Obama's first international crisis.

#26
#26
Obama isn't going to raise a hand against the good muslim pirates from Somalia. Now let pirates from Armenia seize an American ship and he would nuke 'em.
 
#27
#27
#28
#28
westtnorangeman said:
How did he fail I don't understand your logic:dunno:
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your side claimed that Bush failed in the aftermath of Katrina. Show me what the Obama administration did that separated itself in the way the two situations I mentioned were handled.
 
#29
#29
allvol123 said:
My dislike for this administration is obvious, so maybe I am reaching here. But why does everything require "world action". Some effing pirates took over a ship with Americans on it. MF'er...can we not take some effing pirates? Jeeeezz!!!!!
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Made me immediately think of good ole Samuel L Jackson:

"I’m getting sick and tired of all these mf'n pirates on this mf'n ship"
 
#30
#30
I'm sure obama and his bed partners the UN will come up with a peaceful solution. Maybe send them some cookies or offer to build them a mosque or two or three.
 
#31
#31
volinbham said:
Kick butt
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Merchant marines are pretty much kick ass.

Back when we had a peace keeping force in Lebanon a friend of mine got off a boat in Beiruit.

There had been a ship or so sunk in the Suez canal to block it and having sailed from India all the way around Africa, he had been at sea for nearly three months and really wanted some dry land under his feet.

There was quite a bit of internecine fighting going on, one could hear mortars and automatic weapons firing and occasionally artillery fire.

By international law, merchant marines aren't allowed to leave a ship armed but he ran into an American National Guard unit from not so far from his hometown and threw in with them, the Guardsmen were under orders to be locked and loaded at all times and were just patrolling around trying to discourage any marauding.

They decided to get out in the country and so made a round trip of fifty miles or more through the hills.

They would come upon these places that were sort of like taverns but many had little curtained booths behind which they would often find men taking their pleasure with young boys.

They would hold the mussel of and M-16 under the men's noses and lead them outside and give them a chance to leave, and when they did would fire a few shots into the air, my friend said those guys looked really funny with their robes all hiked up, sandals flopping while leaping over fences and walls in their haste to depart.

After drinking up the booze and whatever they would burn the places down and proceed on their way.

When they returned to Beiruit they found a Catholic orphanage and gave the abused young boys a new home.
 
#32
#32
Well, this development got a whole lot more interesting. Pirates are sending in backup ships with 52 hostages. Our FBI is involved, which means do we stick with the "never negotiate" or let them go and pay the ransom?

also, the CO of the Bainbridge is in deep poo right now with the chain of command.
 
#33
#33
The Alabama sailed away from the lifeboat Thursday, Maersk shipping line said, and a team of armed Navy SEALs is aboard, according to a U.S. official who asked not to be identified because of the sensitivity of the situation.
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one of my first thoughts was "where are these guys?" but figured I had watched too many movies.
 
#34
#34
not much the SEALS can do in the situation with the Captain. I do know if they allow those other pirate ships anywhere near the stranded lifeboat we have lost it.
 
#35
#35
MontereyVol said:
Well, this development got a whole lot more interesting. Pirates are sending in backup ships with 52 hostages. Our FBI is involved, which means do we stick with the "never negotiate" or let them go and pay the ransom?

also, the CO of the Bainbridge is in deep poo right now with the chain of command.
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Did the CO of the Bainbridge actually do something wrong, or are they just setting him up as a scapegoat?


I do have a question:

What can shipping companies do that have to run those shipping lanes in the Gulf of Aden to counteract this?

Obviously there are not enough Navy ships to do the job (not their fault... too much bread, too little butter) and stabilizing the Somalian government is a total mess no UN country will touch.
 
#37
#37
DC Vol said:
Did the CO of the Bainbridge actually do something wrong, or are they just setting him up as a scapegoat?


I do have a question:

What can shipping companies do that have to run those shipping lanes in the Gulf of Aden to counteract this?

Obviously there are not enough Navy ships to do the job (not their fault... too much bread, too little butter) and stabilizing the Somalian government is a total mess no UN country will touch.
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Too much info is going public. Someone is talking a lot to the press which isn't going to help and that someone is on his ship.

hire security teams or arm/train the crew.

This actually might not be a bad situation for us, the more I read about it, some of those pirate ships being sent to bail out the lifeboat are the "motherships" we can mark them which would make finding them later extremely easy. In other words I think the pirates are over playing their hand by exposing themselves too much.
 
#39
#39
MontereyVol said:
Too much info is going public. Someone is talking a lot to the press which isn't going to help and that someone is on his ship.

hire security teams or arm/train the crew.

This actually might not be a bad situation for us, the more I read about it, some of those pirate ships being sent to bail out the lifeboat are the "motherships" we can mark them which would make finding them later extremely easy. In other words I think the pirates are over playing their hand by exposing themselves too much.
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I'll admit I'm almost entirely ignorant on the nuances of international law, but I was under the impression that merchant vessels or their crews couldn't be armed in peacetime.

But, if the crew could be armed... why in the world, as a merchant crew, would you not arm yourself to some extent if you're sailing in the Gulf of Aden? I would think there would have to be a good reason behind it.
 
#40
#40
DC Vol said:
I'll admit I'm almost entirely ignorant on the nuances of international law, but I was under the impression that merchant vessels or their crews couldn't be armed in peacetime.

But, if the crew could be armed... why in the world, as a merchant crew, would you not arm yourself to some extent if you're sailing in the Gulf of Aden? I would think there would have to be a good reason behind it.
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No crews cannot be armed, but they can address that and change it.
 
#47
#47
DC Vol said:
I'll admit I'm almost entirely ignorant on the nuances of international law, but I was under the impression that merchant vessels or their crews couldn't be armed in peacetime.

But, if the crew could be armed... why in the world, as a merchant crew, would you not arm yourself to some extent if you're sailing in the Gulf of Aden? I would think there would have to be a good reason behind it.
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I heard on tv yesterday that it causes all sorts of complications with porting at different countries. Another reason they stated was insurers usually do not want the crew armed.

If I was traveling in that area, I sure as hell would want to have a weapon on me.
 
#48
#48
vols4sure said:
I heard on tv yesterday that it causes all sorts of complications with porting at different countries. Another reason they stated was insurers usually do not want the crew armed.

If I was traveling in that area, I sure as hell would want to have a weapon on me.
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That's kinda what I was thinking. Plus I'm sure if the crew got in a wild west shootout with pirates (obligatory swinging from the rigging joke here) and one of the crew died, it would be a PR nightmare for the shipping company. Lawsuits would undoubtedly ensue.
 
#49
#49
DC Vol said:
That's kinda what I was thinking. Plus I'm sure if the crew got in a wild west shootout with pirates (obligatory swinging from the rigging joke here) and one of the crew died, it would be a PR nightmare for the shipping company. Lawsuits would undoubtedly ensue.
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Lawsuits vs. Ransom

Tough situation.
 
#50
#50
utvolpj said:
one of my first thoughts was "where are these guys?" but figured I had watched too many movies.
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I did a little math the other day and figured each of our ships must patrol around 2,000 square miles. (or that could be 20,000 sq mi., I forgot)

At any rate, a blockade of Somali ports seems a more viable solution. Peaceful fishermen and/or merchant vessels could be allowed to pass but those armed with piracy on their mind could be dealt with. The muslim pirates of Indonesia have been a problem also.
 
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