Scott Cochran to UGA as on-the-field Coach per Bruce Feldman (merged)

#101
#101
CR-vol said:
I'm just commenting on what seems to be prevailing sentiment on their boards. Some comments say that on average players across the board are getting smaller than they were in years past because today's game puts a premium on speed. I'm sure they're just trying to convince themselves it's no big deal and the process will roll on. I guess we'll see. At the very least Alabama needs to make an appearance in the NC game this season or the talk they're in decline is for real IMO.
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Please don’t take offense. None intended. Just my comments.
 
#102
#102
No I didn't man it's just the internet we're on the same team here. I REALLY hope this is another chink in the armor and they ARE declining. I will enjoy that much as they have the past 13 years. Their time is coming soon! If Cochran doesn't pan out for Kirby that will make the whole thing even funnier.
 
#103
#103
CR-vol said:
I'm just commenting on what seems to be prevailing sentiment on their boards. Some comments say that on average players across the board are getting smaller than they were in years past because today's game puts a premium on speed. I'm sure they're just trying to convince themselves it's no big deal and the process will roll on. I guess we'll see. At the very least Alabama needs to make an appearance in the NC game this season or the talk they're in decline is for real IMO.
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We can only hope that this is the start of the decline of bummer.
 
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#104
#104
05_never_again said:
It's a negative at a place like Georgia, which demands national championships. They fired Richt because his teams had regressed on the field and he didn't have a title that added to his job security to fall back on. Richt was just as good on the field in his first 4 years as Kirby has been. Fair or unfair, Kirby's got to show more (i.e., win a national title).

When you're comparing Richt and Kirby, I think it's key to use consistent timeframes of their careers. Kirby's first 4 years at Georgia look good compared to Richt's last 4 years at Georgia, but I'm not sure that is the best comparison. During each of their first 4 years, both coaches were these young, fresh-faced, great coordinators on their sides of the ball that injected some life back into the programs. Richt was never as good of a recruiter as Kirby was, but he was better than Donnan. Kirby has shown to be a better recruiter than Richt. All the other similarities are there. An install/retool year in year 1, an SEC title and top 3 finish in year 2 (...and Richt would have been in a 4-team playoff had one existed), and then a loss in the SECCG in year 3. On the field, Kirby has achieved more than Richt only in the number of division titles...Kirby made it back to the SECCG in year 4 and lost, while Richt did not make it to the SECCG in year 4 but did finish #7 overall.

Overall, this notion that Kirby is a way better coach than Richt is just a perception in people's minds, not borne out by any facts (so far). I think it's got a lot to do with Kirby being a hardass while Richt was this nice, almost meek guy, plus Kirby is a better recruiter and has played in a national championship game. But remember Richt also would have had a chance to play for a title in 2002 had a CFP existed. If a CFP didn't exist in 2017, Kirby wouldn't have had a chance to play in the title game, just like Richt didn't have a chance to, since they were both outside the top 2 when the conference title games were over.
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That 2002 UGA team went 13-1 and probably would’ve played Miami in the CFP semifinal. I’m not sure they would’ve beaten them, but I do think they would’ve beaten OSU. I know how that sounds, but i think that Craig Krenzel led Buckeye team was a fluke.

All that said, if Clausen plays in Athens I think we could’ve and maybe would’ve won that game. At least he said as much. Haha.
 
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#105
#105
RDU VOL#14 said:
That 2002 UGA team went 13-1 and probably would’ve played Miami in the CFP semifinal. I’m not sure they would’ve beaten them, but I do think they would’ve beaten OSU. I know how that sounds, but i think that Craig Krenzel led Buckeye team was a fluke.

All that said, if Clausen plays in Athens I think we could’ve and maybe would’ve won that game. At least he said as much. Haha.
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It would be interesting to see if Richt would have won a title at Georgia if a CFP existed for his tenure. He would have been in a CFP in 2002 and perhaps in 2007 and 2012 (remember, a 12-0 Ohio St team who finished #3 was ineligible that year).

2007 might be a stretch because they had 2 conference losses and didn't even win their division, but they finished the season so strong and there would have been a campaign by the media to get another SEC team in.
 
#106
#106
05_never_again said:
It would be interesting to see if Richt would have won a title at Georgia if a CFP existed for his tenure. He would have been in a CFP in 2002 and perhaps in 2007 and 2012 (remember, a 12-0 Ohio St team who finished #3 was ineligible that year).

2007 might be a stretch because they had 2 conference losses and didn't even win their division, but they finished the season so strong and there would have been a campaign by the media to get another SEC team in.
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Pretty satisfying knowing that we were one of those 2 in 2007. I was at that one. Although it was not nearly as satisfying as being present for the 04 and 06 games.
 
#107
#107
05_never_again said:
It would be interesting to see if Richt would have won a title at Georgia if a CFP existed for his tenure. He would have been in a CFP in 2002 and perhaps in 2007 and 2012 (remember, a 12-0 Ohio St team who finished #3 was ineligible that year).

