On paper, which team is better?

#26
#26
It will be fascinating to see how this team comes together. Chemistry can be a fragile thing with so many new critical faces, but you have to like that fact that Zeigler, Mashack and lesser extent Gainey are experienced guys who can instill culture. We are least 9 deep which is one more guy in the rotation better than last year. Offensively while I doubt our starters will average as much as last year (mainly due to DK), I think our bench has capability to average 30 ppg which is far above the 20 ppg our bench had last year. Should have alot more balance offensively and maybe more difficult to gameplan for. Will miss DK when the offense breaks down and he took over but at least we have options. With DK it wasn't just his production #'s, it was his attitude and confidence that may be most difficult to replace. Defensively, on frontcourt we will be better and will have better shot blocking. Backcourt defensively, Lanier just needs to improve alot but it isn't as if he isn't athletic enough as we can assured that Barnes (and Zeigler/Mashack) will force him to be at least decent, much like he did this past year with Knecht.

We will miss the experience in the lineup with JJJ/Vescovi but I think that may be a bit overrated, given production #. We will miss post offense from Aidoo and energy off the bench from Awaka. Knecht has to be replaced by multiple guys who step up because he was a generational offensive talent.

But...
We are deeper. Should be able to run more in transition and still be able to cause stress on defensively for entire game. May be able to dictate pace of the game more due to depth.
We have more accomplished perimeter shooters everywhere (especially at the 4 with both Milicic and Dubar)
I think our rebounding especially on defensive end should be better. May be a wash on offensive end.
Have more size across the board and should improve shot blocking.
Will have better options to backup Zeigler at PG when he needs a blow (personally I think Lanier should get at least 10 minutes here., as he is unselfish)
Should have better scoring off bench as you would expect both Gainey and Carr will both elevate game. (and one of either Milicic, Dubar or Mashack is also coming off the bench and Estrella/Phillips.)
I think we have multiple guys who we can run our halfcourt offense through. Zeigler, Lanier and Milicic (at high post..;he can pass)
High ball screens with various combos (Zeigler/Okpara and Lanier/Milicic) gives us options.
Overall, while we still lack a solid post, I think we are more versatile offensively and can exploit different matchups game to game.

In halfcourt, we have Zeigler and Lanier who will be occupy the middle of the floor at top of the key, orchestrate and be able to create off the bounce, either direction. You have the defensive wing stopper in Mashack who will help mask any deficiencies from Lanier by guarding whomever the opposing teams best wing may be. You have Dubar who will live in the corners beyond the 3 pt line and on the baseline. He can take advantage of bigs at the 4 (from outside) and take advantage of smaller guys at the 3 (in the post).

Milicic, frankly won't be our leading scorer, (I think top 2 will be Lanier and Dubar in any order)), but I think he may have the most NBA upside ability (among the 3 incoming transfer seniors). Guy has a very quick shot from perimeter at 6'10, prepares early with his feet before catching the ball and moves without the ball very well. We can run alot of the same stuff we did with Knecht for him off screens, but I doubt he has an alpha scoring mentality that DK had. Igor I think will be our glue guy because he can really do just about everything pretty well. Opkara is a very quick jumper, especially off 2nd jump and other than rebound, run the floor, block shots, rim runner, screen and catch lobs he isn't going to be asked to be a primary post scorer.

With all the above, if we are better, it will be due to our bench. Estrella, Carr, Gainey, etc..... With spotlight on Carr because he has potential to be the best wing we have. The three things I will be looking at initially is 1) whether Dubar is in the starting lineup at either the 3 (next to Milicic) or at the 4 (next to Mashack). If Dubar is starting, that will tell me that Barnes thinks he provides the "best" offensive punch to replace a % of Knecht's production at forward spot. And 2) will Milicic be the 1st backup to Okpara with minutes at the 5. And 3) how quick is Carr getting on the floor at either the 2 or 3. A lineup of Milicic, Dubar, Carr, Lanier and Zeigler on the floor at the same time would be a ridiculous amount of perimeter shooters.

If guys play up to their capabilities, younger guys improve, we continue to be among top 10 defensively, play with confidence when game isn't going your way (DK bailed us out so many times this past year) and embrace sacrificing for the team's best interests, UT can win the SEC again, which would be the first time we went back-to-back conference champions since the 40's. We definitely have the lineup, on paper, to win it.
 
