Rating classes

#51
#51
Someone please tell Saban that recruiting rankings and stars are meaningless.
 
#52
#52
SmokeyFTW said:
I think Bama is disproving your theory as I'm posting this. Stars matter.
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And Bryce Brown disproves the other theory. If you don't think Saban is THE difference at Bama then you're crazy!

Yes, talent is important but it's what you do with that talent. Give Bama Dooley and UT Saban....would Bama be holding the trophy and would UT be 5-7? NO & NO!
 
#53
#53
Boca Vol said:
And Bryce Brown disproves the other theory. If you don't think Saban is THE difference at Bama then you're crazy!

Yes, talent is important but it's what you do with that talent. Give Bama Dooley and UT Saban....would Bama be holding the trophy and would UT be 5-7? NO & NO!
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?? Bryce Brown has proven his talent in the NFL. The stars were correct. He just was in a bad situation with his coach leaving and a loser taking the coaches place.
 
#54
#54
k-town_king said:
?? Bryce Brown has proven his talent in the NFL. The stars were correct. He just was in a bad situation with his coach leaving and a loser taking the coaches place.
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What did Bryce Brown do for UT? Nothing! That's all that matters in recruiting. Yes, he was a 5* talent but a head case. Coaches leave all the time. Supposedly he went to K State to play with his brother...how did that work out? It didn't.
 
#55
#55
Boca Vol said:
And Bryce Brown disproves the other theory. If you don't think Saban is THE difference at Bama then you're crazy!

Yes, talent is important but it's what you do with that talent. Give Bama Dooley and UT Saban....would Bama be holding the trophy and would UT be 5-7? NO & NO!
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So you think its ok to have a #20 ranked class all the time? And still be able to compete with the best?
 
#57
#57
Boca Vol said:
What did Bryce Brown do for UT? Nothing! That's all that matters in recruiting. Yes, he was a 5* talent but a head case. Coaches leave all the time. Supposedly he went to K State to play with his brother...how did that work out? It didn't.
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He is in the NFL. It did work out. :crazy:
 
#58
#58
99gator said:
Saban is the best in the business and he would win jack with classes consistently ranked 20th
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Exactly, that's what I was getting at. He would win some game, but competing for SEC championship I don't think so. So my point to BocaVol was that to get highly ranked class' s you need to recruit kids with*'s. That's what get you in the top 10+ ranked class's.
 
#59
#59
SmokeyFTW said:
So you think its ok to have a #20 ranked class all the time? And still be able to compete with the best?
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Ask Nebraska what their recruiting rankings were in the 80's & 90's. They had a bunch of kids that didn't even play 11 man football on their teams. Recruiting rankings don't mean squat if you don't do anything with them. See USC...I know they've been on probation but their classes have still been ranked very highly.

Defaultuser said:
He is in the NFL. It did work out. :crazy:
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I didn't realize UT was recruiting for the NFL.

So the mere fact that UT signed Bryce Brown and he didn't do anything at UT is good enough for you? You can't be that stupid! So if UT went out and signed 22 5* players and on Signing Day were declared the "winner" of Signing Day but all of them were ineligible come August you would still be happy....because of what they did in Feb?
 
#60
#60
Boca Vol said:
And Bryce Brown disproves the other theory. If you don't think Saban is THE difference at Bama then you're crazy!

Yes, talent is important but it's what you do with that talent. Give Bama Dooley and UT Saban....would Bama be holding the trophy and would UT be 5-7? NO & NO!
Click to expand...

Maybe, but getting 2* and 3* recruits that are descent gets you started on the right track with good coaching. Then after a ok season with those players. Puts you in a position to start getting better players. I don't think Bama is gonna turn down the 5* and 4* guys or trade them in for 2 and 3* kids, and still expect to stay on top. I'm sure that's where all UT fans and CBJ wants to be. # RiseToTheTop.
So in short. High * players get you high ranked class's , and high ranked class's gets you competing for championships.

Mid 20 to 20 ranked class's keep you average, and average won't cut it here.
 
#61
#61
Boca Vol said:
Ask Nebraska what their recruiting rankings were in the 80's & 90's. They had a bunch of kids that didn't even play 11 man football on their teams. Recruiting rankings don't mean squat if you don't do anything with them. See USC...I know they've been on probation but their classes have still been ranked very highly.