2007 might be a stretch because they had 2 conference losses and didn't even win their division, but they finished the season so strong and there would have been a campaign by the media to get another SEC team in.
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It's a decent question. I would say, almost for certain, that they would not have made the CFP in 2012. While they beat Florida, the Gators finished 11-1. 11-2 UGA would have had to leap some combination of Florida (11-1), Oregon (11-1), Big XII champ Kansas St (11-1), and Pac 12 champ Stanford (11-2). That would require hoping that the committee only focused on their close loss in the SECCG and ignored their 4 TD loss to South Carolina.

2007 might have been a different story, as there were no elite teams that year. UGA was playing better football than pretty much everyone by year end.
 
#108
#108
SCBulldog said:
Not after the first 4 years I don’t believe. Since Pruitt is 13-12 and Butch was 12-13 after 2 years, does that make them the same? I see Pruitt building a much stronger team just like Kirby seems to be building a stronger program than Richt. Right was a terrific coach who had some great years followed by some average years which led to his firing.
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Fair points.
 
#110
#110
bamawriter said:
It's a decent question. I would say, almost for certain, that they would not have made the CFP in 2012. While they beat Florida, the Gators finished 11-1. 11-2 UGA would have had to leap some combination of Florida (11-1), Oregon (11-1), Big XII champ Kansas St (11-1), and Pac 12 champ Stanford (11-2). That would require hoping that the committee only focused on their close loss in the SECCG and ignored their 4 TD loss to South Carolina.

2007 might have been a different story, as there were no elite teams that year. UGA was playing better football than pretty much everyone by year end.
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That's the problem with Georgia...when they are kept out, it usually isn't just one loss that keeps them out. There's a loss that you can consider a good loss plus another that's a head-scratcher. They kind of remove themselves from further debate with the additional loss.

A loss to South Carolina hurt them not only in 2012 but also in 2007. Georgia lost to Tennessee, which looked OK since Tennessee won the East that year, but they also lost early to a South Carolina team that finished 6-6. In 2004, there was no shame in losing at #3 Auburn, but they also lost to Tennessee at home as a big favorite earlier in the season, which kept them out of the SECCG.
 
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#111
#111
05_never_again said:
That's the problem with Georgia...when they are kept out, it usually isn't just one loss that keeps them out. There's a loss that you can consider a good loss plus another that's a head-scratcher. They kind of remove themselves from further debate with the additional loss.

A loss to South Carolina hurt them not only in 2012 but also in 2007. Georgia lost to Tennessee, which looked OK since Tennessee won the East that year, but they also lost early to a South Carolina team that finished 6-6. In 2004, there was no shame in losing at #3 Auburn, but they also lost to Tennessee at home as a big favorite earlier in the season, which kept them out of the SECCG.
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Also pretty much the case with 2014.
 
#112
#112
TrueOrange said:
Also pretty much the case with 2014.
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They also had losses to Florida and Georgia Tech that year, so they would have been removed from the discussion anyway even if they beat South Carolina. In 2007 and especially 2012, they absolutely would have at least been in discussion for a CFP berth simply if they hadn't lost that one game to South Carolina.

You can argue that losses to South Carolina are ultimately what did Richt in. He always struggled against Florida, but he went 2-3 against South Carolina his last 5 years against Georgia.
 
#115
#115
bamawriter said:
Not true. While 2019 was worse, 2017 was awful for injuries. Of the 8 linebackers on the 2-deep, only one was available for all 14 games, and he started the year as a backup.



That's the big question. I can't imagine that Cochran's workouts suddenly changed over the last 3 or 4 years, so it's fairly tough to defend the argument that he had any impact on the raft of injuries. But something got much, much worse, even if that something was pure luck.
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Butch Jones was fired in 17 and brought on staff before your last game(s).
Doesnt cover all the injuries, but UTs injury bug has gotten way better in that time and Bamas way worse.
Enough causation for a Vol fan.
 
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#116
#116
Vol_from_86 said:
Maybe he knows Saban is nearing the end and wants to hitch his wagon to his old pal Kirby to preserve his own career?
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He is the best S&C coach in the nation. He doesn't need to "preserve his own career". If he stayed at Alabama, the day Saban retired Cochran could choose his S&C job and get hired.
 
#117
#117
miket4god said:
He is the best S&C coach in the nation. He doesn't need to "preserve his own career". If he stayed at Alabama, the day Saban retired Cochran could choose his S&C job and get hired.
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Part of a person preserving their career is developing opportunities that interest them and taking advantage of opportunities that place them on the path to their desired destination. It's entirely possible that Georgia is the only place, other than Alabama, that he'd like to work.

Assuming someone is going to bend over backwards, modify their program and terminate employees regardless of how well players are being developed, just to create a spot for him whenever he wants, would be extremely arrogant and foolish. I don't care how good someone is at their job... the second that person starts thinking things are going to be given to them is the second that person begins to fail. Nobody stays on top forever and nobody gets to choose whatever job they want, whenever they want it.
 