#29
#29
Every season is different, even when you have the same players. On paper though, we have every chance to be as good as last year, or even better. About everything has to go well, in order for that (even better) to happen though. I am expecting at least a top 25 team, with a chance to win in every game we play. That's about all you can ask for with the turnover we have had.
 
#30
#30
Last year's team or this years?
I could be wrong, but I think going into the year, this team has better numbers on average and those who are coming back have yet another year under their belt. So, I’m picking this team. Downside is the majority of them have not played together, so chemistry will have to come along quickly during the offseason.
 
#34
#34
Most Volunteer Basketball fans did not know how good the 2023-34 team was going to be. Most of us did not know the impact that Dalton was going to have. Once Tennessee went to Michigan St. and won that pre-season game, we realized that we could be pretty good. However I don't think, even after our showing in Hawaii, we still knew what our possibilities were. But, when we went to North Carolina and battled them to the wire, we realized that we were legit.
This coming season, at this point, we are hopeful and we are excited. But, there are many qintaniglibes that we don't know yet. Last season's chemistry ended up being our strength. In one season our players became really close. How many times did we hear DK say how thankful he was that the team accepted him so well? Will that happen with the 2024-25 team? We don't know. If the chemistry comes together, the upcoming season could be special. Coach Barnes and staff have done a remarkable job of reloading this roster for a deep run and a possible Natty. It's going to be interesting to see how hungry the 2024-25 Vols are and how much they care about each other.
 
#35
#35
Most Volunteer Basketball fans did not know how good the 2023-34 team was going to be. Most of us did not know the impact that Dalton was going to have. Once Tennessee went to Michigan St. and won that pre-season game, we realized that we could be pretty good. However I don't think, even after our showing in Hawaii, we still knew what our possibilities were. But, when we went to North Carolina and battled them to the wire, we realized that we were legit.
This coming season, at this point, we are hopeful and we are excited. But, there are many qintaniglibes that we don't know yet. Last season's chemistry ended up being our strength. In one season our players became really close. How many times did we hear DK say how thankful he was that the team accepted him so well? Will that happen with the 2024-25 team? We don't know. If the chemistry comes together, the upcoming season could be special. Coach Barnes and staff have done a remarkable job of reloading this roster for a deep run and a possible Natty. It's going to be interesting to see how hungry the 2024-25 Vols are and how much they care about each other.
Last year I personally knew we were going to be as good as we ended up being, I predicted a final 4 team. The difference in my scouting from our portal guy Dalton is that he was an athletic guy that had displayed the ability to create his own shot, handle the rock and rise above defenders at North Col.
We overall had not much portal success before him in this new portal era which started with EJ anosike who could not effectively spread the floor the team who already struggled with outside shooting having two guys on the court at the same time Pons & Fulky who the defenders did not need to respect outside, adding EJ was just a bad fit that season because there was always two guys on the court who could not shoot at the same time and that limited our ceiling... Then the next year having a guy who had not played for an entire year due to injury in Tyreke Key, I did not expect much from him from the start because in his film he was in no way a true point guard but he had the height of a point guard. Also I noticed he did not have the athleticism or speed or length to provide us exactly what we needed as a main scoring option - more length and athleticism and ballhandling abilities were needed for the SEC on our team... Not hating on Key but was just a quick pre szn breakdown that year that I knew he could have games like he had against Gonzaga but overall would be extremely inconsistent.... And that's the big difference in a guy like Dalton Knecht - he checked off all of the boxes that were needed for success...

This coaching staff done a phenomenal job of putting together guys who are mature hungry and willing to fit in. Dalton last year in preseason before the Michigan State game was told that the offense was going to be ran through him - I had predicted him being our main leading scorer at around 15 to 16 points per game on the season and we all know how wrong I was he was much better...

But this team has the length, athleticism, shot creation, ballhandling, offense, defense, leadership, heart etc to make it happen. The main difference with this team is we don't have two 5 year culture guys, but I honestly believe everything good that they brought to our team can be replicated, as we will look different, yet just as efficient especially offensively. It won't be that hard to find points from the starting lineup or especially coming off the bench. We will have at least three starting caliber players coming off the bench who are all gifted offensively. And defensively all of these guys are going to buy in - 6'10" Igor is European and an extreme competitor, real mature. 6'11" Okpara is an upgrade overall defensively down low. 6'8" Dubar is just another big strong versatile guy who can defend multiple positions. Chaz Lanier is an option 1 who is vocal about and humble enough to buy in defensively to prove himself...

