Scrimmage vs. Georgia Tech on October 28

#51
#51
bleedingTNorange said:
Well I know when I go I don't spend a dime on drinks, and I know a whole lot of people that are that way. That's why I'm saying average, you're saying every person is getting a drink and candy at $5 a head, that's not even close. Id say half the crowd purchases from the concession, so $1-$2 is pretty realistic.

Also, pretty sure students don't pay, so that part of the attendance is free.
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Agreed on concessions.
 
#53
#53
BruinVol said:
I think its a minimum of 100k. 12$ is what I was just told the season ticket holders paid last year. He wasn't certain of that when I ask a buddy of mine that has them.
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100k is reasonable, I thought a bit less, but I said 50-75k so it's ball park. Still true to my argument though, we dropped $42 MILLION FRIGGIN DOLLARS on a .500 football teams to give them a better chance to be succesful. I don't think losing 75-100k for the chance to make yourself a better team is that big of a deal.

How much do you think this Italy trip just cost the university?
 
#55
#55
Once again, I'm not saying that this scrimmage is the difference in us being sweet 16 or elite 8. However, as you all have conceded, it is better for the team, and thus giving them a chance to be a better team.

Athletic departments pay a heck of a lot more than 50-75k to, give their program a chance to be better.
 
#56
#56
bleedingTNorange said:
100k is reasonable, I thought a bit less, but I said 50-75k so it's ball park. Still true to my argument though, we dropped $42 MILLION FRIGGIN DOLLARS on a .500 football teams to give them a better chance to be succesful. I don't think losing 75-100k for the chance to make yourself a better team is that big of a deal.

How much do you think this Italy trip just cost the university?
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This debate is simple to me. If you care about basketball and football only 100k isnt worth missing any opportunity to possibly get better as a team. If you have the entire ad in mind It matters. Me personally I only care about football and basketball but if I was the AD it would be my job to make sure these games are played.
 
#57
#57
bleedingTNorange said:
Well I know when I go I don't spend a dime on drinks, and I know a whole lot of people that are that way. That's why I'm saying average, you're saying every person is getting a drink and candy at $5 a head, that's not even close. Id say half the crowd purchases from the concession, so $1-$2 is pretty realistic.

Also, pretty sure students don't pay, so that part of the attendance is free.
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Students don't pay. They pay an activities fee in their tuition though which more than covers the cost of that seat, as all students pay it (25,000+) and UT only reserves ~3,000 seats for students at TBA.

RE: concessions, for every person that doesn't spend a thing, there are the people who spend $15 or more, so honestly, it likely falls somewhere between both our numbers, which is still a significant increase in your estimate.

I like Bruin's point about funding a non-revenue sport for an entire year through the profits. That's a good point, and for a financially sound individual like Hamilton, it was probably sound reasoning for playing the game.
 
#58
#58
BruinVol said:
This debate is simple to me. If you care about basketball and football only 100k isnt worth missing any opportunity to possibly get better as a team. If you have the entire ad in mind It matters. Me personally I only care about football and basketball but if I was the AD it would be my job to make sure these games are played.
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Yes
 
#59
#59
BruinVol said:
This debate is simple to me. If you care about basketball and football only 100k isnt worth missing any opportunity to possibly get better as a team. If you have the entire ad in mind It matters. Me personally I only care about football and basketball but if I was the AD it would be my job to make sure these games are played.
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Football and basketball make you money, lots of those others actually lose you money. My priority would be making sure those 2 teams had every resource to be as good as theybpossibly can be.

Once again though, how much do you think the university just spent on the Italy trip? $1 million?
 
#60
#60
cncchris33 said:
Students don't pay. They pay an activities fee in their tuition though which more than covers the cost of that seat, as all students pay it (25,000+) and UT only reserves ~3,000 seats for students at TBA.

RE: concessions, for every person that doesn't spend a thing, there are the people who spend $15 or more, so honestly, it likely falls somewhere between both our numbers, which is still a significant increase in your estimate.

I like Bruin's point about funding a non-revenue sport for an entire year through the profits. That's a good point, and for a financially sound individual like Hamilton, it was probably sound reasoning for playing the game.
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You think HALF of people in TBA spend $15 ON THEMSELVES in concession? Are you serious?

