arrived in the 1920s and unblushingly declared: "Our plan is, we are going to conquer America."9 The audacity of this and other statements of intent did not go unnoticed, as a 1922 newspaper commentary shows:

To the millions of American Christians who have so long looked eagerly forward to the time the cross shall be supreme in every land and the people of the whole world shall have become the followers Christ, the plan to win this continent to the path of the "infidel Turk" will seem a thing unbelievable. But there is no doubt about its being pressed with all the fanatical zeal for which the Mohammedans are noted.10


I suppose no one was paying any attention until 9/11 and not very many since then really.







That, plus it is a local issue and the White House should let the local government settle the dispute first.

I cant figure out why Obama weighed in on an issue already solved that he agreed with?

here's why:

"I am a Muslim," Obama Tells Egyptian Foreign Minister Gheit Islamic Coup on the White House - Atlas Shrugs

Finally, during the week of 14-18th of January 2010, just on the eve of my winter tour to the US, Rachel picked up a Nile TV broadcast in which Egyptian Foreign Minister Abul Gheit said on the "Round Table Show" that he had had a one on one meeting with Obama who swore to him that he was a Moslem, the son of a Moslem father and step-son of Moslem step-father, that his half-brothers in Kenya were Moslems, and that he was loyal to the Moslem agenda. He asked that the Moslem world show patience. Obama promised that once he overcame some domestic American problems (Healthcare), that he would show the Moslem world what he would do with Israel. (more here)

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If there is no legal reason to stop them, they shouldn't be stopped. If people are mad about this, maybe they should build a gay bar one one side and a pork only diner on the other, because there doesn't seem to be any real reason why it shouldn't be allowed to happen. It's not like they're building this on the rubble of the World Trade Center.

That isn't the way it works in Manhatten.

Here is how the process has proceeded for quite some time.

1. Muslims apply for and recieve permission to build or convert an existing building into a mosque.

2. Muslims complain about bars etc near their "place of worship."

3. Cowards in Albany refuse to renew license for businesses claimed by muslims to be offensive.

4. Those who have offended the muslims are out of business.

5. Islam advances on a worldwide basis using weaknesses in whatever systems they have to deal with locally, using outrage, threats of social unrest/terrorism to advance their march to complete and total power and control of nations individually, working and building toward a worldwide system of hegemony.

6. The demands are endless until there is nothing left to demand.

Why this might be surprising or a hard to grasp concept to any American is really beyond my understanding.
 
#33
#33
There are exactly two relevant questions involving this issue.

1. Can the mosque proponents afford the real estate for the proposed site?
2. Would placing a mosque there be permitted by New York City zoning ordinances?

If the answer to both is yes, end of discussion.

+1

Freedom is every thing!
 
#34
#34
Would anyones view of the mosque being built be different if you lost a loved one there? Much less 3000 US citizens.
 
#35
#35
Would anyones view of the mosque being built be different if you lost a loved one there? Much less 3000 US citizens.

You do know that something like 15% of the fatalities weren't US citizens... right? With that said, I highly doubt my opinion would be different.
 
#39
#39
I'm a bit confused by something, but it could perhaps be because I avoided any form of "news" this weekend.

First, this was to be a mosque. Then, it was not really going to be a mosque, but rather a cultural center. Now it's a mosque again?
 
#40
#40
Obama?s Ground Zero Mosque

A very interesting read. Some questionable guests at Barry's celebration.

Another interesting read:

Obama and Hamas Agree: Build the Mosque | Impeach Obama Campaign

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BTW, have you read the guest list for the muslim iftar ramadan dinner at the White House??

Clinton started the event and it was continued by Bush.

The huge difference in the guest list that at first it was foreign dignateries and (supposedly) respected muslims in America who were invited.

The most recent guest list is full of Obambi appointed muslims that he has elevated to high office in the American government.





+1

Freedom is every thing!

And you can't expect to have freedom very long if you continue to appease islam.
 
#41
#41
#44
#44
I'd love to find out how the mosque itself is being funded.

that's not important. What's important is finding out who's funding the people exercising their rights as Americans and exposing them. You just have it backwards
 
#45
#45
Those on the left moaning about the right making this a wedge issue need to look in the mirror. Both sides are playing the game here, this is what happens when an issue plays to peoples emotions, the politics are injected to score points.
 
#46
#46
It's amazing how "freedom of religion" turns into Pelosi demanding an investigation of "freedom of speech"...
 
#47
#47
that's not important. What's important is finding out who's funding the people exercising their rights as Americans and exposing them. You just have it backwards

of course it's important. a mosque rising from the remains of the world trade center sends a message to terrorists that their actions are blessed by allah. al queada has found millions in funding. this mosque has already cost multi millions. what if the same sources funded both? is that at least not somewhat relavant?
 
#48
#48
Looks like Patterson's efforts at dialogue and potentially moving it are down the tubes. The developers do not want to meet to discuss the issue. No dialogue in the name of dialogue....
 
#49
#49
of course it's important. a mosque rising from the remains of the world trade center sends a message to terrorists that their actions are blessed by allah. al queada has found millions in funding. this mosque has already cost multi millions. what if the same sources funded both? is that at least not somewhat relavant?

I think someone's sarcasm detector is malfunctioning... :ermm:
 

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