Official Global Warming thread (merged)

#7,826
#7,826
Orangedogsrule said:
Aral Sea. It's gone. Mankind did it. Changed the whole region's climate and wrecked ecosystems, livelyhoods (especially fishing which it killed) and lives.

The dust storms over the dry seabed pick up remains of toxic fertilizer, pesticides, and herbicides and spread it over towns that used to be seaside. A mother's milk could kill her own baby inside two weeks.

research Aral Sea Disaster
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Brought to you by the same people that brought you Chernobyl...
 
#7,827
#7,827
I worked at ORNL for a very brief time. The project I collaborated on was lead by a geophysicist who was a brilliant guy. But his livelihood was dependent on getting funding for his projects. Because of the political environment, he knew that he'd be more likely to get funding if the project was in some way tied to "global warming" and land government $$. So that's what he did. Perhaps that will change soon...
 
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#7,828
#7,828
GAVol said:
Agreed. This has nothing to do with science and everything to do with economics.
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Funny you mention that:

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-climatechange-german-carmakers-idUSKBN18T1Q0?il=0

Germany's powerful car industry said Europe would need to reassess its environmental standards to remain competitive after the United States said it would withdraw from the Paris climate pact.

President Donald Trump said on Thursday he would withdraw the United States from the landmark 2015 global agreement to fight climate change, drawing anger and condemnation from world leaders and heads of industry.

"The regrettable announcement by the USA makes it inevitable that Europe must facilitate a cost efficient and economically feasible climate policy to remain internationally competitive," Matthias Wissmann, president of the German auto industry lobby group VDA, said in a statement on Friday.

"The preservation of our competitive position is the precondition for successful climate protection. This correlation is often underestimated," Wissmann said, adding that the decision by the Unites States was disappointing.
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But, but, but I thought this Treaty was going to be just peachy for everyone! Now the they want to change the environmental regulations since the US will have an "unfair" advantage?
 
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#7,829
#7,829
The last haven the left is targeting is wealth... They have conquered education, the courts and social norms.. Not get the money
 
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#7,831
#7,831
The irony...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4568844/Bloomberg-mayors-form-climate-coalition.html

US mayors have announced that they will work on their own to meet the agreements of the Paris Climate Accord.

In defiance of President Donald Trump's announcement that he had withdrawn the US from the 2015 pact, more than 1,400 mayors of American cities with populations of 30,000 or more have formed the US Conference of Mayors and agreed to meet environmental goals.

'We don't need Washington to tell us,' the Republican mayor of Burnsville, Minnesota, Elizabeth Kautz told CBS News.
'We're going to do it because it's the right thing to do.'

Jon Mitchell, the Democrat mayor of New Bedford, Massachusetts, said that several initiatives have long been underway in US cities across the country. Such examples include LED lighting, proliferation of solar technology, and bike-share programs.

'Americans don't need Washington to meet our Paris commitment, and Americans are not going to let Washington stand in the way of fulfilling it,' he said.
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It took Trump saying no to an international treaty for them to sack up and do such things? Oh Lawd...
 
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#7,833
#7,833
roosterjbh said:
Off topic, but I believe Nikki Haley has a good chance at becoming our first female president.
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She hasn't been targeted by the left yet.

She's a racist, sexist, ultra right wing religious nut that clings to her guns and...what religion is she?

(Just getting the early start on the screeching)
 
#7,834
#7,834
Grand Vol said:
She hasn't been targeted by the left yet.

She's a racist, sexist, ultra right wing religious nut that clings to her guns and...what religion is she?

(Just getting the early start on the screeching)
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She came into the spotlight with her decision to remove the confederate flag from the SC capital after the Charleston shootings.

Idk, I think she'd be pretty tough imo
 
#7,835
#7,835
roosterjbh said:
She came into the spotlight with her decision to remove the confederate flag from the SC capital after the Charleston shootings.

Idk, I think she'd be pretty tough imo
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Don't underestimate the left's ability to go after someone just because of the letter behind their name.
 
#7,836
#7,836
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#7,837
#7,837
Rasputin_Vol said:
More private sector money being promised. Trump is a genius. he's going to get these liberals so mad that they put up their own money to prop up this agreement.

Michael Bloomberg pledges his own money to help U.N. after Trump pulls out of Paris climate deal
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He's getting cities and States to buy into the treaty without having the Federal Government shove their nose into it. From my link earlier:

However, the White House appeared to encourage cooperation among local and state entities on their own.

'If a mayor or a governor wants to enact a policy...they're accountable to their own voters and that's what they should do,' said Press Secretary Sean Spicer. 'We believe in states' rights and so, if a locality, municipality or a state wants to enact a policy that their voters, or their citizens believe in, then that's what they should do.'
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Crazy talk! Political decisions being kept at a lower level without the big government having to get involved?

Say it ain't so!
 
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#7,838
#7,838
BartW said:
So what part of the art of the deal involves trading all the leverage in the world for absolutely nothing?

Let’s clear up a few things. The Donald’s decision is not about climate change, coal miners, or the American economy. It’s not about renegotiating a “better deal” for America. I see a few of you whining that Italy, Germany, and France don’t want to ‘renegotiate’. That’s a delay tactic; we’ve been negotiating for decades. What is there to renegotiate? All of the commitments are voluntary. The only thing the Paris Climate Agreement asks is that each country have an emissions reductions goal, submit its plan detailing how it will reach said emissions reduction goal, and that countries get together to review their progress every five years. The $3 billion commitment to the Green Climate Fund, of which we only paid out $1 billion, is not going to wreck our economy. China, who already spends much more money investing in clean energy than the US, had already committed $3.1 billion (that’s right, they’re paying in, not cashing out). China and Europe have already stated they will step up to fill the void left by the US. Considering we managed to negotiate “Loss and Damage” out of the PCA in exchange for the GCF, that really was already a great deal for the world’s historically largest CO2 emitter.