Sorry for the rant everyone but there is no reason to believe that this team is not final four caliber. After breaking all of that down I see the ceiling just as high as this past year and I predict a final four. The main thing we need to do is to stay healthy and to stay together if all of our guys can be injury free than a national championship + another SEC champ is the ceiling in my humble opinion
 
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#36
#36
Last years team returned a lot of proven HERE in this system talent. Last years team had lots of proven chemistry developed over years. So on paper its not even close.

Lets be nice call Lanier/Knecht a wash
ZZ is ZZ probably will be better this season.
We became more dynamic at the 4 but same situation at the 5 really. The season that Santi and JJJ had were very underrated and their importance to this team will be felt.
Could this team be better possibly? sure especially if we use that last spot for a post-player that can contribute. Even then I'm not trading last years team for this roster till they have proven something on the court. We have ZZ, Mashack and Gainey as our only proven players.

People calling Okpara an upgrade over to Aidoo are suffering from serious Copium. He played in the Big 10 for a terrible OSU team that finished 9th.. in the big 10 playing a big 10 schedule. Averaged the same amount of minutes as Aidoo and put up worse stats in an arguably worse league. He also had the exact same problems as Aidoo against bigger post players he fouled out. VS Edey in their 1 matchup 16 mins 5 fouls 1 block..0 points 0 rebounds...He totaled more fouls and more turnovers in less games. Oh, he started as a Sophomore when Aidoo didn't? OSU last year had a worse front-court situation than we did. He got more blocks vs a worse schedule and every other stat was markedly worse than Aidoo worse shooter, worse free throw shooter, turns the ball over more, fouls more, also loses in hairdo department. I am hoping Barnes can put some development magic on him but calling him an upgrade on paper is insane. Dubar and Igor are the only valid arguments and I am not taking Dubar over JJJ though Igor over Awaka is something I can vote on. But neither of them is a defensive replacement for the guy whose spot they sit in... so where are these clear upgrades?
 
#37
#37
Last years team returned a lot of proven HERE in this system talent. Last years team had lots of proven chemistry developed over years. So on paper its not even close.

Lets be nice call Lanier/Knecht a wash
ZZ is ZZ probably will be better this season.
We became more dynamic at the 4 but same situation at the 5 really. The season that Santi and JJJ had were very underrated and their importance to this team will be felt.
Could this team be better possibly? sure especially if we use that last spot for a post-player that can contribute. Even then I'm not trading last years team for this roster till they have proven something on the court. We have ZZ, Mashack and Gainey as our only proven players.

People calling Okpara an upgrade over to Aidoo are suffering from serious Copium. He played in the Big 10 for a terrible OSU team that finished 9th.. in the big 10 playing a big 10 schedule. Averaged the same amount of minutes as Aidoo and put up worse stats in an arguably worse league. He also had the exact same problems as Aidoo against bigger post players he fouled out. VS Edey in their 1 matchup 16 mins 5 fouls 1 block..0 points 0 rebounds...He totaled more fouls and more turnovers in less games. Oh, he started as a Sophomore when Aidoo didn't? OSU last year had a worse front-court situation than we did. He got more blocks vs a worse schedule and every other stat was markedly worse than Aidoo worse shooter, worse free throw shooter, turns the ball over more, fouls more, also loses in hairdo department. I am hoping Barnes can put some development magic on him but calling him an upgrade on paper is insane. Dubar and Igor are the only valid arguments and I am not taking Dubar over JJJ though Igor over Awaka is something I can vote on. But neither of them is a defensive replacement for the guy whose spot they sit in... so where are these clear upgrades?
You make some valid points. How this team accepts coaching and how they work together is going to be huge. I believe the talent is there, but will the chemistry come together. CRB has a history of bringing teams together. We will see. I just like what our coaches have done with reloading this roster.
 
#38
#38
Last years team returned a lot of proven HERE in this system talent. Last years team had lots of proven chemistry developed over years. So on paper its not even close.

Lets be nice call Lanier/Knecht a wash
ZZ is ZZ probably will be better this season.
We became more dynamic at the 4 but same situation at the 5 really. The season that Santi and JJJ had were very underrated and their importance to this team will be felt.
Could this team be better possibly? sure especially if we use that last spot for a post-player that can contribute. Even then I'm not trading last years team for this roster till they have proven something on the court. We have ZZ, Mashack and Gainey as our only proven players.