And in regards to the last part about funding...if it was an issue don't you think we'd have just schedule another game? We only have a 30 game schedule, it's usually 31 or 32. You could schedule a decent mid major and make a heck of a lot more money off that game than you would playing CN in an exhibition. Money isn't an issue here guys.
 
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#61
#61
bleedingTNorange said:
Football and basketball make you money, lots of those others actually lose you money. My priority would be making sure those 2 teams had every resource to be as good as theybpossibly can be.

Once again though, how much do you think the university just spent on the Italy trip? $1 million?
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I know a few years back stallings paid a big chuck of the trip for Vandy to go but I don't have a great guess. 1mil sounds very high though.
 
#62
#62
BruinVol said:
I know a few years back stallings paid a big chuck of the trip for Vandy to go but I don't have a great guess. 1mil sounds very high though.
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Well I figured tickets for a flight are what 5k round trip, multiplied by 50? That's 250k right there. 7 nights in a hotel? 25 rooms, 100 a night, 7 nights...plus 3 meals a day for 50 people, bus all week, I'm sure we pay the Italian teams, plus admission to these attractions...I think atleast a million.

And for what? It's not about Italy, let's be honest, these kids aren't in history class for a reason. It's for the extra practices, the scrimmages and the bonding...all things to give your school a chance to be more succesful...at a cost of around $1 million.
 
#65
#65
cncchris33 said:
You know good and well that's not what I meant. Good grief.
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I was hoping not, but that's exactly what you said. Yes you have families of 4 that spend that, but that becomes $4 a head. You also have a family of 4 that spends 0, so now average and it's $2. And like I said, I dont believe you have as many doing that,l most just get drinks. 1-2 bucks a head is the max.
 
#66
#66
BruinVol said:
Here's my guess on Italy.

30 people in the travel party at 15k per person.

450k.
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Stallings paid 100k for Australia not sure how it was only that, maybe he funded part, or maybe it was just him and the team.

I figured the party was close to 50, so my number would be off. 15 players, 8 coaches? Say each coach has 3 in their family, now you're at 40. Satkowiak went, and some other university athletic people. I'm thinking atleast 50.

Also, a class went and the professor. Now they may have had to fund their own way, but then again, maybe not. If they didn't have to the party was probably closer to 75k.

Point still remains, minimum 500k trip, for what? To give the team a chance to be better.
 
#67
#67
bleedingTNorange said:
I was hoping not, but that's exactly what you said. Yes you have families of 4 that spend that, but that becomes $4 a head. You also have a family of 4 that spends 0, so now average and it's $2. And like I said, I dont believe you have as many doing that,l most just get drinks. 1-2 bucks a head is the max.
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I would encourage you to look a little deeper and not take everything at face value.

My point was you have families that spend nothing, you have families that spend $20, and you have some that spend $100. Unless either of us work for Sodexo or UT , this is pointless, other than to say that there is money to be made at the exhibition games. No one seems to dIspute that. Disagree if you want about the importance of 75k-150k for the athletic department.
 
#68
#68
bleedingTNorange said:
Stallings paid 100k for Australia not sure how it was only that, maybe he funded part, or maybe it was just him and the team.

I figured the party was close to 50, so my number would be off. 15 players, 8 coaches? Say each coach has 3 in their family, now you're at 40. Satkowiak went, and some other university athletic people. I'm thinking atleast 50.

Also, a class went and the professor. Now they may have had to fund their own way, but then again, maybe not. If they didn't have to the party was probably closer to 75k.

Point still remains, minimum 500k trip, for what? To give the team a chance to be better.
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I know your point an agree with it. Keep in mind these trips are uually funded with private fundraising. Like said before I could care less if any sport other than hoops and football had any money to operate with so spend away a far as I am concerned.
 
#69
#69
cncchris33 said:
I would encourage you to look a little deeper and not take everything at face value.

My point was you have families that spend nothing, you have families that spend $20, and you have some that spend $100. Unless either of us work for Sodexo or UT , this is pointless, other than to say that there is money to be made at the exhibition games. No one seems to dIspute that. Disagree if you want about the importance of 75k-150k for the athletic department.
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I get it's 75-100k, we agree on that.

My point is 1. We pay 42 million for a .500 football teams new facility, for the opportunity for them to be a better team. 2. We pay close to $1 million for the team to go to Italy. This trip is made primarily for the purpose of bettering your team.