And remember, the commitments were VOLUNTARY. If Trump wanted to “renegotiate” the deal, he could have simply resubmitted a far less ambitious plan (like Russia) and not sent any money to the GCF, while maintaining a seat at the table. This was not about an imaginary burden on the US economy. As this insightful piece puts it



Trumpites think we’re putting the coal miners back to work. Trump loves "clean, clean, coal", right? Wrong. He proposed cutting 85% of DoE’s budget for carbon capture technology, the only thing that could possibly make coal viable in the long term (and that’s still decades away if it ever materializes). But ditching climate change efforts will totally bring back coal jobs right?

Top US coal boss Robert Murray: Trump 'can't bring mining jobs back'

Coal has been on a downward spiral for decades and is dying out now due to competition from cheap natural gas and alternatives, not because of Obama, not because of Paris. And even if Trump managed to slow coal’s death spiral, it wouldn’t help the coal miners. For years’ coal’s business model has been to extract more coal with fewer people. Mechanization. And if it’s about jobs, why are we trying to revive an industry that employs fewer people than Arby’s. Heck, solar alone already employs twice as many people as coal. One sector is growing rapidly and the other… not so much.

So what have we accomplished? We’ve alienated our allies in the international community. We’ve lost whatever respect and influence we still had. We lost our ability to hold other countries accountable under the PCA. We are surrendering our position as a leader in the future energy economy. We are no longer the leaders of the free world. For what? Donald Trump gave up all that political capital for what? Art of the deal LOL


On the bright side, this will finally thrust the climate change issue into the spotlight in the US. Apparently the Donald has indicated that they will do the 4 year withdrawal from the PCA but not the UNFCCC. That means the earliest the US could withdraw is Nov. 4, 2020 – the day after the next presidential election.
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They said "we will not negotiate", their words.
 
#7,839
#7,839
joevol33 said:
They said "we will not negotiate", their words.
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It's called "facts." Little too much for some on here.

Truth be told, I'm surprised Bart made it this long before posting. Still waiting on some form of reference to the tobacco lobby getting hold of Trump in some way.
 
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#7,840
#7,840
hog88 said:
Who's denying the climate is/could be changing? I'm highly skeptical man is the cause of the climate changing.

Here is where the man made global warming alarmist lose me, we are not stopping the climate changing so why keep spending huge sums of money studying how it can be stopped. Why not spend that money on how we can live through it?
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This.
I've said this 100 times.

All you have to do is look at the history of this planet to realize it's changed many times. The cause of the change or rate of change is debatable. Let's figure out how to survive it.
 
#7,843
#7,843
#7,845
#7,845
All of the climate change zealots (i.e. the super rich liberals) contribute 100's times of CO2 that the average American does. If they're are so concerned, let them give up their private planes, the huge yachts, the limos that shuttle them around. I'm really sick of the super climate change idiots like Al Gore, who had a $10,000 electric bill at his mansion in Nashville harping on the US needing to do more.
F those people, put up or shut up.
 
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#7,846
#7,846
VolStrom said:
All of the climate change zealots (i.e. the super rich liberals) contribute 100's times of CO2 that the average American does. If they're are so concerned, let them give up their private planes, the huge yachts, the limos that shuttle them around. I'm really sick of the super climate change idiots like Al Gore, who had a $10,000 electric bill at his mansion in Nashville harping on the US needing to do more.
F those people, put up or shut up.
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They're not giving up their lifestyle. They want us middle class workers taxed to death to pay for people to "stop it".
 
#7,847
#7,847
Rasputin_Vol said:
I knew this was a bad deal, but the way these countries and personalities are belly aching about it only indicates that this mut have been some next level con job.
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Exactly.... throw in the " there will be no renegotiated re-entry" comment by the French and you get confirmation
 
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#7,849
#7,849
Vols4us said:
FWIW

http://www.who.int/phe/health_topic...AP_database_summary_results_2016_v02.pdf?ua=1

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story or meltdown. Better than the rest of the G-7 and obviously blow away Russia, China, India, etc.
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“The mean annual concentration of fine suspended particles of less than 2.5 microns in diameter is a common measure of air pollution,” the WHO states.

The WHO report is corroborated by a series of other such studies on air and water pollution.

In a recent list of the 25 cleanest cities in the world, the only country to boast three cities among the cleanest on the planet was the United States of America, with Chicago coming in second place, Honolulu coming in fourth, and Portland, OR, coming in sixteenth. Unsurprisingly, no cities from China, Russia or India made the list at all.

Similarly, another list of the 15 most polluted cities in the world featured three cities from China, three cities from Saudi Arabia, and a whopping seven cities from India. No U.S. city made the list.
 
#7,850
#7,850
Persian Vol said:
Like I said in an earlier post, urban areas are polluted because of the concentrated population in comparison to rural areas. But because urban areas are concentrated which leads to obvious pollution, that doesn't mean that the accumulation of rural pollution in this country are any less prevalent. If anything liberal urban areas would probably produce less pollution due to walkability and public transportation of urban areas.
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I would say it does. The heat island effect, more cooling needed. Less green space per person. also steel is a much less green material than wood to build with. increased lighting requirements. and sadly most American cities don't use enough public transit to offset the population.

this is also not considering various other green factors, growing your own food, solar panels are generally not an option for someone to add in the city.

also also, it depends on how you consider suburbia.
 
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