People calling Okpara an upgrade over to Aidoo are suffering from serious Copium. He played in the Big 10 for a terrible OSU team that finished 9th.. in the big 10 playing a big 10 schedule. Averaged the same amount of minutes as Aidoo and put up worse stats in an arguably worse league. He also had the exact same problems as Aidoo against bigger post players he fouled out. VS Edey in their 1 matchup 16 mins 5 fouls 1 block..0 points 0 rebounds...He totaled more fouls and more turnovers in less games. Oh, he started as a Sophomore when Aidoo didn't? OSU last year had a worse front-court situation than we did. He got more blocks vs a worse schedule and every other stat was markedly worse than Aidoo worse shooter, worse free throw shooter, turns the ball over more, fouls more, also loses in hairdo department. I am hoping Barnes can put some development magic on him but calling him an upgrade on paper is insane. Dubar and Igor are the only valid arguments and I am not taking Dubar over JJJ though Igor over Awaka is something I can vote on. But neither of them is a defensive replacement for the guy whose spot they sit in... so where are these clear upgrades?
In your comparison of Aido and Okpara you're comparing soph to Jr. Okpara had 82 blks as a soph this season. aido had 44 his soph season. Okpara also shot a higher percentage than aido as a soph, except from the ft line. Also had more rbs as a soph. Just sayin.
 
#40
#40
In your comparison of Aido and Okpara you're comparing soph to Jr. Okpara had 82 blks as a soph this season. aido had 44 his soph season. Okpara also shot a higher percentage than aido as a soph, except from the ft line. Also had more rbs as a soph. Just sayin.
I addressed that in my post. Comparing their sophomore seasons is ridiculous. Aidoo was not a starter and played on a team with actual size in front of him. He started 9 games that year and logged 640 minutes. Okpara played 826 mins. In those almost 200 less minutes, Aidoo got more steals, assists. If you take their stats and look at per 36 there is one stat only that Okpara beats him in no matter how you compare and that's blocks... and the slight difference there does not make up for him being significantly worse at everything else. Everything Aidoo is bad at he is worse. Aidoo is good for 2 fouls a game.. Okpara 3. AIdoo is gonna get you an assist per game.. Okpara one every second game. Leave Aidoo wide open he will at least feel disrespected and chuck one up. Free throws? Okparas best season ever is not even close to Aidoos worst.

So Okpara has gotten more blocks than Aidoo no matter how you compare them and even that's a thing he seems slightly better at playing on a much worse team. That matters because it's easy to rack up on blocks when everyone has an express lane to the basket. OSU is not a good basketball team. The big 10 outside of Purdue and Illinois was a terrible conference last year. They won 2 games vs ranked teams out of 7 tries.. Okpara wants a factor in either of those wins. He had a grand total of 2 points 2 blocks 10 rebounds and 9 fouls in those games. Oh yeah the Bama game counted for all those stats except for 1 block and 5 fouls.

Not trying to crap on this kid. Barnes signed him so I have faith he is decent and he feels there is potential. But outside of that there is nothing any logical person not drunk on copium can point out he is demonstrably better at than AIdoo other than blocking shots and that's questionable given resume. there is a reason AIdoo was ranked a top10 portal guy and he was in the top 30. I tried to look in OSU fan forums for any mentions of him.. but OSU forums barely even mention basketball much less him. No one is talking about the kid outside of Knoxville.

to summarize the only explanations I have heard to justify him being a clear upgrade are

1. If you compare his sophomore year when he started on a terrible team he got more blocks than Aidoo did, in significantly less minutes, in his sophomore team which he played on a tourney-bound ranked team behind veterans?
2 we hate everyone who transfers out so anyone that replaces them has to of course be better?
3 Math is a hoax? Logic is a witch hunt?
 
#41
#41
I addressed that in my post. Comparing their sophomore seasons is ridiculous. Aidoo was not a starter and played on a team with actual size in front of him. He started 9 games that year and logged 640 minutes. Okpara played 826 mins. In those almost 200 less minutes, Aidoo got more steals, assists. If you take their stats and look at per 36 there is one stat only that Okpara beats him in no matter how you compare and that's blocks... and the slight difference there does not make up for him being significantly worse at everything else. Everything Aidoo is bad at he is worse. Aidoo is good for 2 fouls a game.. Okpara 3. AIdoo is gonna get you an assist per game.. Okpara one every second game. Leave Aidoo wide open he will at least feel disrespected and chuck one up. Free throws? Okparas best season ever is not even close to Aidoos worst.