#119
#119
I'm curious to see what his salary will be at Georgia. I'm pretty cynical about stuff like this, especially when you're talking jobs in big time college football, and part of me wonders if this is about money, and the whole "I wanted a career change" is an after-the-fact reasoning that Cochran has come up with.

Cochran made $595k as S&C coach at Alabama last year, which seems extremely high for a off-field coach but he actually wasn't the highest paid S&C guy in the country. Was top 5. I wonder if Cochran demanded to be paid like a top-end coordinator, like something close to $1m, and Saban balked. He and everybody else knows how valuable he was to their program, and I wonder if he demanded he be paid like one of their top assistant coaches.

I bet he'll make at least $750k in an on-field role at Georgia.
 
#120
#120
05_never_again said:
I'm curious to see what his salary will be at Georgia. I'm pretty cynical about stuff like this, especially when you're talking jobs in big time college football, and part of me wonders if this is about money, and the whole "I wanted a career change" is an after-the-fact reasoning that Cochran has come up with.

Cochran made $595k as S&C coach at Alabama last year, which seems extremely high for a off-field coach but he actually wasn't the highest paid S&C guy in the country. Was top 5. I wonder if Cochran demanded to be paid like a top-end coordinator, like something close to $1m, and Saban balked. He and everybody else knows how valuable he was to their program, and I wonder if he demanded he be paid like one of their top assistant coaches.

I bet he'll make at least $750k in an on-field role at Georgia.
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Saban is pretty tight lipped. We will never know from him the true reason Cochran bailed. We will find out after he gets to UGA and settles in if Cochran has the same respect for not spouting off. But, he did not leave with Kirby even though they are tight. So, after what, 4 years now, he takes off and joins Kirby. Whatever it was, there was a disagreement on something strong enough for him to leave Bama. Could be a raise. Could be a desire to change roles. Could be some flack over the increase in injuries, most notably this season. Saban may eventually drop a hint, but I don't see him ever outright saying straight up.

And I'm not one to believe they are heading down. He will continue to develop coaches just as he does players. And he's never truly whiffed on identifying and bringing in on-field coaches.
 
#122
#122
Remy said:
Frankly I do not blame Saban for handling it that way. Once an individual accepts a position with another school lock them out of the facilities. If they're such good friends, call or text each other, but do it on your own dime and at a place other than the school who used to pay you.
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Yes... especially when the individual had built a reputation as being a champion of life. This individual has a 5-star heart and was as concerned with individuals getting leadership reps as he was reps on the bench press. Cochran is an individual who knows the value of being ready vs the value of being prepared. Even when the Tide was blown out by Clemson in the 2018 NCG, they did all the things it takes to play winning football except score touchdowns. With this individual's help, Kirby Smart believes that Kirby Smart will build a like dynasty at UGA, brick by brick.
 
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#123
#123
GVF said:
Saban is pretty tight lipped. We will never know from him the true reason Cochran bailed. We will find out after he gets to UGA and settles in if Cochran has the same respect for not spouting off. But, he did not leave with Kirby even though they are tight. So, after what, 4 years now, he takes off and joins Kirby. Whatever it was, there was a disagreement on something strong enough for him to leave Bama. Could be a raise. Could be a desire to change roles. Could be some flack over the increase in injuries, most notably this season. Saban may eventually drop a hint, but I don't see him ever outright saying straight up.

And I'm not one to believe they are heading down. He will continue to develop coaches just as he does players. And he's never truly whiffed on identifying and bringing in on-field coaches.
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According to SI, Cochran didn't leave with Kirby because he wasn't vested in the Alabama state retirement system yet, which takes 10 years. Again, money seeming to be the primary factor.

IMO, "desire to change roles" is something he kind of came up with after he found out he wasn't going to get the raise he wanted. So he's changing roles to get the pay he wants. Cochran makes close to $600k as a S&C coach; he's definitely the most well-known and one of the best in the game. Not many college S&C coaches are in TV commercials alongside the head coach, for example. I bet you he wanted to be paid like a top of the line offensive or defensive coordinator; he thinks he's been that important to the program's success, and he probably isn't wrong. Saban probably balked at that proposition, not wanting to pay that kind of money for an off-field coach, and so Cochran left. Just my two cents, total speculation though. Alabama certainly has enough money to pay that guy whatever he wants, so perhaps he does legitimately want to try his hand at on-field coaching and that's the primary motivation.

Reports: Scott Cochran Leaving Alabama for Georgia
 
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#125
#125
Vol_from_86 said:
Part of a person preserving their career is developing opportunities that interest them and taking advantage of opportunities that place them on the path to their desired destination. It's entirely possible that Georgia is the only place, other than Alabama, that he'd like to work.

Assuming someone is going to bend over backwards, modify their program and terminate employees regardless of how well players are being developed, just to create a spot for him whenever he wants, would be extremely arrogant and foolish. I don't care how good someone is at their job... the second that person starts thinking things are going to be given to them is the second that person begins to fail. Nobody stays on top forever and nobody gets to choose whatever job they want, whenever they want it.
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That's fair. I implied, and believe, that he could get a job as soon as he wants after Alabama, but you are right it might not THE job he most wants.
 
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