So if those are ok, whys it not ok to pay 50-75k for the chance to better your team by playing Georgia tech instead of a CN?
 
#70
#70
bleedingTNorange said:
I get it's 75-100k, we agree on that.

My point is 1. We pay 42 million for a .500 football teams new facility, for the opportunity for them to be a better team. 2. We pay close to $1 million for the team to go to Italy. This trip is made primarily for the purpose of bettering your team.

So if those are ok, whys it not ok to pay 50-75k for the chance to better your team by playing Georgia tech instead of a CN?
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The only problem with where you are going with this is that you are assuming all this money is coming from one big pot. There is a big difference when you start comparing monies in a general operating budget and monies raised for specific projects.
 
#71
#71
BruinVol said:
The only problem with where you are going with this is that you are assuming all this money is coming from one big pot. There is a big difference when you start comparing monies in a general operating budget and monies raised for specific projects.
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Very true, but if that money wasn't put toward an Italy fund, it could go to another fund. Maybe one to other athletic budgets like you and ccn were saying.

I'm with you, basketball and football all the way, I just don't think what we're losing is much considering its an opportunity to improve. ESPECIALLY considering the amount of money we spend on other things for a chance to better our athletic programs.
 
#72
#72
bleedingTNorange said:
Very true, but if that money wasn't put toward an Italy fund, it could go to another fund. Maybe one to other athletic budgets like you and ccn were saying.

I'm with you, basketball and football all the way, I just don't think what we're losing is much considering its an opportunity to improve. ESPECIALLY considering the amount of money we spend on other things for a chance to better our athletic programs.
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I think where we differ in opinion on this, is its my opinion that you are understating the monetary gain for the athletic department as a whole by playing an exhibition at TBA, and overstating the effect scrImmagIng a better D-1 team would have on bettering our team. Over the course of an entire season, I don't think playing GA Tech makes us nominally better than playIng Carson-Newman. Not enough to make any noticeable difference given all the other potential variables that could affect us positively or negatively. It just seems like such a small difference to me, and certainly not one that should make a drastic difference in the fate of this team. I just see no scenario where we find ourselves looking back and saying that a scrimmage vs an average ACC team was a defining moment in our development.
 
#74
#74
^ and my response to that has been that Italy benefits this team a whole lot more than than the way a scrimmage vs a good ga tech team would? We pay 50-75k for the scrimmage and it's not enough of a competitive gain in your opinion to be worth the money. However, spending about a 20 times that amount to play crap Italian teams, under different rules, different courts, an a completely different format is worth the money?

That's what I'm not getting. If you have an issue with the money lost by the exhibition, then you must have an issue with the ital trip, right? Not saying that's right or wrong, it's an opinion it cant be right or wrong, however I'm just trying to see if that's where you stand.

Me personally, I see a million spent on the Italy trip and think its right in line to spend 75k on a scrimmage with the chance to improve, but that's jmo.
 
#75
#75
bleedingTNorange said:
^ and my response to that has been that Italy benefits this team a whole lot more than than the way a scrimmage vs a good ga tech team would? We pay 50-75k for the scrimmage and it's not enough of a competitive gain in your opinion to be worth the money. However, spending about a 20 times that amount to play crap Italian teams, under different rules, different courts, an a completely different format is worth the money?

That's what I'm not getting. If you have an issue with the money lost by the exhibition, then you must have an issue with the ital trip, right? Not saying that's right or wrong, it's an opinion it cant be right or wrong, however I'm just trying to see if that's where you stand.

Me personally, I see a million spent on the Italy trip and think its right in line to spend 75k on a scrimmage with the chance to improve, but that's jmo.
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The Italy trip gains you 10 extra practices which is extremely valuable. The team we played yesterday beat a very decent Georgia team, and it could be argued that UGA is better than GA Tech. I'm not sure of the competitive nature of the remaining teams on our Italy trip, but faced at least one team that has proven it can hang with mid-level SEC caliber teams.

This trip is as much about exposure and cultural experience for a team of young men as it is about basketball. JMO.

Lastly, I don't have a problem with the money lost. I don't have an opinion either way. It's not my bottom line, and I doubt we gain an exponential amount by playing a mediocre team in a scrimmage that means nothing. So, again, I'm indifferent to the decision. I was simply pointing out that the decision to not go this route before was more than likely a financial one because Hamilton was a financial-minded AD.
 
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