So Okpara has gotten more blocks than Aidoo no matter how you compare them and even that's a thing he seems slightly better at playing on a much worse team. That matters because it's easy to rack up on blocks when everyone has an express lane to the basket. OSU is not a good basketball team. The big 10 outside of Purdue and Illinois was a terrible conference last year. They won 2 games vs ranked teams out of 7 tries.. Okpara wants a factor in either of those wins. He had a grand total of 2 points 2 blocks 10 rebounds and 9 fouls in those games. Oh yeah the Bama game counted for all those stats except for 1 block and 5 fouls.

Not trying to crap on this kid. Barnes signed him so I have faith he is decent and he feels there is potential. But outside of that there is nothing any logical person not drunk on copium can point out he is demonstrably better at than AIdoo other than blocking shots and that's questionable given resume. there is a reason AIdoo was ranked a top10 portal guy and he was in the top 30. I tried to look in OSU fan forums for any mentions of him.. but OSU forums barely even mention basketball much less him. No one is talking about the kid outside of Knoxville.

to summarize the only explanations I have heard to justify him being a clear upgrade are

1. If you compare his sophomore year when he started on a terrible team he got more blocks than Aidoo did, in significantly less minutes, in his sophomore team which he played on a tourney-bound ranked team behind veterans?
2 we hate everyone who transfers out so anyone that replaces them has to of course be better?
3 Math is a hoax? Logic is a witch hunt?
…tl; dr?
 
#42
#42
2 we hate everyone who transfers out so anyone that replaces them has to of course be better?
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It's comical sometimes; everyone has a coping mechanism. I'll be tickled if Okpara winds up being as effective as Aidoo or Awaka, but I am def not expecting that at this time. Not to say that it will make or break our season - he just needs to play good D and go up strong close to the rim imo.
 
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#43
#43
I’m excited about the 2024 season but I think chemistry will be the deciding factor here.
Agree--last year, we had lots of experience in playing together; bringing in Knecht was really the only new piece to the puzzle (and what a piece it was). With so many new pieces, and a loss of all that experience, I think it will be tougher to get the right chemistry.

And defensively, this year's team won't be as strong. Despite Santi and JJJ's periodic absences offensively, they were always there defensively. I am not sure we have that in this year's team
 
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#44
#44
Agree--last year, we had lots of experience in playing together; bringing in Knecht was really the only new piece to the puzzle (and what a piece it was). With so many new pieces, and a loss of all that experience, I think it will be tougher to get the right chemistry.
They will buy in quick or won’t play.

Not too worried about chemistry, especially since we have Barnes and not Muss lol
 
#45
#45
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It's comical sometimes; everyone has a coping mechanism. I'll be tickled if Okpara winds up being as effective as Aidoo or Awaka, but I am def not expecting that at this time. Not to say that it will make or break our season - he just needs to play good D and go up strong close to the rim imo.
His play definitely make or break the season he is our only true post on roster. I have no worries, he will play just fine. Just all the whole.. he's a clear upgrade is a bit premature and deluded. Could he end up being an upgrade? maybe but there is no proof that's gonna happen or will happen outside of Barnes track record.
 
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#46
#46
His play definitely make or break the season he is our only true post on roster. I have no worries, he will play just fine. Just all the whole.. he's a clear upgrade is a bit premature and deluded. Could he end up being an upgrade? maybe but there is no proof that's gonna happen or will happen outside of Barnes track record.
You don’t consider Estrella a true post at the same height as FO?
 
#47
#47
You don’t consider Estrella a true post at the same height as FO?
No.. height has nothing to do with being a true post. Is Kevin Durant a post-player? He is the same size as Estrella. Is Karl Anthony Towns a post-player? Until proven otherwise Estrella is a project. No I am not comparing Estrella to either of those 2 guys lol I am just pointing out that being 6'10 plus does not make you a postplayer. But I should have added the qualifier 'proven'. We right now have slightly better depth in the post than we had last year on paper. if Dubar=JJJ that's an upgrade sizewise in the post. Igor=upgrade over Awaka in size. I feel a lot better about us going against bigger teams than I did last year. This is all assuming Igor can playsome minutes at the 5 or Estrella develops. I don't think he is hopeless just no evidence on record yet.

There is a greater chance Estrella and Philips will be much better players next year than not. But its highly likely, not guaranteed. One thing even the few Barnes haters left out there even have to admit is this staff are proven talent developers. Remember Uros' first 2 years? People gave up on him altogether but some projects take more time.
 

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