I didn't realize UT was recruiting for the NFL.

So the mere fact that UT signed Bryce Brown and he didn't do anything at UT is good enough for you? You can't be that stupid! So if UT went out and signed 22 5* players and on Signing Day were declared the "winner" of Signing Day but all of them were ineligible come August you would still be happy....because of what they did in Feb?
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That's deep man.

I don't agree with the star rating the way a lot of people do....this is how I see it.

Star rating shows potential for being coached up. All recruits have the potential...but some are better than others. Doesn't mean a two or three star can't be, just that the scout's don't see it as much as in the 4 0r 5* recruits.

The thing a lot of people overlook when they talk about taking say a 3* recruit and coaching them up is that the coaches who get the 5* recruits are also coaching them up.

I will go out on a limb here (actually not much of a limb) and say....there have NEVER been a 5* player in college football that was not coached up when they got to college.
 
#62
#62
Boca Vol,

So your saying with the same caliber coach on two diff. teams. One with 4 and 5* players, and the other team with 2 and 3* players. That the 2&3* team would win the majority of the time? If your not saying that, then I'm right. That stars do matter, and that get you a high ranked class, and competing for championships.
 
#63
#63
SmokeyFTW said:
Boca Vol,

So your saying with the same caliber coach on two diff. teams. One with 4 and 5* players, and the other team with 2 and 3* players. That the 2&3* team would win the majority of the time? If your not saying that, then I'm right. That stars do matter, and that get you a high ranked class, and competing for championships.
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The "*" ranking system was created to sell magazines, etc. They didn't exist back in the 80's and some of the 90's and somehow coaches managed to pull in great classes and win national titles. Why is a kid ranked as a 2* in some publications and a 4* in others?

Do you think Saban signs a kid simply because he's a 5* player? No.

I promise, Saban is more interested in the kid, family, work ethic, etc. than he is about his * rating.
 
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#66
#66
bamawriter said:
True.

But Alabama has had 5 straight Top 5 classes, and they won hardware in January.
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Would they have the hardware with Dooley coaching?

I'm not saying recruiting the best players isn't important. It's what you do with those players. Look at USC, pre-season #1 with a ton of 4&5* players and where did they end up?
 
#67
#67
Boca Vol said:
Would they have the hardware with Dooley coaching?

I'm not saying recruiting the best players isn't important. It's what you do with those players. Look at USC, pre-season #1 with a ton of 4&5* players and where did they end up?
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Coaching certainly matters, but you have to have the players. The best coaches tend to be great recruiters.
 
#68
#68
Think its fair to say you like the top 5 class, but its not all you need. But the coach that said this must have just recruited the 20th ranked class...
 
#69
#69
Depends on the coach doing the REAL evals. The top 10 classes of Bama and LSU look pretty good on the field too. Texas has consistently been in the top 5 over the past few years and struggles in a weakened Big 12. USC was not a very good team with a roster composed of players from top 10 classes. FSU should be dominating the ACC based on rankings.. they aren't. Auburn's last 3 classes were top 10 and they were horrible.

Oregon and Stanford have become pretty good programs without having top 10 recruiting classes on a consistent basis.

People focus on how successful programs have highly rated classes but ignore how many programs with high recruiting rankings do not perform well. Some of that is coaching. Some of it is a reflection of the inaccuracy of the rankings.
 
#70
#70
sjt18 said:
Depends on the coach doing the REAL evals. The top 10 classes of Bama and LSU look pretty good on the field too. Texas has consistently been in the top 5 over the past few years and struggles in a weakened Big 12. USC was not a very good team with a roster composed of players from top 10 classes. FSU should be dominating the ACC based on rankings.. they aren't. Auburn's last 3 classes were top 10 and they were horrible.

Oregon and Stanford have become pretty good programs without having top 10 recruiting classes on a consistent basis.

People focus on how successful programs have highly rated classes but ignore how many programs with high recruiting rankings do not perform well. Some of that is coaching. Some of it is a reflection of the inaccuracy of the rankings.
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Thank you, sjt18!

By the way, Manziel was a 3* qb coming out of HS.
 
#71
#71
TAM was very good this year. Their last 4 rankings were 22, 17, 27 (Manzel's class), and 15.
 
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